Why Vaping Might Fail... (Manufacturers, Distributors please note)

[Krisb]

I just looked on all my batteries, my PT, all my chargers, and a few cartos, and absolutely nothing has a make or model number on it to identify what model/style it is or is for. So if you have some equipment, and ordered something that you thought would work but didn't, how do you know what kind of adapter you need? How do you know where to find an adapter? How are you supposed to know anyone makes adapters?

For people who "got into" vaping or found a forum like this, it seems like a no-brainer, but for an average joe-blow, it's all an impossible mess.

Where did you buy it? If you know the name of it, most likely someone here knows what threading it has. If you remember where bought it, ask them or call the company, sure the name was on the box. Or, you could always post a pic here and someone will probably know by the pic.

And, always a good idea to keep receipts.



*Droid

 

[Justice]

Yep kinda confusing at first. When I first started out I bought one of those elcheapo two piece cartos that were useless like t*ts on a bull. Then I had to spend a few more dollars and buy something more which I'm quite happy with. Even got some nasty tasting juice and juice flavoring today oh well.it's kinda like my first car was a pinto Now I have a late model dodge truck. I havnt had a smoke in a month now actually had to kick my kid brother out of my house today with his analog.yes I thot it was going to be real simple and for a while it wasn't but that's what life is all about. Start at the bottom work our way up all the while learning as we go. If we are no longer moving forward we are going backwards. One more thing I will say. I am a recovered drug addict I had gone thru treatment several times but always relapsed. I relapsed because I wasn't willing to do the work to stay clean. If I want to stay analog free I will do the work. Sometimes the good things in life take some effort

 

[spaky]

I haven't looked too hard, there may be, but I haven't seen a thread where a machinist or at least a good mechanic has actually broken down what the differences are between the types of connections between different batteries and attys I am sure its mostly a matter of screw pitch and diameter. I do know there are adapters available and I have seen RCA connectors made to fit different types of connections. But I would like to know what the differences are. If there is more than just the threads that are different I think that should be pointed out, maybe that would make identifying different compatible parts easier to recognize.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/modders-forum/30256-taps-dies-901-801-510-4xx.html

 

[FantWriter]

I haven't looked too hard, there may be, but I haven't seen a thread where a machinist or at least a good mechanic has actually broken down what the differences are between the types of connections between different batteries and attys I am sure its mostly a matter of screw pitch and diameter. I do know there are adapters available and I have seen RCA connectors made to fit different types of connections. But I would like to know what the differences are. If there is more than just the threads that are different I think that should be pointed out, maybe that would make identifying different compatible parts easier to recognize.

I was a machinst, also an engineer, and am an advisor on new tech trends for industry.

There is a need for different threads when there is a difference in battery or atomizer/carto size. The threads for a small diameter analog look-alike are quite unsuitable for a heavy battery or a carto with a horizontal coil. You'd wind up with an hourglass shape -- necking down to the connector and flaring back up for the atty, and it will always be a weak point.

Beyond that, different threads were chosen so parts from one manufacturer would not be compatible with the parts from another. If a company sold you a battery, they wanted to make sure you'd have to go to them for the charger, cartos, etc. Even when the threads are the same, manufacturers will sometimes change other things so you have to buy their aftermarket supplies. (An example of this is the air passage (the "indented line" on the center stud). By changing whether it is on the battery or on the atty, the manufacturer is limiting the consumer's options.)

An excellent reason for having different threads is that some chargers have a positive center pole and others have a negative center pole. Not being able to screw in a battery with opposite polarity would be a considerable safety advantage. Unfortunately, this is an option the manufacturers skipped -- I don't remember offhand which model it is, but there's one which is of one polarity in one brand and opposite in another brand that has the same threads and can use the same atty. This difference guarantees that either the battery or the charger will be destroyed if the equipment is not all of the same brand.

The other major concern on threads is what the manufacturer has available. Using a different thread on a completely new model can be quite expensive as far as tooling/mach-op/inventory and other costs, and to many Chinese manufacturers, even the slightest amount of money outweighs user/engineering/style/design/safety concerns.

 

[FantWriter]

Where did you buy it? If you know the name of it, most likely someone here knows what threading it has. If you remember where bought it, ask them or call the company, sure the name was on the box. Or, you could always post a pic here and someone will probably know by the pic.

I was giving that as an example of the problems a casual new user faces (I use only auto Kr808D-1). It did remind me to look at the box from my original kit, and it doesn't have any sort of model identification.

 

[Krisb]

Not that I dispute what you say exactly, but I primarily use 510 threads and I used at least a dozen different vendors and brands. ALL my 510 stuff is compatible with another, I've switched pv's a few times staying with the 510 thread and all my attys/cartos work just fine. Also, bought a few 801 things and one 510-801 adapter and now I can use all my 801 stuff on any of my 510 pv's. Just not that complicated. The first few days were difficult until I got the basic lingo down, after that, easy.

*Droid

 

[Krisb]

But if you really were unsure, you could go back to the website, look it up and get the info you didn't know enough to look for in the first place. Thats what I did.

But, I agree, the shipping stuff (box) should have more id info on them.

*Droid

 

[Autumn]

*Sigh*

In response to the OP: After all I have been through with the standard and HP 801 models, and after the 300 dollars or so that I have spent on accessories since the beginning of FEBRUARY (not to mention the trial and error involved), I can empathize with those who want to give it up.

For relatively heavy analog smokers, I would recommend nothing less than a higher-voltage model with lots of readily available, interchangeable parts.

I am personally in the process of switching over to the Prodigy, the cost of which does not include the above mentioned sum that I have spent so far.

I hope that'll do it.

 

[base234]

BTW: This guy points out that he did NOT save any money. He figures it ended up costing him more (even though he smoked less if and when he had a working vaporizer).
So that is bad imo.

If someone you know wants to save money, he's right, at least at first, he will NOT save money. The initial investment and the learning curve is steep. Vaping instead of smoking is a pain in the .... Is it worth it? It depends on how motivated he is to stop smoking. The money spent and the learning curve weeds out the weak ones.

 

[Rosa]

...but if you try to enter the world of e-cigs and never find ECF I can see how it could become extremely confusing. If I hadn't found ECF, I'd probably have bought that e-cig that I saw at 7-11... would have quickly realized I would go broke replacing the tiny little carts that come with it and given up.

 

[billo]

Reminds me of the first time I ordered juice.

They asked if I wanted PG or VG.

How the heck do I know ? What is that ? I just guessed and ordered one of them.

And it gets a lot more complicated than that with the equipment ......

 

[HarmonyPB]

I agree with most of the opinions, you have to want it to work. I'm embarassed to admit that my husband and I dropped over $800 at the mall with the starter kit and a couple boxes of cartos. Don't get me wrong, we are in NO way rich nor do we normally spend $800 on ANYTHING! But this is something we wanted to try to get away from cigarettes. My husband quit vaping after 2 months and I was angry at him for giving up so easily. I stuck with it, did research, bought the correct replacement cartos so I could fill them myself and some juices that tasted good (starting with 5 and 6ml bottles instead of going all out on 100ml of something I have no idea how it tastes). Now, I have hit my fair share of bumps along this road and even went back to cigarettes at one point, but I decided I wanted to start vaping again and 1 hour ago I completed my first cigarette-free day in 4 months I will say that it's easier to smoke cigarettes than vape. But I definitely prefer vaping for many reasons. Make a decision and stick to it, just like almost everything else in life.

 

[popeye79]

I'm not reading the whole thread.. just OP.

I HAVE ABSOLUTLY NO PITTY FOR YOUR FRIEND OR ANYONE LIKE HIM.

When ever making a major purchase, you should research what you're purchasing. Car stereo? Flat screen tv? Work out machine? Computer? Cell phone? And yes.. e-cigs.

Infact, I'd say it's even more important to research e-cigs before buying, than any of those other products.. this is something you're putting in your body, and something thats supposed to help you beat an additction.

If it's that important.. DO SOME RESEARCH!

Sure, I bought a piece-o-crap throw away from 7-eleven. So then I did a LOT of research, before buying both a bloog max fusion and a Janty eGo Tank system. And I couldn't be happier with either one.

 

[ElProximo]

This Post>

I was a machinst, also an engineer, and am an advisor on new tech trends for industry.

There is a need for different threads when there is a difference in battery or atomizer/carto size. The threads for a small diameter analog look-alike are quite unsuitable for a heavy battery or a carto with a horizontal coil. You'd wind up with an hourglass shape -- necking down to the connector and flaring back up for the atty, and it will always be a weak point.

Beyond that, different threads were chosen so parts from one manufacturer would not be compatible with the parts from another. If a company sold you a battery, they wanted to make sure you'd have to go to them for the charger, cartos, etc. Even when the threads are the same, manufacturers will sometimes change other things so you have to buy their aftermarket supplies. (An example of this is the air passage (the "indented line" on the center stud). By changing whether it is on the battery or on the atty, the manufacturer is limiting the consumer's options.)

An excellent reason for having different threads is that some chargers have a positive center pole and others have a negative center pole. Not being able to screw in a battery with opposite polarity would be a considerable safety advantage. Unfortunately, this is an option the manufacturers skipped -- I don't remember offhand which model it is, but there's one which is of one polarity in one brand and opposite in another brand that has the same threads and can use the same atty. This difference guarantees that either the battery or the charger will be destroyed if the equipment is not all of the same brand.

The other major concern on threads is what the manufacturer has available. Using a different thread on a completely new model can be quite expensive as far as tooling/mach-op/inventory and other costs, and to many Chinese manufacturers, even the slightest amount of money outweighs user/engineering/style/design/safety concerns.

I was also working in technology and hardware for a while and I could probably write a long list of products that most deliberately manufacture vendor-specific parts for the only reason in that you have to buy their accessories and parts. Even more frustrating is that this goes on from their own models too.
They don't really want the 202 adapter from the 202 to fit your 203. They figured out they sell more 203 adapters.

*btw.. Im sure a Mac-PC analogy or comparison could get used in this somehow hehe*

One thing you mentioned I'm also 'all too familiar' with is the Chinese habit of pure short-term grabs and to hell with any long-term anything.
Interesting, I have an Atomizer from China which... to the best of my knowledge *should* work perfectly safe and secure with a certain battery. Why are the threads just slightly different?
Maybe I'm wrong, I don't know enough about that whole polarity/electricity business but it really really does seem to be for no other reason than to fit their (and only their) version of the Ego.
I could be wrong but still that 'principle' is notorious with a lot of manufacturers.

Now one thing I would say is that this is where the consumer can work demand and change things. Lately my question is simply: Does this fit/work/screw into my regular Joye Ego?
No?
No sale. Not interested. Maybe in one year. Otherwise no. I'm not replacing this yet or buying new chargers yet or new batteries etc. Not every 3 months sorry.

But again we are all the 'Keeners'. The forum is (by its nature) full of the 'insiders' and techxperts and hobbyists. A sort of exclusive group.
Its easy for me to say "Well.. how hard is it to simply spend 3 hours online, research the 901s and Kr808d and obviously the tech specs will tell you what Ohm and what AttyCardoCartyJuicePear.003mm Fits the BattyXLlowRezEGO-Tc and simply join a forum and ask someone to recommend which Customs Friendly Distry ships ScrewdriverDrips or USBpassthroughs for Superminis? Obviously this doesn't take effort
but,
80% of the general population won't. They have complicated taxes, jobs, families, insurance forms, PVRs to program and 3 hobby's already.
They won't. Its not good for me to say "Then too bad for them!" because the fact is I WANT them to switch to Vaping and I want them buying masses of e-cigs and I want them on-board for political sway. It helps me if they do.

Anyways.. rant rant heh. Huge thanks for the awesome responses and discussion. I really feel this is a critical issue in many ways.

 

[TwistedInFresno]

I gotta agree. My mail-order, off the internet 1st was too expensive, and didn't give me a choice of flavors...so it collected dust in a box. Then I found a pen style (801) in a local store, but again, couldn't get menthol...so it collected dust. Then somebody told me about the cheapies at 7/11! Menthol, my choice of nicotine strength, and $20 for the kit!!! If nothing else was ever available to me, I'd stick with the XHaleo2. As it is, I am an addictive, geeky person, who found ecf...lol. So I ordered a diy kit from diyflavorshack, and a Riva from Liberty. I ordered a 510 to 801 adapter and a 801 to 510 adapter, so hopefully, all my parts will be useful! But- If I hadn't found ecf, I would've been happy with the XHaleo2! It's a decent product, at a great price, and I reeeaaaallllyyy want to quit smoking!

 

[Suicidebob]

Having a similar issue with my step father who has smoked forever. I would love him to get into this, but I don't think he would simply just give up smoking for a "gadget-thingy-ma-bob". He's in his mid 60's and can barely turn on the TV.

It'd be nice to get him started; however I feel it would be a disaster and he'd probably end up wasting his money.

 

[pkj]

I am not reading the entire thread either, just the OP. Each person must take responsibility for their own decision. If they decide to vape, they have the responsibility to do a little research. And it does not take much research before one is able to determine the good, the bad, and the ugly. There are numerous vaping forums, chat rooms, you tube videos, facebook pages available, to say nothing of friends, family, co-workers or even complete strangers that are vaping. In short. Info is there if you are willing to take 1 hour to do a little research.

Yes there are choices in equipment, juices and suppliers. It doesn't matter if you are purchasing a car, a bed, roast beef or e-cigs...choices are good.

Yes technology changes. Yes some things become cheaper and some things become more expensive. I paid a small fortune for my first Polaroid camera. I paid a lot less for my first car than I paid for my most recent car. Technology changes and prices change, that is a given.

I met a lady yesterday at a vaping meet up in Phoenix. She does not like or use the computer much. She connected with someone who vapes, came to the meet up, received a ton of information and purchased an eGo Tank system from a local supplier. Why is this important? Because it was important to her and she took the initiative to get information.

I'm sorry the friend you wrote about did not take some of that same initiative before they laid out a bunch of money for something they were not familiar with. A little education goes a long way in just about everything we purchase. I hope the friend you wrote about is doing ok. I encourage them to come here for support and information. If not here, perhaps they will check out another vaping / e-cig forum or befriend a vaper.

Respectfully,
Paula

 

[Ceegary]

I do sympathize with how confusing it can be. I'm just starting out, bought a disposable last week to test and decided I'd give this my all, it's do-able. I thought I'd pop onto the net, find a reputable dealer, call them up and ask them for the best system, that tastes just like tobacco, with the longest battery life, easiest and longest juice refill with the best warranty and lowest price. Now I know you can never get all the things, good, fast & cheap..pick two right, but I'd make my decision from there. Then I started reading, hoo boy.

Luckily, I found this board and I'm obsessive enough to go through all this confusing info and decide what I wanted. Strangely enough, I didn't buy standard stuff, it's great if it all fits together but that in itself means that it's not working as you want. I read multitudes of reviews and opinions and bought what I think will make me happy. I landed up buying a box mod at a great price to use as back-up and for testing the many juices I have coming and a go-go for my primary pv, for no fuss vaping.I don't care if it doesn't fit anything else, I only care that it fits me and I can get what I need for it.

Now maybe I was wrong, have to backtrack and buy a regular 501, Riva, Ego or whatever and I've already spent over $200 on multitudes of juice, spares, accessories etc and haven't even started vaping yet. But like I said I'm obsessive enough to deal with all this, I allow myself to make rookie mistakes and more importantly, motivated enough to substitute my smoking habit for vaping because otherwise I have to give up totally, and I'm obviously not that accomplished at that though I've done it a number of times. Or keep smoking and face the health consequences.

So what if it even costs me more money, so what if I have to spend lots of energy researching. I'm really grateful for all the info here that allows me to do it. I'm grateful for all folks who've designed mods, some of which I'll try, for the manufacturers who supply us with alternatives and the multitudes of juices to allow us to find our preferences.

The beauty of capitalism is the strong products will win out. Lots of car companies have propriety parts, that doesn't hurt them, making cars that nobody wants does. The industry will mature and in a few years most of us could be using gear that we haven't even heard of at a lower price than anything we buy today. But I'm not willing to wait that long. "It is what it is", now the only question we each face... what do we want to do?

Gary

Gary

 

[headsontwentys]

i can relate to most of what has been said in this thread. i too bought a pos kit from a local tobacconist. it was cool for about a week. i didnt give up on the idea of vaping. youtube is what directed me to make a more informed decision about what model to buy. now i am stuck with a problem. my father wants to start vaping/quit smoking and wants me to "just get me the best one". great. im spending my own money buying all these different cartos, attys, tank style carts, and liquids trying to find the "sweet spot" so all he has to do is pull a battery off a charger put it together and vape all day. he wants to quit and i really want him to quit, but this is a pain in the ....

 

[ElProximo]

I encourage them to come here for support and information. If not here, perhaps they will check out another vaping / e-cig forum or befriend a vaper.

I have been trying to sell them on the idea of a Joye Ego. I know it might sound like I'm promoting them but honestly I just figure at this time that is the most 'Standard' but sufficient starter kit with the most easily available cheapest parts and accessories and at least we could trade/loan each other extra parts or whatnot.

Really funny thing but I had a long-time lady friend on the Facebook chat a few nights ago. Long-time smoker too. She asked if I quit. I mentioned vaping. She took a look at one website and wrote back something like "why wouldn't you just quit nicotine entirely instead of being a slave to all that.. whatever that is". I had to laugh out loud when she said that. It turns out she did quit nicotine 'cold turkey' but I explained I'm a nerd and actually LIKE ordering vaping 'toys' hehe.

But I didn't just want to aim this at the 'smoking versus vaping' sort of thing either. Smokers or non-smokers or 'only-vapers' and I think its still significant overall.