Applebee's was a no go...

[MickeyRat]

If I was sitting at the bar with friends I probably wouldn't have bothered to, either. I was in the restaurant area with my family surrounded by other families.

I generally don't ask in bars.

While we may feel like it's no different than chewing gum, we *are* putting a visible vapor out into the air and I don't believe that pretending we have more rights than everyone else sitting around is going to help the cause in the long run. Yes, it is absolutely "better" than cigarette smoke, by far, but it's still *there*.

Well it's fairly easy to say that vaping is not pretending we have more rights than everyone else sitting around us. There are people sitting around us playing with noisy cell phones or wearing mismatched outfits, or all manner of objectionable things. vaping is no better or worse. So, it's not more rights. It's the same rights. It's polite to ask to avoid a misunderstanding and I usually do in a restaurant but, to say you are assuming more rights than anyone else if you don't, is going a little far.

 

[tamarahvt]

I generally don't ask in bars.



Well it's fairly easy to say that vaping is not pretending we have more rights than everyone else sitting around us. There are people sitting around us playing with noisy cell phones or wearing mismatched outfits, or all manner of objectionable things. Vaping is no better or worse. So, it's not more rights. It's the same rights. It's polite to ask to avoid a misunderstanding and I usually do in a restaurant but, to say you are assuming more rights than anyone else if you don't, is going a little far.

My point is that we are putting a visible "something" out into the air. Now, *we* believe it's safe but is it really fair to make that decision for other people? They *chose* to inhale car exhaust on their way to the restaurant but do they want to take some stranger's word that the apparent "smoke" they see is safe?

I'm reminded of a situation a few years ago where I was sitting in the doctor's waiting room. I was there for a simple physical but I had a bit of my smoker's cough. An elderly woman begged me to put on a mask because she had just gotten over being seriously ill. I explained that I really wasn't sick but she didn't believe me and there was definite fear in her eyes. I could have argued with her because I knew I was right and people have certainly heard of a smoker's cough before but I didn't. The bottom line is that I did not know 100% if I really was "safe", so I put on the mask to ease her fears.

I educate just about every person I encounter (and have been either directly or indirectly responsible for the conversion of at least 9 smokers in the last two months) and my teenage son came home from school one day and told me about explaining it in front of the class when the subject of smoking came up. The more people hear about it the better but I just don't see vaping as something I *have* to do *everywhere*. I would love to drink a cup of coffee at the library but it's not okay. I am perfectly capable of drinking without spillage but I'm not going to demand that they change their rules so I can get my coffee fix.

I've followed many causes over the years and it just seems like being too pushy or "in your face" tends to create a backlash.

 

[MickeyRat]

My point is that we are putting a visible "something" out into the air. Now, *we* believe it's safe but is it really fair to make that decision for other people? They *chose* to inhale car exhaust on their way to the restaurant but do they want to take some stranger's word that the apparent "smoke" they see is safe?

I have to ask because you seem to be assuming something that in my experience is not the case. Have you vaped much in public situations? I have in five states. As a general rule if you are not vaping something can be mistaken for a cigarette, people don't have a negative reaction. They tend to be more curious. Once it's explained to them more often than not, they think it's pretty cool. It's not more offensive than strong cologne for the most part and actually most of the time, if you don't look at it, you'll never even smell it.

 

[tamarahvt]

I have to ask because you seem to be assuming something that in my experience is not the case. Have you vaped much in public situations? I have in five states. As a general rule if you are not vaping something can be mistaken for a cigarette, people don't have a negative reaction. They tend to be more curious. Once it's explained to them more often than not, they think it's pretty cool. It's not more offensive than strong cologne for the most part and actually most of the time, if you don't look at it, you'll never even smell it.

My public time is pretty much shopping and family time in restaurants so, no, I haven't bothered. If I went to bars or even out for dinner with just my husband I probably would. Yes, I have friends who vape while shopping but I don't see the point in it for me. The toddler is almost always with me so I'm focused on her.

 

[MickeyRat]

My public time is pretty much shopping and family time in restaurants so, no, I haven't bothered. If I went to bars or even out for dinner with just my husband I probably would. Yes, I have friends who vape while shopping but I don't see the point in it for me. The toddler is almost always with me so I'm focused on her.

That's kind of what I thought. It's as much attitude as anything else. If you look around for disapproval or sneak around, people can sense it and it won't be good. Mind your own business and just be comfortable it's not a problem. In fact many times people will ask you about it and it's usually in a very positive way. I've never had a negative experience anywhere and I've done it enough and in enough places to have had it happen if it's common for people to be offended. The one thing that's sure to cause a problem is if what you are doing is mistaken for smoking. I've had restaurant managers tell me about that. Because only a fool would think I was smoking with the setup I had, it was fine.

 

[SpyderBite]

The bartender at Ruby Tuesdays near by vapes while she works. As a result, several customers do as well. A few were previously analog smokers who had to step outside often for a smoke.

 

[Maestro]

An elderly woman begged me to put on a mask because she had just gotten over being seriously ill.

I'm curious as to why you didn't suggest that SHE put the mask on. How did her illness become your problem?

 

[Pheisty]

Out of respect for the property owner's property rights, I always ask. I believe that smoking bans are unconstitutional, due to the fact that smoking is a legal act, and the fact that a private property owner--whether it be a business or not--has the right to allow any legal act on their premises. I also believe that they have the right to refuse service to anyone. So because I respect that right, I always ask.

I have only been turned down a couple of times. Once was at a steakhouse that is in the Red Lobster chain. Apparently the entire company prohibits it, countrywide.

The other time was a couple of weeks ago when I was at a bar/restaurant that I frequent in Hudson, WI. I had used my eGo there several times prior, but the bouncer on duty seemed to be on a bit of a power trip. He had reluctantly allowed me to use it, but after I started puffing, he told me that the smell was "too strong". It was Pillow Dreams by Virgin Vapor, one of the most unoffensive smells ever. He also said that there was too much vapor. Whatever. I didn't argue with him because I had seen that he was getting off on carding 65 year-old grandparents, so I knew this was a just a power thing for him.

Again, I always go back to respecting and upholding the rights of the property owners. It really is their call and we should respect that.

 

[tamarahvt]

I'm curious as to why you didn't suggest that SHE put the mask on. How did her illness become your problem?

Simply because she clearly had issues breathing and it didn't hurt me in the least. I honestly don't understand why consideration for others is seen as such a bad thing these days.

 

[Petrodus]

Out of respect for the property owner's property rights, I always ask. I believe that smoking bans are unconstitutional, due to the fact that smoking is a legal act, and the fact that a private property owner--whether it be a business or not--has the right to allow any legal act on their premises. I also believe that they have the right to refuse service to anyone. So because I respect that right, I always ask.

I have only been turned down a couple of times. Once was at a steakhouse that is in the Red Lobster chain. Apparently the entire company prohibits it, countrywide.

The other time was a couple of weeks ago when I was at a bar/restaurant that I frequent in Hudson, WI. I had used my eGo there several times prior, but the bouncer on duty seemed to be on a bit of a power trip. He had reluctantly allowed me to use it, but after I started puffing, he told me that the smell was "too strong". It was Pillow Dreams by Virgin Vapor, one of the most unoffensive smells ever. He also said that there was too much vapor. Whatever. I didn't argue with him because I had seen that he was getting off on carding 65 year-old grandparents, so I knew this was a just a power thing for him.

Again, I always go back to respecting and upholding the rights of the property owners. It really is their call and we should respect that.

Isn't it interesting others seem only to report they can smell e-smoke
IF they see someone vaping.

 

[Pheisty]

Isn't it interesting others seem only to report they can smell e-smoke
IF they see someone vaping.

Exactly. But that cheap, offensive perfume the broad in the next booth is wearing is perfectly acceptable.

 

[Petrodus]

Exactly. But that cheap, offensive perfume the broad in the next booth is wearing is perfectly acceptable.

I like your "attitude"
What this country really needs is a "Female" President
Pheisty for President

 

[Maestro]

Simply because she clearly had issues breathing and it didn't hurt me in the least. I honestly don't understand why consideration for others is seen as such a bad thing these days.

I'm certainly in agreement with being considerate. I always try to be. I would be considerate enough to wear a mask if I had breathing problems. I don't think asking everyone else to is considerate at all. I'm not saying that you should be inconsiderate to others. In this case, however, you were not sick. Your cough was not due to an virus and you were no threat to anyone. She didn't accept that and I think that asking YOU to wear a mask instead of her (the one with the illness) was incredibly rude. I would have a hard time being as gracious to someone with such an over-developed sense of entitlement.

 

[Pheisty]

I like your "attitude"
What this country really needs is a "Female" President
Pheisty for President

You say that now. Ask my husband what it's like being married to a volatile Italian woman and you may change your mind. Heheheh

 

[AlmightyGod]

I also believe that they have the right to refuse service to anyone.

The Civil Rights Act of 1964 disagrees with you.

 

[Uncle Willie]

Being one that is fairly non-confrontational at my age, I generally abide by the "rules" of analog smoking .. not hard since I did not pick up a PV until a few years after becoming aclimated to my States general non-smoking laws ..

If you blow what looks like smoke, at some point, you're going to have a confrontation .. just the way it is ..

And I don't need the nic that bad ...

 

[Pheisty]

The Civil Rights Act of 1964 disagrees with you.

Which is why I believe the Civil Rights Act of 1964 is unconstitutional. ;-) We should have the right to associate or disassociate with whomever we like, and for any reason.

 

[AlmightyGod]

Which is why I believe the Civil Rights Act of 1964 is unconstitutional. ;-) We should have the right to associate or disassociate with whomever we like, and for any reason.

I don't think you truly believe in institutionalized racism. At least I hope not. This conversation came up once before when a restaurant owner wouldn't serve customers who don't speak English. It's a slippery slope...

This isn't the Outside, & I'm not interested in a war of words, so I'll stop now.

 

[Pheisty]

Dago, WOP, Guinea, ....., Goombah, Meatball: just a few names you might know.

I don't think you truly believe in institutionalized racism. At least I hope not. This conversation came up once before when a restaurant owner wouldn't serve customers who don't speak English. It's a slippery slope...

This isn't the Outside, & I'm not interested in a war of words, so I'll stop now.

Ahh, of course. Right to the straw man. Because I don't believe the government has the ability or right to interfere in an individual's right to associate or disassociate with whomever they choose, but instead believe that people are ultimately responsible for their own actions and any true harm they may inflict on another party can be dealt with in a court of law after the alleged infraction as outlined in the constitution, that makes me a proponent of institutionalized racism? Because I don't believe that government--by the end of a gun--can change people's hearts? Because I believe that the free market--and Karma--do the best job of sorting out any discrimination that may occur...and that we all discriminate based on a variety of criteria every day, from the spouse we choose to where we decide to buy our clothes... Yes, I suppose that makes me a proponent of institutionalized racism.

And I suppose that you using racial slurs in an attempt to make passions run high rather than use reason and logic to make your point, that makes you the reasonable individual, and I the irrational one.

 

[seabs]

Ahh, of course. Right to the straw man. Because I don't believe the government has the ability or right to interfere in an individual's right to associate or disassociate with whomever they choose, but instead believe that people are ultimately responsible for their own actions and any true harm they may inflict on another party can be dealt with in a court of law after the alleged infraction as outlined in the constitution, that makes me a proponent of institutionalized racism? Because I don't believe that government--by the end of a gun--can change people's hearts? Because I believe that the free market--and Karma--do the best job of sorting out any discrimination that may occur...and that we all discriminate based on a variety of criteria every day, from the spouse we choose to where we decide to buy our clothes... Yes, I suppose that makes me a proponent of institutionalized racism.

And I suppose that you using racial slurs in an attempt to make passions run high rather than use reason and logic to make your point, that makes you the reasonable individual, and I the irrational one.

Woohoo, there's another libertarian in Wisconsin.