Cloud9vaping pulls Five Pawns and other liquids from the shelf after testing.

[nancybout]

And oddly cheaper stores like mount baker have none! Just wow!


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[LouisLeBeau]

I just wanted to say that after all of this, I don't now somehow dislike the couple 5P liquids I did previously like. My thing is this:

Since they (5P) like to proclaim and tout how professional they are, what perfectionist they are and how industry-leading they are (and they surely do love to make those claims), they could have---by way of example, and in a very visible way---lead the eliquid industry in a positive direction by either a) pulling the existing flavors and reformulating them to be as they said they were, b) reformulating those liquids to come as DA/AP free, but keeping the others available and offering customers the choice to pick, or c) came out immediately after getting their results---last year---and issued an apology for their oversight and a re-commitment to becoming who they thought themselves to have already been. And if they would've just done any one of those three things, Cloud 9 would've never been in a position to do what they had to do---which is why we are here now.

Yes, the BIG thing here for me is that 5P was in the perfect position (for their size and popularity) to lead by example, but what they did was no different than many of those they purport themselves to be better than. And let the record show, 5P could've done what Steve at Mountain Oak Vapor did (a couple years ago) when he first learned of one of his flavorings having DA. He immediately owned up to it publicly and then pulled the flavoring and liquids that used it from his stock and then resourced/reforumlated. And the heat was not even on him! He did that on his own. So the message to 5Pawns is this: it's one thing to say you are a leader, it's another thing to actually be one.

Agreed. They could and should have done EVERYthing different than they did. Before, During and After the issues came to light. But they didn't. They had MANY opportunities to come clean, apologize and make it right. They didn't, and they haven't, and they probably at this point, won't. It's not just one instance of misjudgement, but a continuing unrelenting pattern of behavior that gives absolutely NO hope or indication that they will EVER do the right thing. Not in the past, not in the future. It's really that bold, and that bad.

Nobody would expect you to change your opinion of the flavors! It's been stated. Diketones are YUMMY! So is butter, sugar, bacon, salt, the list goes on. Seems life can be yummy, or life can be long. But life can't be yummy for long.

 

[Stubby]

And oddly cheaper stores like mount baker have none! Just wow!


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Where are you getting the information that they have none. I know they do state on their site that their liquids are diacetyl free, but that doesn't mean anything without the testing and documentation.

 

[AstroTurf]

Agreed. They could and should have done EVERYthing different than they did. Before, During and After the issues came to light. But they didn't. They had MANY opportunities to come clean, apologize and make it right. They didn't, and they haven't, and they probably at this point, won't. It's not just one instance of misjudgement, but a continuing unrelenting pattern of behavior that gives absolutely NO hope or indication that they will EVER do the right thing. Not in the past, not in the future. It's really that bold, and that bad.

Nobody would expect you to change your opinion of the flavors! It's been stated. Diketones are YUMMY! So is butter, sugar, bacon, salt, the list goes on. Seems life can be yummy, or life can be long. But life can't be yummy for long.

You Sir should read their website...

 

[kates]

But, Cloud9 Continues to sell it for another month after knowing... Way to go Cloud9!!!

This has been covered earlier in the thread. They got the results on May 5th, contacted 5P to discuss. 5P wouldn't correspond in writing presumably due to the fact (as we now know) their own results from 8/9 months earlier also showed very high levels of ap. The stock was returned. Cloud 9 state very clearly on their site they do not sell da/ap liquids and would have made 'unavailable' until this was resolved - probably assuming it was something 5P would be eager to correct, they would want to investigate why the high results and they would replace with non a/p stuff in the meantime. Of course this didn't happen as 5P knew the levels were high so no need to investigate etc. Whether you are happy to vape their juice or not - surely you have to admit they have been at the very least dishonest?

 

[LouisLeBeau]

You Sir should read their website...

I did read it, including the new "Be Informed" page. I'd read it again, but I'm presently working my way through Douglas Adams "The Ultimate HitchHikers Guide" and I'm afraid that my quota of silly fiction has already been spoken for, today.

 

[EleanorR]

I did read it, including the new "Be Informed" page. I'd read it again, but I'm presently working my way through Douglas Adams "The Ultimate HitchHikers Guide" and I'm afraid that my quota of silly fiction has already been spoken for, today.

Hee hee.

Ah, "AstroTurf." How very apropos.

 

[kates]

I don’t want anything I say to be seen as an attack on 5P vapers – I can see if you have no problem with high ap it may seem irrelevant - but surely everyone can see there are many 5p customers who don’t want to vape a/p and thought that they weren’t vaping it when they purchased the 5P juices that contain it? I see that as deceitful and dishonest - 5P led them to believe this knowing what the truth was in their own 2014 test results. If Cloud 9 hadn't drawn attention to this this there would have been many, many more vaping it unintentionally which is just not acceptable.

Over time I think many will (and are) reviewing their policies on publishing their test results as this has meant that trust is no longer so easily given. Ultimately surely we all want the right to choose whether we vape chemicals with potential problems and this means transparency and honesty are vital?

 

[BigEgo]

To people who say traditional cigs have Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl and asking why nobody get popcorn lung from cigs until now. The answer is so simple, when you smoke cigs, DA and AP gets burned about 1.000 celcius. At that high heat, DA and AP loses their harmfull chemical functions before they reach to lungs.

Diacetyl is found in cigarette smoke, meaning it is there after the tobacco has been burned. So, your hypothesis is wrong.

A better explanation is that the diacetyl enters the lungs differently in cigarette smokers than it does factory workers breathing it in the ambient air. In other words, it gets deeper into the lungs in the workers than it does in smokers.

 

[AstroTurf]

As a celebration of My First Independence Day from Smoking...

I just ordered a big fat juicy bottle of Five Pawns Castle Long.

Look, its like this, I don't know you or them. I know what I like, and will not be swayed by any.

I'll pay for my sins in the end like everyone else.

Happy Independence Day Everyone!!!

Jim

 

[zoiDman]

...

Happy Independence Day Everyone!!!

Jim

Hope you have a Great 4th of July also.

 

[LouisLeBeau]

As a celebration of My First Independence Day from Smoking...

I just ordered a big fat juicy bottle of Five Pawns Castle Long.

Look, its like this, I don't know you or them. I know what I like, and will not be swayed by any.

I'll pay for my sins in the end like everyone else.

Happy Independence Day Everyone!!!

Jim

I fully respect your decision. In the end, it may turn out that many of us were all concerned about nothing. And we all have to weigh our joys in life against their potential repercussions. At least now, you KNOW what the potential hazards might be in your choices. That's really all that the screaming is about. Happy Holiday to you! I'll be grillin my ribs on the BBQ, and I know what THOSE repercussions might be, and I'm OK with that too.

Bon Appétit!

 

[Lemwise]

Happy 4th of July Lem!!!

Heres how I'm celebrating... Care to join me?!?

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Not particularly. Vape as much DA/AP as you want but I won't be joining you.

 

[AstroTurf]

Not particularly. Vape as much DA/AP as you want but I won't be joining you.

If your ejuice has not been tested with a standardized test... You may very well be... Joining me.

Cheers, Jim

 

[Rossum]

It doesn't bother me at all if people decide to vape liquids that contain high levels of diketones. You own your body, do as you please with it. What bothers me is when people continue to patronize companies who've engaged in deceptive business practices and used intimidation in an attempt to suppress the info when those deceptive practiced were exposed.

 

[AstroTurf]

It doesn't bother me at all if people decide to vape liquids that contain high levels of diketones. You own your body, do as you please with it. What bothers me is when people continue to patronize companies who've engaged in deceptive business practices and used intimidation in an attempt to suppress the info when those deceptive practiced were exposed.

You dont by any chance buy chinese stuff do you?

 

[nancybout]

I am now concerned and where do we purchase ""checked"" juice? I never thought of this before & I prefer having DA free.. Whatever I Vaped unknowingly is one thing.


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[Rossum]

You dont by any chance buy chinese stuff do you?

Not if I can possibly avoid it, no.

 

[Robino1]

Interesting thoughts can be found here: Confused about Diacetyl? You should be - read now | Page 6 | E-Cigarette Forum

Please read the post above mine in that thread also.

 

[SeniorBoy]

I am now concerned and where do we purchase ""checked"" juice? I never thought of this before & I prefer having DA free.. Whatever I Vaped unknowingly is one thing. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would suggest that you start your journey by reading Confused about diacetyl? You should be Written by the founder of ECF, it's a great read to understand the issues we are dealing with. As the article points out, it's a very complex issue with various opinions and challenges. For example, a given juice or flavor concentrate can be "DA free" but still contain AP.

Please don't hesitate to ask questions.