would it be the same to mix everything separate, then combine to see what works?

[Zach904]

This is my second go at DIY, and I have a lot more to work with. I was just about to make three different variations of a fire & ice recipe for a friend, and I just thought of something I have not really seen suggested anywhere on here...

I was going to mix 3 5ml batches..

TFA cinnamon red hot 8%
Menthol 4%
and
TFA cinnamon red hot 8%
Koolada 4%
and
TFA cinnamon red hot 8%
Menthol 4%
Koolada 4%

My question is, what if I were to just make 10ml batches of 10% cinnamon, koolada and menthol, each with my target 10mg/ml nicotine ratio, then adjust the math appropriately as I mix each batch? That way it would be easier to correct anything along the way. Or am I confusing myself in thinking it could be simple instead of guessing what a correct mixture might be? Im starting to get confused as to how I would figure out the math now lol grrr... I bought the flavors from wizard lab, so I only have I think 8ml per vial to experiment with.. Im hoping to find a suitable mix before I run out of flavor.

 

[Hoosier]

It's pretty common for me to get single flavoring mixes kinda' close and then start combining those to find what works. Then reverse engineer the actual recipe.

I don't know about a 10% menthol recipe though, that's pretty scary...

 

[Zach904]

Right, I didn't think about that lol. 5% menthol is more of what I have seen..
So how would the math work? Say I mixed 10ml batches of 5% menthol, 10% cinnamon and 5% koolada

and I found the perfect mix to be 3ml cinnamon, 1.5ml menthol and .5ml koolada

How would I compute that into a calculator for a new permanent recipe, extracting all 3 ingredients in its pure from from the original vials?

 

[DeadbeatJeff]

Just do the math

3ml(10%) = 0.3ml Cinnamon
1.5ml(5%) = 0.075ml Menthol
0.5ml(5%) = 0.025ml Koolada​

and then multiply that by a constant to get a usable number; let's use 40 [40 = 1.0/0.025], so that the Koolada (the smallest quantity) will come out to 1ml

0.3ml(40) = 12ml Cinnamon
0.075ml(40) = 3.0ml Menthol
0.025ml(40) = 1.0ml Koolada
------------------------------
16ml total​

if you wanted to fashion this for say 1/2oz (i.e. lose 1ml from the total), just run a ratio

e.g., for the koolada:

1.0ml : 16ml | ?ml : 15ml
or
1.0/16 = ?/15
15 = ?(16)
15/16 = ?
0.94ml = ?​

and rounding to the nearest tenth of a ml for each, you'd get

11.3ml Cinnamon
2.8ml Menthol
0.9ml Koolada
---------------
15ml total​

 

[RocketPuppy]

Uh

^ what he said

 

[Zach904]

the first example makes sense I think... The constant (40) being the target total ml I want to create?

 

[Zach904]

Nope.. you were just trying to simplify the Koolada amount.. I don't have any issues with measurements.. I don't care what the total amounts of each ingredient is needed. I just need clarification on how to reverse the formula. I need to go to sleep and think about what it is that im asking with a fresh mind lol..

 

[Hoosier]

Well, you know what's in each single flavoring juice.

You know how much of each single flavoring juice is in the combined blend.

If I had 1ml of 10% X that is 0.1ml of X flavoring.
If I also had 1.5ml of 10% Y that is 0.15ml of Y flavoring.
If I also had 2ml of 10% Z that is 0.2ml of Z flavoring.

So I have 4.5ml with 0.1ml X, 0.15ml of Y, and 0.2ml of Z for a total of 0.45ml of flavoring, or 10% total flavoring. You can divide the amounts of XY and Z into the total volume to get the % of each flavor if you like.

I tend to get the ratio of each flavor in the blend and work that way, but that's the way my brain works. It also allows me to alter the ratio of each flavoring or the total flavoring level as individual factors when I'm perfecting a recipe, but that method seems to confuse some mixers.

 

[dannyv45]

My question is, what if I were to just make 10ml batches of 10% cinnamon, koolada and menthol, each with my target 10mg/ml nicotine ratio, then adjust the math appropriately as I mix each batch? That way it would be easier to correct anything along the way.

It's perfectly OK to work that way just keep careful notes on each mix. I've come up with some very nice combinations that way. It may complicate the math a little bit but it's perfectly acceptable.

 

[Zach904]

Thanks for the explanations everyone. I just mixed individual 5ml batches and will be trying different combinations. I hope I have made good percentages for each mix... All flavors are TFA, mixed at 65%PG 35%VG, 10mg/ml nicotine, with 5% saline and were as follows..
Blueberry extra (10%)
Blueberry wild 10%
Strawberry & Cream 10%
Vanilla Cupcake 10%
Brown Sugar 5%
Caramel original 5%
Sweet tart 5%
Sweetener 2%

None of them really changed in color/texture other than strawberries & cream :/
They all give off a smell of the flavor though.

 

[DeadbeatJeff]

Nope.. you were just trying to simplify the Koolada amount.. I don't have any issues with measurements.. I don't care what the total amounts of each ingredient is needed. I just need clarification on how to reverse the formula. I need to go to sleep and think about what it is that im asking with a fresh mind lol..

Well, to simplify it and bring it to a volume that can be measured effectively.

 

[quiter]

I have been doing DIY for a very long time. Since the 510 came out. I like to keep things very simple and I never do anything other than shoot for an proximate MG level. Do yourself a big favor and don't get hung up on formulas and trying to get everything exactly correct or even thinking that it's the only way to do things.

Let's say you want 24mg and you are starting out with 100mg nic base. Well that is pretty simple isn't it? 1 part nic and 3 parts everything else. That would be 25mg Close enough for anyone in my opinion. Lets say you want 36. Well again 33. 3 is close enough. Go with 1 part nic and 2 part everything else. If you want 12mg. 10 is close enough. 1 part nic base and 9 parts everything else.


If you are starting out with 48mg nic base and want 24mg then it's really simple isn't it? 50% nic base 50% everything else. So then you just figure out how much flavoring you want in the final product. Let's say 10% total. Just add 10% of whatever flavoring you want first. 1% menthol 2% cinnamon and 7% koolada. Then add your 50% nic base now you are at 60%. Top it off with your PG/VG (40% more) and you are done.

I do this for all of my mixes and it really is the easiest way to do it. Hope this helps.

 

[dannyv45]

I have been doing DIY for a very long time. Since the 510 came out. I like to keep things very simple and I never do anything other than shoot for an proximate MG level. Do yourself a big favor and don't get hung up on formulas and trying to get everything exactly correct or even thinking that it's the only way to do things.

Let's say you want 24mg and you are starting out with 100mg nic base. Well that is pretty simple isn't it? 1 part nic and 3 parts everything else. That would be 25mg Close enough for anyone in my opinion. Lets say you want 36. Well again 33. 3 is close enough. Go with 1 part nic and 2 part everything else. If you want 12mg. 10 is close enough. 1 part nic base and 9 parts everything else.


If you are starting out with 48mg nic base and want 24mg then it's really simple isn't it? 50% nic base 50% everything else. So then you just figure out how much flavoring you want in the final product. Let's say 10% total. Just add 10% of whatever flavoring you want first. 1% menthol 2% cinnamon and 7% koolada. Then add your 50% nic base now you are at 60%. Top it off with your PG/VG (40% more) and you are done.

I do this for all of my mixes and it really is the easiest way to do it. Hope this helps.

Very good advice. I premake 240mls of my base so I don't have to keep mixing it every time I want to make a batch or do some testing. I figure into the calculation a 10% flavoring buffer and if I use 5% or 15% flavoring I find it don't make much difference in the NIC strength. It's not nessesasary to be so exact. If a mix calls for 1.2ml flavoring and I put in 1.1 or 1.3 it's no big deal. You don't need to get to that finite .000001% accuracy to make a good juice. Some people go to extreams and I find that takes the fun out of it. You don't need a full hazmat suit and have poison control on speed dial or have a lab setup like CSI to make juice. Just use common sense, be creative and have fun with it.