FDA 8/8/14 Comment/Letter to FDA by 29 state attorneys general

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SeniorBoy

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Kent C

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Fascism defined....


"Thus, the FDA is not proposing definitions for components, parts, or accessories. However, we believe that the new and evolving nature of the e-cigarette requires clear and concise definitions for its components, parts, and accessories to prevent any confusion that may arise.

The component of e-cigarettes that brings them within the scope of the Proposed Rule is the liquid nicotine solution, often called e-liquid. However, there are several other portions to the e-cigarette device, i.e., battery, atomizer, and either a cartridge or tank, that are essential in the consumption or use of the tobacco product and therefore should be classified as a component and/or part even though they do not contain nicotine. Liquid nicotine cannot be consumed without each of these components working in conjunction with each other to deliver the nicotine to the consumer.

Furthermore, any item that charges the battery, such as a USB charger, should also fall within the definition of components and parts. The USB charger is typically a proprietary device that attaches directly to the battery of an e-cigarette and is inserted into a generic USB port. Although the USB charger is not used during the consumption of a tobacco product, the device must be charged in order for the tobacco product to be consumed. The FDA should settle any ambiguity between what is a component and part and what is an accessory as it is foreseeable that manufacturers may market batteries, atomizers, and tanks or cartridges as accessories in order to avoid the requirements and restrictions imposed on them once e-cigarettes are deemed a tobacco product.

We therefore propose the FDA define the term “components and parts” as follows: A component or part is anything that is used or could be used to make or use the finished product that affects the nicotine, controls the nicotine, is affected by the nicotine, can be mixed with the nicotine, is required for proper function of the device, or monitors nicotine use either for refill level or for user data to measure user habits and personal use of nicotine. The language, “make or use the finished product” would apply to both the consumer and the manufacturer. The e-cigarette user can select the device, the battery and the composition of the liquid, including the amount of nicotine and type of flavoring, and assemble the parts to create the product the user desires. As a result, each such item, whether or not it contains nicotine, should be deemed a component or part."


"Any type of liquid solution that may be used in an e-cigarette device, regardless of whether it contains nicotine, should be classified as a component because it can be mixed with a solution that does contain nicotine."


"The FDA has proposed to bring under its authority flavor enhancers for hookahs as a component or part, even though not all hookah flavor enhancers contain nicotine. The FDA should similarly exercise such authority as to flavored solutions that can be used in e-cigarettes. The need to include e-liquids, whether or not they contain nicotine..."
 

SeniorBoy

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Thanks Kent for the quotes. My NV AG signed this letter as well as the previous one which had 40 AG signatures. She will definitely hear from me with CCs to all the local media! Her Term expires in 2015 and I'm going to try to mobilize as many of the 50+ vape shops in the Vegas Valley. I'm not sure if it will work but I'm going to try!
 

greyfox

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Agreed. The same thing applies to cotton balls and glycerin - professionals and manufacturers in the beauty industry must be over-joyed at reading this load of bupkiss. I particularly enjoyed reading how 'nicotine' (not tobacco, NICOTINE) has a disgusting taste and flavors are used to mask its nastiness and make inhalation less harsh to guarantee addiction, which is absolutely ridiculous. I've vaped unflavored juice myself, and the nicotine doesn't taste like anything at all. That's like saying caffeine as an isolated chemical tastes like black coffee! In my opinion the entire letter is a bunch of lies and assumptions cobbled together to look like an educated, well researched document when in fact it's anything but.
 

SolRayz

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Agreed. The same thing applies to cotton balls and glycerin - professionals and manufacturers in the beauty industry must be over-joyed at reading this load of bupkiss. I particularly enjoyed reading how 'nicotine' (not tobacco, NICOTINE) has a disgusting taste and flavors are used to mask its nastiness and make inhalation less harsh to guarantee addiction, which is absolutely ridiculous. I've vaped unflavored juice myself, and the nicotine doesn't taste like anything at all. That's like saying caffeine as an isolated chemical tastes like black coffee! In my opinion the entire letter is a bunch of lies and assumptions cobbled together to look like an educated, well researched document when in fact it's anything but.

Yet all these worthless "attorneys generals" signed this garbage...you have to question the credibility of everyone these days.
 

greyfox

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Yet all these worthless "attorneys generals" signed this garbage...you have to question the credibility of everyone these days.

I couldn't agree more. I think it's important to recognize that AGs are elected officials, in effect politicians with a fancy title, and my personal policy is to never take anything a politician says at face value since every last one of them seems to be more interested in keeping their job than actually DOING the job. Every single one of them, even the one's I support, twist facts or present outright lies as truth to suit their own agenda and you have to run every word through a fact checked just to get at the actual truth! Maybe I'm just overly cynical but I really wish honesty was a prerequisite for holding office in this country.
 

Kent C

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Thanks Kent for the quotes. My NV AG signed this letter as well as the previous one which had 40 AG signatures. She will definitely hear from me with CCs to all the local media! Her Term expires in 2015 and I'm going to try to mobilize as many of the 50+ vape shops in the Vegas Valley. I'm not sure if it will work but I'm going to try!

And thanks for posting. How far the FDA will go with it, is uncertain. This may be part of Zeller's 'this is just the start' (paraphrasing) or harm reduction from further drops in cig sales and use could enter in to the equation. Each of these AG's should be targeted for retirement (actually, I have an even better idea but couldn't post it here). Can you impeach an AG? :) But selecting their successors wouldn't be an easy task, unfortunately - those who gravitate to government are the 'we know what's best' crowd. When they aren't that type, you have a real jewel.
 

Kent C

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Yet all these worthless "attorneys generals" signed this garbage...you have to question the credibility of everyone these days.

I'll tell you one thing, Mike DeWine of Ohio, is one of the sleaziest politicians we've had. He is a RINO extraordinaire. He has been for gun control (as was Kasich our R. Governor) and against individual liberties every step of the way. He is not a 'real person' - he's a façade and puts me in mind of another such personality - Warren Rudman ex-Senator of New Hampshire. They put on this over serious/concerned façade, making them look like they are knowledgeable when they really aren't. Something that shows up in some of their debates. There are a lot of politicians that do that but not to the extent of these two :) DeWine also couches himself in religion (not that religion is bad, just using it in that manner is) and again, it appears to be only a façade, for this sleaze. He's a walking contradiction.
 

Vicman

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Didn't even have to look (did anyways) to see if my AG was on there; yep, sure is. Funny, she is AG over the most corrupt state in the union yet never goes after any corruption in politics. Might be because her daddy is the Illinois Speaker of the House. Good thing there is no nepotism in Illinois politics. Nope, none whatsoever (sarcasm). Maybe if she focused on what is destroying our state she wouldn't have time to sign that garbage letter to the FDA. I vape and I vote. Won't be voting for her this year.
 

greyfox

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I'll tell you one thing, Mike DeWine of Ohio, is one of the sleaziest politicians we've had. He is a RINO extraordinaire. He has been for gun control (as was Kasich our R. Governor) and against individual liberties every step of the way. He is not a 'real person' - he's a façade and puts me in mind of another such personality - Warren Rudman ex-Senator of New Hampshire. They put on this over serious/concerned façade, making them look like they are knowledgeable when they really aren't. Something that shows up in some of their debates. There are a lot of politicians that do that but not to the extent of these two :) DeWine also couches himself in religion (not that religion is bad, just using it in that manner is) and again, it appears to be only a façade, for this sleaze. He's a walking contradiction.

Seems to me a lot of the Republicans currently in office, particularly at the federal level, have completely forgotten what it means to actually BE a Republican. I should mention that I personally am a liberal Democrat, always have been, but I don't dislike Republicans like so many Dems seem to these days, probably because I remember how the GOP used to be before they became sidetracked with extremists views. We need to return to the days of Reagan and O'Neal, when people from opposing sides worked together to craft a compromise that accomplished the goal at hand and was actually good for the country.

I have no intention of going into a lengthy political comment, I mention the above only to highlight my point as I think compromise is the key to any new regulations for the ecig industry. Age restrictions? No problem. Child proofing required? Hell yeah, speaking as both a vaper and as a father, I couldn't agree more. Capitulating to the demands of big tobacco and attempting to effectively regulate independent businesses to the extent that they are forced to close? That's just moronic, in my opinion. Common sense, honesty and intelligent discourse are what I want to see from government officials. Sadly, I think I may be doomed to suffer disappointment on all counts.
 

Katya

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Yet all these worthless "attorneys generals" signed this garbage...you have to question the credibility of everyone these days.

Twenty nine attorneys general signed the letter (just scroll the document all the way down).

And looking on the bright side--twenty one AGs didn't sign it... :facepalm:
 

Katya

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That's crazy. That implies that the same physical object, such as an 18650 battery, both is and is not regulated based solely on its use. Legal in a flashlight, illegal in a mechanical mod?

Ridiculous.

And propylene glycol, vegetable glycerin, sucralose, ethyl maltol, distilled water, vodka, rum, food flavorings, USB chargers, wall adapters, silicone o-rings, kanthal and nichrome wire, cotton balls, rayon wool, hemp twine, cotton yarn...

Idiots.
 

Endor

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Yeah well America is full of crazy people, who impose there asinine values on others, whether merited or not, based on facts, or not.

Unfortunately, it looks like many of these crazy people are in the government. Worse yet, in positions of power.

Even worse still, the denizens of the "land of the free" put up with it.
 
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