Called out in staff newsletter...

[Racehorse]

Just putting it out there to see what you all think.

I may be older, but I can tell you that I am always perplexed by how employees perceive how things should run at work these days.

I was usually so busy at work that if I had a few moments to steal 4 drags off a cigarette during the day, I felt lucky.

My concerns at work were mostly that I could become really, really good at what I did, and be recognized for that, so that I could in turn, make a better paycheck and advance my career.


Work is not your house, you are not on your own time, nor on your own premises. You are on the employers time, using their building, lights, air conditioning, heat, etc. They call the shots because they are paying you while you are there.

When I worked full time it was back when women pretty much were expected to wear skirts and panty hose and a dress shoe, and yes, even in hot weather. You did NOT take personal phone calls at work (this is before cell phones, etc.) unless an emergency.

You walked into the door at work, left your problems and personal opinions at home, put your head down and went to work.

We had customers in mission-critical situations, paying millions of dollars for our "product" (whether that be service, legal advice, or merchandise) and that's what you went work for: you earned your paycheck serving the customer and your employer.

All the rest is just lagniappe, like letting you bring your vaping equipment or your dog to work. Some employers like to make things more comfortable and cozy and keep an emotionally happy workforce. I applaud their higher consciousness, but IMHO, perks are earned and so are privileges.

 

[Ayube]

I am happy you could kick your smoking habit but being a vaper now i do pay attention to the others around me even when i vape. Some juices do have a scent to them and are very noticeable. The workplace is just trying to make sure they have their end covered just in case something does happen. There are people who actually have very bad reactions to scents. I think my work has a no perfume/cologne policy in place and although people still do wear perfumes and colognes at the office the policy is still there.

 

[b2darizzle]

Ridiculous. vaping is about as dangerous to those around you as drinking coffee in your office.

*sniff sniff* What's that smell? Oh lawd! He's drinking coffee!

 

[Tommy Aces]

Guys, stuff like the OP and others have experienced is a direct result of bad information making it out into the media and corporate America via the Prohibitionists and Big Pharma

If no one says anything or at the very least provides actual, factual information to the responsible parties, our rights will continue to be hacked away at until e-cigs are no longer a viable option for us.

Take that to the bank!

Edit: And don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that we should be allowed to vape anywhere, anytime. However, what I am saying is that if places choose to ban vaping, they should at least be exposed to facts first.

 

[Tommy Aces]

I am happy you could kick your smoking habit but being a vaper now i do pay attention to the others around me even when i vape. Some juices do have a scent to them and are very noticeable. The workplace is just trying to make sure they have their end covered just in case something does happen. There are people who actually have very bad reactions to scents. I think my work has a no perfume/cologne policy in place and although people still do wear perfumes and colognes at the office the policy is still there.

I'm sorry. And nothing personal, but this is utter nonsense. We are surrounded with billions of scents every minute of every day using that logic, coffee or blueberry muffins should be banned.

 

[drocks27]

Isn't it funny how some people call the vapor smoke, and then they lump PVs into the same category as smokeless tobacco? Make up your mind! lol

 

[R1080]

Racehorse:
I agree with almost everything you said! Just an quick FYI about our company... we still require women to wear skirts and panty hose and a dress shoes. We are in Miami, so it is always hot and if it is not hot it is raining...

About the perfume and other smells... I am extremely sensitive to a lot of that stuff! I get instant headaches, But I have NEVER complained about anyone or anything people use to make their area or themselves smell pleasent (At least to them).

I think Tommy Aces just summed it up. "I'm not saying that we should be allowed to vape anywhere, anytime. However, what I am saying is that if places choose to ban vaping, they should at least be exposed to facts first."

 

[uba egar320]

Racehorse:
I agree with almost everything you said! Just an quick FYI about our company... we still require women to wear skirts and panty hose and a dress shoes. We are in Miami, so it is always hot and if it is not hot it is raining...

About the perfume and other smells... I am extremely sensitive to a lot of that stuff! I get instant headaches, But I have NEVER complained about anyone or anything people use to make their area or themselves smell pleasent (At least to them).

I think Tommy Aces just summed it up. "I'm not saying that we should be allowed to vape anywhere, anytime. However, what I am saying is that if places choose to ban vaping, they should at least be exposed to facts first."

But what are the "facts"? No offense or anything. I'm just not sure what they are...I've been under the assumption that ecigs are "less" harmful than tobacco. I would say that the only solid facts for a company are that production would go up if people didn't have to take nic breaks. Other than that? I don't think we'll know about vaping and it's effects for quite some time.

2cents

 

[patkin]

The SNUS is what gets me... who knows? I mean does anyone know when you're sucking on a candy? Oh well, its an emotional issue and emotions aren't always logical nor even rational. Unfortunately, the nanny state supports the emotional. Pretty soon we'll all be the same proportional weight with the same color eyes modified by contacts and the same color hair modified by dye and ready to change them depending on the preferences of whoever is in power at the moment.

 

[Kataphraktos]

There is more to vaping than just the danger to others. There is proper etiquette. Colognes, smoke, vapor clouds, strong food smells are all not appropriate for a typical work environment. The same goes for music and other distracting sounds.

As one of the top guys in my firm, with my own office, I always go downstairs to vape. As a trader, this sometimes means no vaping 7AM-4PM. I also don't bring DragonFire Lamb Vindaloo to work, nor do I wear cologne.

We Americans have spent the last few decades doing whatever we want, and not caring what other people think. Witness all the freaky pics snapped at Walmarts across the country. While I'm all for personal liberty, it cannot be at the expense of others. Smoking on the sidewalk? That's fine, people can move. Vaping in the workplace? One can't expect people to find a new job just so others can vape.

And who says vaping isn't intrusive? Sure, nicotine might be present in our environment, that doesn't mean it is proper to fill the air with vapors steeped in nicotine. A lot of full-strength vapor escapes during a vape, in addition to all the exhaled reduced-potency vapor that must then be breathed in by others, who may not want to be exposed to levels of nicotine that may or may not lead to addiction.

Now, having said all this, if you want your company to promote vaping as an alternative so as to help turn smokers into ex-smokers, perhaps some creative thinking will help. Providing easily-accessible places for vaping is one example. In the old days, offices had "smoking rooms". Perhaps it is time for a "vaping room" concept. This way, employees aren't forced to walk long distances to get to an outdoor area to vape.

 

[Racehorse]

I agree with everything everybody says here. But it's not about any of those things.

It's about work. It's very simple. While at work, you are on your employer's premises, and on their time.

Believe me, I've left jobs for greener pastures before, many times, while having a big mortgage to pay, etc. But that doesn't change the facts. The fact is that no employer has to let you do anything, except the work they hired you to do and provide legallly mandated breaks and lunch times, and a safe workplace under OSHA rules, and meet wage standards.

Anything other than those things and you are "negotiating". If you don't like the rules, get your resume out to a company that better suits YOUR vales and lifestyle.

 

[seahawkin]

I am waiting for it to happen, truth is most folks at this job and my last turn a blind eye to it cause they want me to quit. Just takes one sandy cha cha complaining and there is goes.

 

[R1080]

Anything other than those things and you are "negotiating". If you don't like the rules, get your resume out to a company that better suits YOUR vales and lifestyle.

Done, but not for the vaping issue. That just seems to be the sugar on top of the cherry on top of the icing on top of the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

[mrpony]

sorry for your difficulties. it was my boss who set me up with electronic cigarettes. im a trim carpenter and i work on high end houses. we arent even allowed to bring food into these buildings
(people dont want to pay 500K for a new house that smells like pizza) and the builder we work for is ok with me using my APV in the house.
i too have been more productive since i started vaping and i no longer come back in from breaks wreaking of cigarettes.
youd think your employer would be happy with the improvement,mine was.
i guess its all just a matter of perception.perhaps they were just trying to appease someone who doesnt understand and complained.

 

[Azmo]

Seems odd as an e-cig doesn't fall under either category. It's not "smokeless tobacco" because there is no tobacco in it.

 

[RosaJ]

Call HR and tell them they forgot to include the nicotine patch and the nic gum. You're exuding nicotine through your pores if you use the patch and through your breath if you're chewing the gum.

 

[Ayube]

I'm sorry. And nothing personal, but this is utter nonsense. We are surrounded with billions of scents every minute of every day using that logic, coffee or blueberry muffins should be banned.

Unfortunately you see it as utter nonsense, but i simply stated the truth.

-certain ejuices do have a scent to them.
-tons of workplaces are required to offer a scent free, clean air environment.

Don't get me wrong. I think it's a bit rubbish myself i was simply pointing out both sides. There are tons of companies with policies such as this. I understand about making people aware of the product etc... but companies are just looking to save their butts. Without the knowledge of knowing exactly what is in an ecig, said company can now blame the ecig for workplace illnesses.

I also speak this from experience so as you may find it rubbish, the company had to comply based on the experience i will list below.

Situation #1: Co-worker starts feeling ill, then blames the vapor from the ecig for it. Co-worker now leaves to go home. Management now looks at work hours lost. What is an employer going to do then?

It's not like the employer can say "well it's ridiculous there is no way in hell this person got sick from ecig vapor"
Nor can they say "this was a direct result of ecig vapor"

Tell me what they are supposed to do in that situation then?

There is also a lady who breaks out into hives whenever she smells strong perfume or even paint fumes. This resulted in the company now paying for her time off work because the clean air environment was not provided but also now stuck with the medical bill or was facing a lawsuit.

Now can you tell me what i stated is complete and utter nonsense? It simply is not just a matter of bad information. I am not trying to start a war here. I was just trying to show the reasons why these companies are putting out these statements like the original post.

 

[yzer]

Basically, an at-will employee (here in CA) can be terminated at any time by the employer and they don't need to provide a reason for it. Bye, you're gone. Pack out this afternoon. If you have another type of employment contract or a union it can be different.

There may be laws that affect using a PV at the workplace.

I believe that every worker has a right to be free from second hand nicotine at the workplace. Employees that are ex-smokers and non-vapers get cranky just at the sight of vapor and I don't blame them.

As a vaper and ex-smoker I have no problem with going outside to vape. Vapers have to get over their attitude of entitlement to vape anywhere they want, regardless of others. I defend the right of vapers to vape outdoors at all times, in their cars, in their residences or while hospitalized and have written my elected representatives accordingly.

 

[AttyPops]

I may be older, but I can tell you that I am always perplexed by how employees perceive how things should run at work these days.

I was usually so busy at work that if I had a few moments to steal 4 drags off a cigarette during the day, I felt lucky.

My concerns at work were mostly that I could become really, really good at what I did, and be recognized for that, so that I could in turn, make a better paycheck and advance my career.


Work is not your house, you are not on your own time, nor on your own premises. You are on the employers time, using their building, lights, air conditioning, heat, etc. They call the shots because they are paying you while you are there.

When I worked full time it was back when women pretty much were expected to wear skirts and panty hose and a dress shoe, and yes, even in hot weather. You did NOT take personal phone calls at work (this is before cell phones, etc.) unless an emergency.

You walked into the door at work, left your problems and personal opinions at home, put your head down and went to work.

We had customers in mission-critical situations, paying millions of dollars for our "product" (whether that be service, legal advice, or merchandise) and that's what you went work for: you earned your paycheck serving the customer and your employer.

All the rest is just lagniappe, like letting you bring your vaping equipment or your dog to work. Some employers like to make things more comfortable and cozy and keep an emotionally happy workforce. I applaud their higher consciousness, but IMHO, perks are earned and so are privileges.

I 'liked' your post in principal. Obvious exclusions exist, however. Surfing ECF from work (during breaks/lunch?) is the most notable exception.

+1 Racehorse for using "lagniappe"

+1 to everyone...this thread took longer to go off track than the last one:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/425041-email-i-got-my-manager.html

OK. On to the main rant that employers can't set air quality standards.....

 

[Racehorse]

Done, but not for the vaping issue. That just seems to be the sugar on top of the cherry on top of the icing on top of the straw that broke the camel's back.

I wish you a LOT of luck, R1080, who knows, perhaps as a result of this you will end up in a much better situation overall.

here's hoping.......