5v Passthrough vs LR Atties

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sgtdisturbed47

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After a couple weeks of using the 5v Passthrough from Vaporkings.com with regular 801 and 901 atties, and 2 LR atties (901 and 801) on my 3.7v DSE-905, I have come to some interesting conclusions, which I was not expecting. Keep in mind I direct-drip with the bridges deleted.

Using a 5v PT with an 801 atty gives strong flavor and vapor production. Using an 801 LR atty on my Screwdriver gives stronger TH that using the PT with an 801, but the flavor can be muted, depending on how I vape. I find myself using the regular 801 on the passthrough rather than an LR 801 on the screwdriver. In fact, I gave away one of my LR 801's to a guy at work who needed that extra TH and vapor (the same guy who introduced me to the world of e-cigs).

Using the 5v PT with a 901 atty gives amazing vapor and TH, but maintains the flavor of a 901 at 3.7v. At times the flavor is actually enhanced, to where it really Pops. American Spirit on the PT with a 901 is amazing. The LR 901 on my Screwdriver at 3.7v is almost identical in TH, flavor, and vapor as a regular 901 on the PT. I use it all the time now when I'm not using the PT.

Stepping outside of the "3.7 atty on a 3.7 battery" world left me with many questions and concerns, but now that I have some experience with 5v as well as LR atties, I can safely say that LR atties are great, if used right. They can be pretty tricky, because if they aren't at the right wetness, they either burn or flood. When they meet their burn point, it's disgusting. When they flood, they don't perform well. My LR 901 atties need 2 drops every few hits (I take big hits), but if I drip too often, it floods. If not dripped often enough, the taste is horrid.

That being said, the regular atties on the 5v passthrough don't burn as easily. I can drip less often and not worry about flooding them (it's hard to flood the 801 on the PT anyway), so much less thought goes into keeping the liquid at the right level in the atty while using the PT.

Maybe if I used LR atties that are at a higher ohm rating? The ones I have are rated at 1.7-1.8 ohms. Maybe 2-2.5 ohms would be better for me in order to avoid that burnt taste.
 
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SimpleSins

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Someone has done the math in another thread, but if I recall correctly, the only real advantage to a LR attie on a 5V passthrough is the throat hit, as most flavors get lost at that high a voltage. If you really like the throat hit at that super-heated voltage, I believe Nhaler makes a line of juices specifically for the very high voltage, I assume with extra oomph to their flavors to withstand the heat. My personal opinion, and we know what that's worth, is that you'll blow our LR atomizers pretty quick using them on a 5V passthrough. I think they're designed to simulate a 5V experience on a 3.7 and lower device, so the 5V might be too much for them.
 

sgtdisturbed47

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I've never used my LR atties on the 5v passthrough, just regular atties. I see how I wrote the post and it's easy to say that I meant "using an LR atty on a 5v passthrough", but when I speak of using the passthrough, I'm referring to using it with regular atties.

I had thought about trying it, but seeing how the LR atties perform on a 3.7 battery, it seems to me that 5v on an LR atty would be overkill for my liking.
 

Switched

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Even with a direct PT, your PC port is not providing the current necessary to fire the atty as a 5V device. It is just not available. With a reg 2.2Ohm atty or higher yes the PT will perform better than 3.7V (dependent on battery), but will not perform as a "true" 5V device.

That being said, LRs draw too much current from your port and hence should not be used on a PT. The USB ports were never designed for vaping.

In their day, PTs were equiped with an in line battery which acted as a sort of fuse, protecting the port from over current situations. The port was merely a way to charge the battery and keep it charged when at a PC. One could vape for hours vice 1-1.5hrs (with regular batts) keeping their e-cigs charged for when they were away from their PC.

PTs are becoming a thing of the past I am sorry to say, but still have their application.
 

gice

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Even with a direct PT, your PC port is not providing the current necessary to fire the atty as a 5V device. It is just not available. With a reg 2.2Ohm atty or higher yes the PT will perform better than 3.7V (dependent on battery), but will not perform as a "true" 5V device.

That being said, LRs draw too much current from your port and hence should not be used on a PT. The USB ports were never designed for vaping.

In their day, PTs were equiped with an in line battery which acted as a sort of fuse, protecting the port from over current situations. The port was merely a way to charge the battery and keep it charged when at a PC. One could vape for hours vice 1-1.5hrs (with regular batts) keeping their e-cigs charged for when they were away from their PC.

PTs are becoming a thing of the past I am sorry to say, but still have their application.

i'm using my HTC (android phone) AC adapter (Output 5v 1A). Probably not 5v but still better than H16 w/ LR atty. Now, i'm seriously considering the Buzz ($86.25 for a blemished unit). The "5v" PT from madvapes was just to get an idea/feel and for $17 bucks what the heck. It's cheap and it performs, so it obviously has it's place. i don't expect it to last either. BUT, i do expect the Buzz to last much longer.

*Not using the LR atty with the PT.
 
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sgtdisturbed47

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I'm not using LR atties on the PT either.

Seeing as USB 2.0 runs at 500 milliamps, I'm sure it doesn't perform on the same level as a dedicated 5v device, but it performs significantly better than a 3.7v device, as I've directly compared the 2 situations. I'm sure it would perform even better on a 1 or 2 amp 5v USB wall charger. In fact I plan on getting my hands on such a wall charger to directly compare it to using the PT on a computer's USB port.
 

Denrock316

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I'm using the 5v p-t from Madvapes right now with a standard 510 atty and the 2amp wall-plug also from Madvapes. It's pretty sweet huge vapor, plenty of TH, and the flavor isn't burnt at all it seems really enhanced compared to 3.7v. This is using the Desert Ship Tobacco e-juice from freedomsmokeusa.

PS- I did also try it on my laptop and yes it does seem to have just a tiny bit more "oompf" with the wall-plug.
 

WillyB

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I'm using the 5v p-t from Madvapes right now with a standard 510 atty and the 2amp wall-plug also from Madvapes. It's pretty sweet huge vapor, plenty of TH, and the flavor isn't burnt at all it seems really enhanced compared to 3.7v. This is using the Desert Ship Tobacco e-juice from freedomsmokeusa.

PS- I did also try it on my laptop and yes it does seem to have just a tiny bit more "oompf" with the wall-plug.
It's interesting that you (and MadVapes) calls a a cable/switch/connector a '5V PT'. To be a '5V PT' it would have to be a part of a system. That '2amp wall-plug' is not delivering the full 2 amps to the atty. You also said 'with a standard 510 atty'.

Using Ohm's Law if we assume 1900mA to the standard 510 (an authentic Joye is 2.1-2.2Ω) we get about 4.2V and 8 watts. If we used the full 2 amps that's still only 4.4V. A true 5V with a Joye 510 would need 2.3A and hit 11.4 watts. That's a significant, 40% more, and very noticeable difference in heat and throat hit.

Looking at Vaporkings.com site for all their PTs they say:
For optimal performance we recommend using a USB port/power port that outputs at least 1000mAh/1A.
That's ridiculous. Assuming most 801, 901s to be in the 3.5Ω range the best you could hope for with 1A would be 3.5V. If that's what they consider 'optimal performance' they have very low expectations. And to anyone powering their PT with a '2amp wall-plug' note a LR 1.5Ω atty pulls 2.5A from an 18650 battery.
 

Switched

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I'm not using LR atties on the PT either.

Seeing as USB 2.0 runs at 500 milliamps, I'm sure it doesn't perform on the same level as a dedicated 5v device, but it performs significantly better than a 3.7v device, as I've directly compared the 2 situations. I'm sure it would perform even better on a 1 or 2 amp 5v USB wall charger. In fact I plan on getting my hands on such a wall charger to directly compare it to using the PT on a computer's USB port.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with your rationale, and they will. I often use my 801 plugged into the wall (5V 2A) while watching the tube, nothing wrong with that. It provides a good vape, but as WillyB pointed out 5V is 5V, and marketing is marketing.

As previously posted, they have their uses but there days are indeed numbered.
 

WillyB

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There is absolutely nothing wrong with your rationale, and they will. I often use my 801 plugged into the wall (5V 2A) while watching the tube, nothing wrong with that. It provides a good vape, but as WillyB pointed out 5V is 5V, and marketing is marketing.

As previously posted, they have their uses but there days are indeed numbered.
I know you understand the relationships of current/resistance/ohms, but why:
hey have their uses but their days are indeed numbered.

I just built a new 2A powered Joye 510 PT (I had stepped on/broke my old one a few months back). A true 5V Joye is a bit too much for me. I had forgot how nice, convenient and consistent a PT can be. And how the stepped up volts can breathe new life into aging atties that no longer produce well at 3.7V. Plus always charging batteries when sitting at home just shortens their useful life and is an unneeded hassle.

A must have in my opinion and I can't see this changing.
 

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wv2win

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Been using a 5v pt with the "510 Spare Atomizer" from Madvapes and it performs better than using LR atty with H16 (3.7). No sizzling sound with the 5v PT, similar vapor production, BUT i can taste the flavors much better.

Looks like 5v mods are the way to go.

Agreed on the 5 volt mods. You don't have to figure anything out or switch between different devices. Short, simple and sweet.
 

sgtdisturbed47

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Whether or not a PT performs as well as a 5v mod is really beside the point, but duly noted that they fall short of true 5v mods.

5v from the power source vs 3.7v will make a big difference while using the same, regular atty. At 3 ohms on a regular 801, with 3.7v is producing 4.5 watts. That same 3 ohm 801 with a 5v power source puts out 8.3 watts. Taking into consideration the power source being 5v vs 3.7v, that's where I get the calculation from. That's almost 2x the watt output, which is good enough for me. I enjoy my liquids with a thicker cloud of vapor, and stronger throat hit as opposed to the same regular atty on a 3.7v battery.

Looking at my 1.8 ohm LR 801 atty on a 3.7v battery, that's 7.6 watts. Calculating the volts from the power source running through a wire at a specific ohms, that's where I come up with these wattage numbers. Maybe my math is wrong, or I have the idea wrong, but it looks on paper (and in my personal experience) that the passthrough at 5v with my regular 801 is performing just about the same as my LR 801 on a 3.7v battery.
 
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sgtdisturbed47

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These forums are littered with posts from folks who went from their supposedly '5V PTs' to true 5V regulated mods and found them much too harsh and hot.

The passthroughs are true 5v. The power source is 5v from the USB plug. 5v is 5v, the main difference between a PT at 5v and a 5v standalone mod is the amps. Crank up the amps, you'll get more wattage at the coil for sure, but that doesn't change the fact that both the PT and "true 5v" mods both run at 5v.
 

WillyB

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The passthroughs are true 5v. The power source is 5v from the USB plug. 5v is 5v, the main difference between a PT at 5v and a 5v standalone mod is the amps. Crank up the amps, you'll get more wattage at the coil for sure, but that doesn't change the fact that both the PT and "true 5v" mods both run at 5v.
If by 'run' you mean vape you are absolutely wrong. You have posted some watts calculations while ignoring the current needed to get 5V. A 5V @ 1A power supply will run the so-called '5V PT's' with a 3Ω atty at only 3V. I don't care if some vendor calls it a '5V PT' or if it is hooked up to a 5V power source. If the current isn't there neither are the volts. And if you are using 3.7V as the voltage of a DSE 905 that is also wrong. If you want to figure watts for it use 3.45V as your basis.
 

sgtdisturbed47

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If by 'run' you mean vape you are absolutely wrong. You have posted some watts calculations while ignoring the current needed to get 5V. A 5V @ 1A power supply will run the so-called '5V PT's' with a 3Ω atty at only 3V. I don't care if some vendor calls it a '5V PT' or if it is hooked up to a 5V power source. If the current isn't there neither are the volts. And if you are using 3.7V as the voltage of a DSE 905 that is also wrong. If you want to figure watts for it use 3.45V as your basis.

I think im getting confused again. So, since the USB port has a current of .5 amps, and the atty is at 3 ohms, then its pulling 1.5 volts, right? And a regular atty at 3 ohms on a 950 mah battery is pulling 2.7v, right? So why am I getting better performance out of the PT if the math says otherwise?

Ok i think im confusing myself. This isn't adding up. Is there something I'm missing? Is the 950 mah not part of the calculation? Someone clue me in.
 

Switched

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Sarge,

I think you are reading too much into this. To simplify matters, let me explain without math:
  • we agree a USB port cannot deliver the req'd amperage;
  • a wall plug with a 2A at 5V can;
  • but a wall plug even at 2A is underrated for the application (LR);
  • LRs draw more amperage than reg attys, and thus require high drain batteries;
Folks can be a little .... at times.

The truth of the matter is, to get a true 5V to an atomiser, you need to use a Variable voltage device equiped with the appropriate batteries and adjusted to 5V when the atomiser is fired. This in turn produces a harsh vapour to many. The sweet spot being around 4.5V which most 5V devices will deliver under load, mine delivers 4.6V

I think what Willy was getting at, was a 3.7V device with an LR atty will simulate 5V vaping provided it is equiped with the proper batteries (high drain) but not duplicate a 5V device.
 
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