Yet another explosion

[DC2]

That fact that you dont fully understand an electronic device you intend to stick in your mouth would be a big red flag to most.

And yes, these cells have been around and exploding in laptops and flashlights for over a decade.
The information isnt new.

People stick cell phones up against their ears for hours every day.
People put laptops on their genitals for hours every day.

Why doesn't everybody everywhere understand the dangers?
It's a simple question, so what's the answer?

 

[Eskie]

I just got back from a trip and used Amtrak (they have a sorta decent high speed train on the Northeast corridor). Right on my ticket it stated no Samsung note 7s were allowed on any train or Amtrak station. Malfunctioning Li ion batteries, either through manufacturing defect or user error carries inherent risks. This one made the news because of the dramatic video.

And as long as we're on the topic of safety, how many people will be putting lights on dry Xmas trees with old, frayed wires.

Eithier you are seriously uninformed or just spreading false info.
Please show proof.

See @Mazinny 's post above. Sony, a major manufacturer, issued that statement. And it's not the first time Sony has released a letter like that. Just because something is legal to buy does not infer it is safe for use as per your intent, not the manufacturer's intent.

 

[Bad Ninja]

@Bad Ninja Question for you. Would you rather try and do something to educate people who don't have the initiative or insight to search out information on the dangers of high drain batteries or would you rather wait till they they are made unavailable and be able to sit home smugly in the knowledge that you were wise and responsible enough to search out the proper use of these batteries? There's a pragmatic element to all this as well.

I would rather people use good judgment and make a conscious effort to be safe and use the information readily available to them.

I believe in helping others help themselves.
Dependency is a crutch.

Give a man a fish, feed him for a day.
Teach a man to fish, feed him for the rest of his life.

The knowledge is a click away.

 

[DC2]

So if anyone has any responsibility to educate consumers about lithium batteries, it's Motorola, Apple, Samsung, LG, etc.

I read a lot of comments how it's unfair the pressures put on vaping.

And here the same camp is putting the onus on a smaller, more segmented industry and giving a free pass to the mega Corporations that put us at the closest proximity with the biggest risk and the most profits to spend on education.

I think we just stumbled across some common ground.

 

[Bad Ninja]

See @Mazinny 's post above. Sony, a major manufacturer, issued that statement. And it's not the first time Sony has released a letter like that. Just because something is legal to buy does not infer it is safe for use as per your intent, not the manufacturer's intent.

That's a CYA letter from sony.

Only from sony. It protects their contracts from liability.
Its well known and isnt the industry standard.

Sony is well aware of how the cells are used and have no problem supplying retail vendors.


Sony vtcs are not black market cells.

 

[Lessifer]

Perhaps we should be petitioning congress to fund the CPSC to develop a public education campaign regarding battery safety. It shouldn't necessarily be vaping specific, just batteries in general.

 

[Ed_C]

I didn't say anything about black market.

So you don't care about children or the elderly? I imagine not the handicapped as well? Nice to know.
You do know that Social Darwinism has been discredited, right?

Maybe if you used a little critical thinking yourself, instead of relying on cute little one-liners.

 

[Eskie]

That's a CYA letter from sony.

Only from sony. It protects their contracts from liability.
Its well known and isnt the industry standard.

Sony is well aware of how the cells are used and have no problem supplying retail vendors.


Sony vtcs are not black market cells.

It may be a CYA, but that is their official, public position. And no one is referring to these as "black market", simply used by end users in settings the manufacturer has never tested to assure safety. It's not just batteries, it's true on any item purchased and used other than by the manufacturer's instructions, regardless of how safe it may or may not be. If you buy a plastic food container and now decide to use it in the oven, instead of the microwave, you will have a mess, and the manufacturer (as well as neighbors and the responding fire department if it really gets out of hand) will simply shake their heads at the mess you chose to cause by improper use.

And yes, 20A batteries like these should be used with caution, especially if in a non-regulated manner. The end user does have responsibility for assuring safe use, and not throwing on a 0.07 ohm coil and wondering why your mech feels so hot to the touch.

 

[beckdg]

I think we just stumbled across some common ground.

We've had a lot all along.

We just see similar things from wildly different perspectives.

Tapatyped

 

[Bad Ninja]

I didn't say anything about black market.

So you don't care about children or the elderly? I imagine not the handicapped as well? Nice to know.
You do know that Social Darwinism has been discredited, right?

Maybe if you used a little critical thinking yourself, instead of relying on cute little one-liners.

1.Children dont vape. Its illegal.
Only adults. Using children as a strawman is a failed attempt to skew the debate away from facts amd to emotion.


2. I am elderly and only use my phone for an internet connection.


Your argument fails on many levels.

 

[Cheallaigh]

know why a lot of people don't know their proper battery stats? even store websites have them wrong, and i'm not talking about efests.

 

[beckdg]

People stick cell phones up against their ears for hours every day.
People put laptops on their genitals for hours every day.

Why doesn't everybody everywhere understand the dangers?
It's a simple question, so what's the answer?

Ignorance is bliss?

I read every word on every page when I signed for my mortgage.

Q1: how common is that?

Q2: how common should it be?

Q3: how obvious is it?

Make sense?

Tapatyped

 

[DC2]

I'm a liberal California democrat, and I believe battery safety is ultimately the consumer's responsibility. So, I'm going to go with No.

And I'm a very libertarian Californian who hates the way this state is run.

And yes I believe there is a duty to educate somewhere in this mess.
So I'll also have to go with no.

We just see similar things from wildly different perspectives.

But strangely only regarding this one topic as far as I can tell.

 

[Bad Ninja]

People stick cell phones up against their ears for hours every day.
People put laptops on their genitals for hours every day.

Why doesn't everybody everywhere understand the dangers?
It's a simple question, so what's the answer?

Laptops blow up everyday.
Google will show you articles decades old.
Even Apple laptops.
You know what Apple said?


"Expected behavior".

Go argue with apple.

 

[beckdg]

Perhaps we should be petitioning congress to fund the CPSC to develop a public education campaign regarding battery safety. It shouldn't necessarily be vaping specific, just batteries in general.

Perhaps we should start a non-profit instead of requesting to gift greedy bureaucrats and white collar thieves 80% of the money sunk into such an endeavor.

Now to build on this.

And include every chemistry commonly used...

Tapatyped

 

[DC2]

Ignorance is bliss?

I read every word on every page when I signed for my mortgage.

Q1: how common is that?

Q2: how common should it be?

Q3: how obvious is it?

Make sense?

Q1: Not very
Q2: Not sure
Q3: Hard question to answer

My wife reads faster than any human being on earth.
And she passed the bar exam and is used to reading that sort of mumbo jumbo.

So I just gave it to her to read.

I can't promise that I would have read every word if she wasn't there.
And even if I did, I'm can't promise I would have understood half of it anyway.

 

[Ed_C]

1.Children dont vape. Its illegal.
Only adults. Using children as a strawman is a failed attempt to skew the debate away from facts amd to emotion.


2. I am elderly and only use my phone for an internet connection.


Your argument fails on many levels.

1. I wasn't the one who brought up children, you did.

2. You're 48, not that elderly. I'm 59 and pretty technologically savvy, but obviously that's not the case with everyone. So once again, those that can't or don't know are collateral damage?

My argument to do a better job with education is not failing.

Give a man a battery without proper instruction, watch him get injured.
Teach a man to use said battery, watch him be safe for the rest of his life.
(Since you seem to respond to little sayings)

 

[Bad Ninja]

And I'm a very libertarian Californian who hates the way this state is run.

I fall outside current political classification, but we definitely agree this state (CA) is ran horribly.
Most crooked, ill managed place ive ever lived.

 

[beckdg]

Q1: Not very
Q2: Not sure
Q3: Hard question to answer

My wife reads faster than any human being on earth.
And she passed the bar exam and is used to reading that sort of mumbo jumbo.

So I just gave it to her to read.

I can't promise that I would have read every word if she wasn't there.
And even if I did, I'm can't promise I would have understood half of it anyway.

20 to 50 percent of your income for 30 years and whether the papers should be read and understood is a hard question to answer?



Really?

ETA: To quote the guy who witnessed my signing "nobody reads all that, you can just sign them".

I almost believe his count...

Tapatyped

 

[Lessifer]

Perhaps we should start a non-profit instead of requesting to gift greedy bureaucrats and white collar thieves 80% of the money sunk into such an endeavor.

Now to build on this.

And include every chemistry commonly used...

Tapatyped

I only suggested the CPSC since it's actually already their job. They have education information out about many other products, but the only thing I could find about batteries from them was the swallowing hazard of the little ones.