Annoyed with sub-ohm and lack of education.

[Lessifer]

When I first posted in the 50W istick thread about the problems we were seeing from our group buy mods, people got angry with me. I felt they needed to know though. I also had some thoughts on why this was happening based on my (limited) experience with changing chips/mod design. I took a lot of flak from those who felt I was squashing their joy. As the weeks went by though, some of those same angry folks had theirs go wonky and then realized it wasn't a reliable device.

I like to think I can look at things impartially. Just because I bought it doesn't mean I'll defend it . I have 3 working 50W isticks. However, I realize they could go south on me at any time. Because I paid for them, I'm taking my chances on using them. I would feel like scum if I sold them or gave them to someone, and something bad happened. And yes, I'm too cheap to toss something that's working.

However, I'm a safety advocate so I will point out that there has been a high failure rate, including fires and explosions.

One of the wonderful things about sites like this is that usually the information you want or need is there.

One of the bad things about sites like this is, sometimes you have to read through a lot to get to that information, or you might not know what information you need.

If I'm looking at buying something, I come here, I search, and if there's something bothering me I ask. I'm cautious by nature though.

 

[jseah]

Let me clarify I enjoy sub-ohm and cloud chasing. It's not rocket science and can be as safe as any other vape. My annoyance is with TC coils being sold by Kanger and such at .2 ohms. You can daily read on here someone wanting to play with low ohm coils that have no understanding of ohms law. Add to that people tend to believe if it's made from a factory and it fits a mod then it's safe. I'm just waiting to read about someone placing a TC coil on a mech using a AW bat with a 10amp limit thinking they are safe because everything seems to work together. They don't know any better and I have no quarrel with that, it's part of learning. It's companies and individuals selling products with no regards to wether the person understands the risks and to make things worse half the people working at vape shops don't know any better either. I talked to a couple guys working that said learning ohms law was a waste of time to just use the calculator apps. Those apps build complacency and complacency is one of the most dangerous things in the world.

I know it has already been posted. but the TC coils are all clearly marked that they are ONLY for use in temperature control mods. Also, while the resistances on TC coils a very low by comparison to kanthal coils, they really are two different animals. Yes, all TC coils are sub-0.2 ohm, but you will never hit the amp load limit on any decent battery. Temp control mods do set limits on the wattages that you can run nickels coils on. The DNA40 is capped at 40 watts, the Yihi chips in the SX Mini and the IPV4 is capped at 50 joules.

The SX Mini has a minimum coil resistance limit for nickel coils at 0.06 ohms. At this resistance with the maximum of 50 joules, this means that the maximum voltage you can run a 0.06 ohm nickel coil is 1.73 volts (1.73 volts x 1.73 volts divided by 0.06 ohms equals 49.88 watts). This also means that this maximum will require a 28.83 amp load (1.73 volts divided by 0.06 ohms).

Anyone who ignores all the warnings plastered all over the packaging for nickel coils that they are only for use in TC mods and tries using it on a mech mod with no protection or limits designed into it deserves to have it explode in their face.

FWIW, the nickel coils in my Vaporshark premade coils for the Subtank and the Atlantis runs at 0.15 ohms and the nickel coil wound for me by the B&M on my RDA's measure 0.107 ohms.

 

[bones1274]

It's companies and individuals selling products with no regards to wether the person understands the risks and to make things worse half the people working at vape shops don't know any better either.

How is this any different than other industries? I am all about education but realistically, far less than 1% of all vapers are here on this forum. We can beat our chests until we are blue in the face and the fact is, people are still going do what they want regardless of what anyone tries to tell them.

Any idiot can watch youtube videos about car racing and then go plunk down some money on a 700 HP Dodge Challenger to do the same. Never mind that all of the safety warnings all over the commercials, print ads, stickers on the car, all over the owners manual, etc. Is Dodge responsible for ensuring all customers can safely operate their product before they purchase it? No they are not. Is the dealer going to give you a safety speech about safe driving and show you how to drive safely before you drive away? No they will not. Are they obligated to? No they are not. Yes, you are supposed to have a license to drive, but the fact is, many do not and they don't care. You are also supposed to have insurance, but again, many do not.

So now this idiot in his brand new 700 HP car is barreling down the freeway at 120mph and all you can do is try to get out of the way. No amount of chest beating or education is going to get him to change his mind. It is the same thing with a lot of new vapers. The only thing you can do is get out of their way when you see them coming, hoping they don't take you out when their mod crashes.

For what it's worth, a very, very, very small part of me wishes these uneducated idiots mods would detonate high order when they are all by themselves in a field. Lord knows I love reading about the Darwin award finalists cleansing the gene pool.

Seriously though, I don't want folks to get hurt, but they will. All we can do is hope we are out of the way when it goes high order.

 

[RebornLincoln06]

How is this any different than other industries? I am all about education but realistically, far less than 1% of all vapers are here on this forum. We can beat our chests until we are blue in the face and the fact is, people are still going do what they want regardless of what anyone tries to tell them.

Any idiot can watch youtube videos about car racing and then go plunk down some money on a 700 HP Dodge Challenger to do the same. Never mind that all of the safety warnings all over the commercials, print ads, stickers on the car, all over the owners manual, etc. Is Dodge responsible for ensuring all customers can safely operate their product before they purchase it? No they are not. Is the dealer going to give you a safety speech about safe driving and show you how to drive safely before you drive away? No they will not. Are they obligated to? No they are not. Yes, you are supposed to have a license to drive, but the fact is, many do not and they don't care. You are also supposed to have insurance, but again, many do not.

So now this idiot in his brand new 700 HP car is barreling down the freeway at 120mph and all you can do is try to get out of the way. No amount of chest beating or education is going to get him to change his mind. It is the same thing with a lot of new vapers. The only thing you can do is get out of their way when you see them coming, hoping they don't take you out when their mod crashes.

For what it's worth, a very, very, very small part of me wishes these uneducated idiots mods would detonate high order when they are all by themselves in a field. Lord knows I love reading about the Darwin award finalists cleansing the gene pool.

Seriously though, I don't want folks to get hurt, but they will. All we can do is hope we are out of the way when it goes high order.

The reason this industry gets targeted like this is it's not like a car where if accidents happen, it can be credited to mechanical failure if the accident wasn't caused by a person not paying attention or whatever the case may be. Vaping isn't accepted fully by society and the media, so when people blow their s*** up the story gets exasperated by people loathing in how 'dangerous' e-cigs are, all because one person didn't bother to regard proper safety. This is the very reason why I believe e-cigs will never be fully accepted ever, at least RDA's and Mechanical mods.

 

[Robert Cromwell]

There was a time when cigarettes were not accepted as well. Google the history of the cigarette. Time changes all things, some for the better some for the worse.

 

[RebornLincoln06]

There was a time when cigarettes were not accepted as well. Google the history of the cigarette. Time changes all things, some for the better some for the worse.

True, but that's not going to stop people from trying to ban e-cigs and call them a nuisance.

 

[jseah]

Any idiot can watch youtube videos about car racing and then go plunk down some money on a 700 HP Dodge Challenger to do the same. Never mind that all of the safety warnings all over the commercials, print ads, stickers on the car, all over the owners manual, etc. Is Dodge responsible for ensuring all customers can safely operate their product before they purchase it? No they are not. Is the dealer going to give you a safety speech about safe driving and show you how to drive safely before you drive away? No they will not. Are they obligated to? No they are not. Yes, you are supposed to have a license to drive, but the fact is, many do not and they don't care. You are also supposed to have insurance, but again, many do not.

So now this idiot in his brand new 700 HP car is barreling down the freeway at 120mph and all you can do is try to get out of the way. No amount of chest beating or education is going to get him to change his mind. It is the same thing with a lot of new vapers. The only thing you can do is get out of their way when you see them coming, hoping they don't take you out when their mod crashes.

There actually was a guy who purchased the first Dodge Hellcat sold in Colorado for $60,000 and totaled about an hour after he drove it off the lot.

First Hellcat Sold in Colorado Wrecked An Hour After Purchase

And then there was the guy who won a $380,000 Lamborghini Murcielago and crashed it 6 hours later.

Utah Man Wins $380K Lamborghini…and Crashes It Hours Later | TheBlaze.com

 

[bones1274]

There actually was a guy who purchased the first Dodge Hellcat sold in Colorado for $60,000 and totaled about an hour after he drove it off the lot.

First Hellcat Sold in Colorado Wrecked An Hour After Purchase

And then there was the guy who won a $380,000 Lamborghini Murcielago and crashed it 6 hours later.

Utah Man Wins $380K Lamborghini…and Crashes It Hours Later | TheBlaze.com

Yep, saw both those articles when they happened. And all you can do is get out of the way. Doesn't change the fact that a large portion of new vapers don't care about the risks or education. They just want to mimic what they see youtube and their friends do.

 

[Eekins]

I think stores should quit selling chicken and pork. Not everyone knows how to cook. If these things aren't cooked properly, they can kill you.

I second that.

 

[Robert Cromwell]

We are all going to die anyway so why keep on living? You are just wasting time die now.

Might as well push absurd analogies to the max level of absurdity.

the ones wanting to ban ecigs deal in absurdities why should we do the same?

Most any thread speaking anything at all negative about vaping winds up filled with absurd analogies.

In my opinion vaping instead of smoking is about harm reduction not harm elimination. And opinions are about all we have since we have no long term data.

I cannot see all forms of vaping being harm free, but I hope I am proven wrong.