Are Premium Juice Vendors Taking Advantage of us?

[Fir3b1rd]

The Harman Kardon Edition phone was only $30 more then the traditional M8, comes with audiophile grade DAC software and higher end IEM headphones. It was also cheaper for them to do compared to the money involved in the horrible sounding Beats Audio they used in the M7 and Evo models.

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition

You're not helping you're argument,
You bought that because you wanted it, a set of steinheiser and the phone without the m'x' could have been cheaper. Its cool. We all fall for ,arletimg once in a while, with fancy words like audiophile.
The bottom line with economics-, supply and demand,..
Arguing on a forum is not going to change prices

 

[Fir3b1rd]

Yet you pay for water at a store. I buy expensive juice at times too but that doesn't consist of the inconvenience of steeping and waiting for vape mail. And I'm still paying$8 to $10 less for 30ml of Halo then Steve is, even at a B&M.

Would there really be a convenience in waiting a week or two for water mail?

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition

The Kentwood guy delivers weekly to my house, does that count?

 

[Mtek]

Would there really be a convenience in waiting a week or two for water mail?

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition

Of course it wouldn't, and I think your point is rediculous. Buy your juice in bulk, at your home in three days for priority USPS. Is this that big of a deal? If every gas station I frequented sold 5P or other premium liquid I would buy it there and not order it too. My point was water is a huge mark-up, I know it, we all know it, but it's still a billion dollar a year industry. Most consumers like convenience, brand recognition, etc. and are willing to pay for it. I don't see the issue.

 

[Fir3b1rd]

Of course it wouldn't, and I think your point is rediculous. Buy your juice in bulk, at your home in three days for priority USPS. Is this that big of a deal? If every gas station I frequented sold 5P or other premium liquid I would buy it there and not order it too. My point was water is a huge mark-up, I know it, we all know it, but it's still a billion dollar a year industry. Most consumers like convenience, brand recognition, etc. and are willing to pay for it. I don't see the issue.

the issue is some people just need ro argue... its fun.
nothing said om here os goimg to stop from orderimg my 5pawns, i'll hang myself without it. haha
then i'll order my diy supplies.

 

[stevegmu]

Funny thing, Harmon Kardon is living off its name and price. There is nothing premium about their current generation of equipment...

 

[Mtek]

Funny thing, Harmon Kardon is living off its name and price. There is nothing premium about their current generation of equipment...

I agree, for head phones I went Bang and Olufsen.

 

[CajunCloud]

You are talking about the cost of raw ingredients, not the actual cost of being in business...

I included talk of that costs associated with business operations. And if you think for a second your raw materials cost are not included in the cost of "being in business" I'd love to know what business you are in.

Bottom line is most companies hope to average 33% margins or more if possible. Keystone is 100% markup and that is what retail shoots for, 1500+% markup for this product is truly insane on the simple math of the costs "being in business" included. As I also said, wait until they have to meet FDA guidelines and we will see how many survive and how much people are willing to pay for what they could be making themselves. These companies are not spending an average of a billion dollars per flavor to bring it to market like a pharmaceutical company, much less testing it as such. They better milk it while they can as many won't exist after the feds step in. Although I can see these regs being full of loopholes for makers that craft flavors and just let the end user add the nicotine. But what I do I know I've only dealt with Quality Assurance and Compliance Regulation in the Pharmaceutical industry for over a decade dealing with all the alphabet soup regulatory agencies

CC

 

[Fir3b1rd]

Funny thing, Harmon Kardon is living off its name and price. There is nothing premium about their current generation of equipment...

Amen to that!!!! I have their citation 12, still sounds better than any equipment on the market today in my opinion.
- then again I'm not an audiophile.

 

[stevegmu]

I included talk of that costs associated with business operations. And if you think for a second your raw materials cost are not included in the cost of "being in business" I'd love to know what business you are in.

Bottom line is most companies hope to average 33% margins or more if possible. Keystone is 100% markup and that is what retail shoots for, 1500+% markup for this product is truly insane on the simple math of the costs "being in business" included. As I also said, wait until they have to meet FDA guidelines and we will see how many survive and how much people are willing to pay for what they could be making themselves. These companies are not spending an average of a billion dollars per flavor to bring it to market like a pharmaceutical company, much less testing it as such. They better milk it while they can as many won't exist after the feds step in. Although I can see these regs being full of loopholes for makers that craft flavors and just let the end user add the nicotine. But what I do I know I've only dealt with Quality Assurance and Compliance Regulation in the Pharmaceutical industry for over a decade dealing with all the alphabet soup regulatory agencies

CC

Thermoplastics. Pelletized extruder grade plastic and kevlar and nylon yarn aren't expensive. Turning them into an offshore drilling blow out prevention bundle is...

I didn't say raw materials aren't included in the cost of doing business, but they are generally the smallest % of the cost...

 

[alicewonderland]

i dont think people are arguing because they want vendors to change their prices. just simply stating their reasons for/against DIY and agreeing/disagreeing that premium eliquids are overpriced. Then some people had to come here and insult others for being 'cheap' and bragging about how much they spend on tequila and how they drop 600$, 800$ on phones and crap.

 

[alicewonderland]

Thermoplastics. Pelletized extruder grade plastic and kevlar and nylon yarn aren't expensive. Turning them into an offshore drilling blow out prevention bundle is...

I didn't say raw materials aren't included in the cost of doing business, but they are generally the smallest % of the cost...

youre comparing something that takes minimal work to something that requires more work again there buddy.

usually when you try to compare similar things, they technically have to be similar... for example mixing ejuices, and mixing powdered drinks...

 

[stevegmu]

,.........

 

[Oberon75]

You're not helping you're argument,
You bought that because you wanted it, a set of steinheiser and the phone without the m'x' could have been cheaper. Its cool. We all fall for ,arletimg once in a while, with fancy words like audiophile.
The bottom line with economics-, supply and demand,..
Arguing on a forum is not going to change prices

Yes. I bought it because I wanted it and I know enough about technology and especially the A/V industry, not to get ripped off and end up with headphones from Beats or Skullcandy.

Same with my vape purchases. I'm not one to follow the Nikoticket brigade like so many new users do on this website.

People come here every day knowing absolutely nothing, starving for information. Then they come here and get the Popular "Sponsored" recommendation. Go on a different board and nobody even mentions Nicoticket because they have a different fetish brand. Now according to that, that's the best and worth every "Premium" penny.

What's really funny about this is arguing with Steve about "Premium" eLiquid. Because he calls Halo, very premium. Now the B&M chain on my area is one of the largest in the country with 55 locations. They are telling all their customers that Halo is not premium and slashed all the prices. All while they push Space Jam and Suicide Bunny onto their customers for $25 a bottle and call it the most "Premium" you can buy.

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition

 

[stevegmu]

Halo is premium for me because of the ingredients used, taste, consistency and customer service. I certainly didn't say it is a premium priced e-liquid...

 

[hurricanegirl100]

IMHO, nobody can take advantage of you without your permission. If you don't like the price, go elsewhere. If you love the juice enough to pay the price, then you're not being taken advantage of. You knew what you were getting into. As for "excellent customer service", same rule applies. If you're not happy, take your money and walk off into the sunset.

And I don't have the room, the time or the tiniest inclination to start DIYing. For some of us, that'll never be an option.

 

[Oberon75]

I agree, for head phones I went Bang and Olufsen.

For headphones, Sennheiser AKG and Beyerdynamic are far better. And Harman Kardon owns AKG.

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition

 

[stevegmu]

IMHO, nobody can take advantage of you without your permission. If you don't like the price, go elsewhere. If you love the juice enough to pay the price, then you're not being taken advantage of. You knew what you were getting into. As for "excellent customer service", same rule applies. If you're not happy, take your money and walk off into the sunset.

But then how will some convince others they are being ripped off, scammed, taken advantage of or being bent over a barrel?

 

[alicewonderland]

I thought it was the holier than thou professional vaper with advanced equipment who makes basement brew better than the premium juice us less evolved vapers buy, who brought me into the discussion...

im pretty sure he was just pointing out the fact that 25$ for a 30ml bottle of eliquid isnt a ripoff to someone who takes 2-4weeks to finish it with a basic ego-style setup. If you look at it at that point of view he is correct, but when you look at it from actual value of ingredients and work put in to create it then notice the 1000%+ markup value then you notice it's a ripoff.

 

[Oberon75]

Halo is premium for me because of the ingredients used, taste, consistency and customer service. I certainly didn't say it is a premium priced e-liquid...

According to one of the biggest chains in thev county, Halo is garbage. Do you see how do you see how that works though?

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition

 

[alicewonderland]

IMHO, nobody can take advantage of you without your permission. If you don't like the price, go elsewhere. If you love the juice enough to pay the price, then you're not being taken advantage of. You knew what you were getting into. As for "excellent customer service", same rule applies. If you're not happy, take your money and walk off into the sunset.

And I don't have the room, the time or the tiniest inclination to start DIYing. For some of us, that'll never be an option.

not having inclination to start DIYing makes sense, but not having the time and room is just a copout . you can hold all the materials you need to DIY eliquid in the palm of one hand, and mix it in the time it takes to take a dump in the bathroom, hell I'll do it for you if you want to pay me 15$ per 30ml bottle

technically that 1000% markup is all just paying them because they dont want to release their 'secret recipe list' for a certain flavor. If you get stuck on that flavor and cant imitate it in anyway then sure its worth it, but is that flavor able to be made for 2$ a bottle? sure as hell. If they can make a flavor you get stuck on, its as easy to make a flavor yourself that you like as well and have your own little recipe.

like vanilla? and gingerbread? want it creamier? add vanilla, gingerbread, and cream flavor and bam! secret recipe only you know, someone should pay you 1$ per ml of a bottle filled with the nectar of the gods.