Comparing Vaping to Smoking?

[Topacka]

A lot of my friends vape. We all have fun talkin' shop, trying each other's set ups, all sorts of stuff.

About half of them never smoked, maybe a quarter quit smoking by vaping, and then the rest smoke and vape interchangeably.

In my eyes, and the eyes of the people I've talked to, vaping can help you stop smoking, sure but that's not what it has to be, it's a worthwhile hobby in it's own right. It's not just about harm reduction.

Most of the people on this site, and all other websites dedicated to vaping assume that because you vape, you're using it to quit smoking, have quit with it as an aid, or are using it as a substitute smoking when you can't smoke. There are arguments wether or not you should vape if you aren't a smoker. There are statements in response to threads that say things like, "push through that vapers tongue man, it's better than smoking!" or "just remember, it's better than the stinkies!".

How do you feel about this? Do you feel that we, as a community, should look down on people who's first introduction to nicotine is through vapor, not smoke? Are you surprised when vapers haven't smoked cigarettes before? Do you feel like this hobby is exclusively for nicotine replacement therapy? What's your opinion?

 

[Rappy]

I loved smoking. I quit because I don't want to reek like smoke around my baby daughter...... My health was not a concern in my choice to quit. Mainly because I smoked organic rolling tobacco w/unbleached paper. In my opinion this didnt affect my health in any measurable way. ---- I quit because of the smell of smoke being annoying to my loved ones.
Met a few people who smoke and vape. Sure. Do what you want. Not for me, but hell yea, fight the man. Maybe someone has never smoked tobacco and decides they want to vape. I think thats fine. People drawn to a nic addiction would have found it out anyways, by some means.
Weather a smoking replacement or not, Vaping is a great experience. I dont look down on anyone! Happy when anyone vapes. Even the gas station brands. If they are the slightest bit curious they will upgrade sooner than later.

 

[CrazyDamon]

Vaping got me off cigarettes, almost 4 months ago. I feel like I can breathe again. It really has changed my life.

With that being said, I wouldn't be against someone jumping into vaping. With as much as we know about it nowadays, it's so much better than analogs. I would much rather see them vape and enjoy it as much as I do, than smoke those.

 

[LaDiablo]

I think a lot of people are against non-smokers vaping because it's what media and politicians point to as a reason to ban vaping. The media proposes it as a "gateway drug" to smoking analogs, and a "cool new technology" that teens are picking up for fun only to find themselves addicted to nicotine. It just kind of breaks down the harm reduction argument for not banning ecigs.

Maybe it isn't 100% rational, but that's the idea anyway.

 

[umarbutt610]

I picked up vaping to quit analogs. I started at 24 mg, right now at 18, ordered my next to be 12. Want to bring it down to 0 and then hopefully quit it all together. I believe it is a bad influence to my kids and feel bad even vaping in front of my kids. But that is just me. I would rather have rf planes, painting etc as a hobby for them.

 

[ScottP]

If a non smoker wants to vape then fine. I would suggest using zero nic juice though. They get the flavor and never have to worry about picking up an addiction.

 

[twgbonehead]

I think a lot of people are against non-smokers vaping because it's what media and politicians point to as a reason to ban vaping. The media proposes it as a "gateway drug" to smoking analogs, and a "cool new technology" that teens are picking up for fun only to find themselves addicted to nicotine. It just kind of breaks down the harm reduction argument for not banning ecigs.

Maybe it isn't 100% rational, but that's the idea anyway.

Yes, but the same people who put forth that argument seem to ignore the high number of kids who start smoking every year.

Personally, I think it would be fantastic if we started to see a trend of fewer kids starting to smoke, but deciding to vape instead.
From ACS:
In 2012, 18% of high school girls and 23% of high school boys used some form of tobacco at least one day in the month before the survey
Each day, nearly 4,000 kids under the age of 18 try their first cigarette and another 1,000 become regular, daily smokers

Now perhaps the ACS wouldn't agree, but I think if those 1000/day that became regular smokers became regular vapers instead, we'd be way ahead of the game.

And I haven't ever heard a SINGLE story of someone who started out vaping, and then switched to cigarettes. The only way I could see that happening would be if e-cigarettes became illegal or got taxed outrageously.

 

[Kim B.]

Speaking for myself, vaping has been a Godsend for me, I was able to break a 38 year cigarette addiction by vaping. In the 5 months I've been vaping I've been able to cut my nicotine level from 24 mg to 12 mg. Do I look down on non smokers vaping? No way! Personally, I think that if someone wants to use nicotine vaping is a far wiser choice than smoking. If people vape just for the juice taste and enjoy vaping as a hobby and never add nicotine to their juice, that's cool with me too.

 

[TheReign]

I started smoking when I was 15 years old. If vaping was out back then i would have kicked the habit so much earlier. It's cool for people to vape no nicotine, Just don't get why someone who never smoked Stink sticks would want to vape nicotine? To me that just doesn't make sense at all you know what i mean? There was a thread a couple days ago where this kid started vaping after his mom denied trying it to quit smoking. He said he liked the buzz and light headedness of it an got ripped a new one. No offense to anyone who never smoked and vapes nicotine but seriously it's not the way you should be getting into it, 0 nic is the way to go.

 

[jimbol]

I don’t know if I would characterize the attitude about non-smokers vaping as ‘looking down’. We smokers who have switched (or used vaping to cut down) are aware that we got addicted. The knee-jerk thought is that it was nicotine that did it. Probably that’s true but we’ve come to realize there are other elements that added or enhanced that addiction. The question is that a non-smoker vaping with nicotine risks addiction. Since the method of delivery is different I wonder if that addiction would be more severe/intense than caffeine addiction. Since things like the patch don’t work well for quitting for but a few and vaping (statistically) isn’t much better; what is the risk? An interesting question.

 

[Charon]

If, as a community, we're going to accept the evidence that demonstrates vaping as a harmless activity, we must also accept the evidence that nicotine in itself is addictive, but also relatively harmless medically (in small amounts), and in some cases beneficial. Such as treatment for schizophrenia, blood pressure issues, and BPD.

My Lady's 90 something year old grandfather has some severe blood pressure issues, about a decade ago, his Doctor told him, "You know what, we could give you a prescription for something expensive, but I actually advise you consider chewing tobacco." Bluntly, he's old, and even if he makes it to 110, it's not going to damage him faster than age will at this point.

He's a working blacksmith and a gear-head, rebuilds Model-T's for fun to this day. I'm going to try and suggest to him he switch to vapor. He'll love the tech toys, I'm sure, and I'd feel better for one awesome old guy saving some money and having more fun with his treatment. ;>

 

[Topacka]

I started smoking when I was 15 years old. If vaping was out back then i would have kicked the habit so much earlier. It's cool for people to vape no nicotine, Just don't get why someone who never smoked Stink sticks would want to vape nicotine? To me that just doesn't make sense at all you know what i mean? There was a thread a couple days ago where this kid started vaping after his mom denied trying it to quit smoking. He said he liked the buzz and light headedness of it an got ripped a new one. No offense to anyone who never smoked and vapes nicotine but seriously it's not the way you should be getting into it, 0 nic is the way to go.

So, this is a pretty common argument.

But, it's akin to saying, why don't you smoke herbal cigarettes instead of tobacco cigarettes? Instead of using dip, use Bakkoff.

It really is like saying that. And, to be perfectly honest, it doesn't make sense, not really. The point of vaping is to put nicotine into your body through the vaporization of nicotine laden glycol/glycerine. Now, being able to slowly back off of nicotine for a current tobacco addict makes perfect sense, but it really doesn't, IMHO, for a non-tobacco using new vaper.

 

[Stubby]

My Lady's 90 something year old grandfather has some severe blood pressure issues, about a decade ago, his Doctor told him, "You know what, we could give you a prescription for something expensive, but I actually advise you consider chewing tobacco." Bluntly, he's old, and even if he makes it to 110, it's not going to damage him faster than age will at this point.


He's a working blacksmith and a gear-head, rebuilds Model-T's for fun to this day. I'm going to try and suggest to him he switch to vapor. He'll love the tech toys, I'm sure, and I'd feel better for one awesome old guy saving some money and having more fun with his treatment. ;>

Why would you try and get him off of smokeless tobacco. Smokeless tobacco has the same low risk as vaping. If he has already made the transition to a low risk product why would you want to mess with him.




As for the original question. It's foolish to think that as vaping becomes more popular non-tobacco users will not start using it, but you really have to dig a bit deeper to understand the real issues.

The goal of the ANTZ is a tobacco/nicotine free world where no one develops a dependency. The problem with that idea is that it is a utopian fantasy. It is not going to happen in the real world. As people get better educated about tobacco harm reduction and find out that there are ways of using tobacco and nicotine that are about 99% less harmful then cigarettes it is unrealistic to believe that people who have never used tobacco, or have previously quit but miss it, will not start using low risk tobacco/nicotine products.

It is not necessary to try to stop non-tobacco users from trying low risk products, but it is necessary to make sure people are well informed as to what it is they are doing. If people are going to use tobacco/nicotine (and people will continue to do so) they need to be informed that as far as health goes the method of delivery is everything. Stay away from combustable tobacco products and it is highly unlikely someone will ever develop any health issues associate with cigarettes. As long as people are well informed on that issue and understand that they can develop a dependency its none of mine, or anyone else's business what they do.

 

[Kim B.]

It's foolish to think that as vaping becomes more popular non-tobacco users will not start using it, but you really have to dig a bit deeper to understand the real issues.

The goal of the ANTZ is a tobacco/nicotine free world where no one develops a dependency. The problem with that idea is that it is a utopian fantasy. It is not going to happen in the real world. As people get better educated about tobacco harm reduction and find out that there are ways of using tobacco and nicotine that are about 99% less harmful then cigarettes it is unrealistic to believe that people who have never used tobacco, or have previously quit but miss it, will not start using low risk tobacco/nicotine products.

It is not necessary to try to stop non-tobacco users from trying low risk products, but it is necessary to make sure people are well informed as to what it is they are doing. If people are going to use tobacco/nicotine (and people will continue to do so) they need to be informed that as far as health goes the method of delivery is everything. Stay away from combustable tobacco products and it is highly unlikely someone will ever develop any health issues associate with cigarettes. As long as people are well informed on that issue and understand that they can develop a dependency its none of mine, or anyone else's business what they do.

Very well said, I completely agree.

 

[twgbonehead]

So, this is a pretty common argument.

But, it's akin to saying, why don't you smoke herbal cigarettes instead of tobacco cigarettes? Instead of using dip, use Bakkoff.

It really is like saying that. And, to be perfectly honest, it doesn't make sense, not really. The point of vaping is to put nicotine into your body through the vaporization of nicotine laden glycol/glycerine. Now, being able to slowly back off of nicotine for a current tobacco addict makes perfect sense, but it really doesn't, IMHO, for a non-tobacco using new vaper.

I have to agree. Nicotine is the Pleasant part of the cigarette, but with cigarettes you also get all the other crap.

With e-cigarettes, you can still get the pleasant part, without any of the bad stuff. Nicotine isn't much different than caffeine, and it has some pluses and some minuses with regards to health.
My doctor (a real pita, by the way) is satisfied that I'm vaping instead of smoking. Now wants me to lose 15 pounds and get more exercise; these are much greater concerns for my health than the nicotine is.

 

[Charon]

Why would you try and get him off of smokeless tobacco. Smokeless tobacco has the same low risk as vaping. If he has already made the transition to a low risk product why would you want to mess with him.

Except for that being unable to taste anything, and needing a place to spit all day.

 

[Bunnykiller]

Even with the "witch hunt" mentality against ciggies, vaping, nicotine addiction going on, people are going to do what they want to do... I would rather see someone who has never smoked go to vaping instead of ciggies. Vaping is so much better than smoking, it reduces the number of ciggie butts at the stop lights.

 

[Eranda13]

I quit a 30+ year habit with vaping, and I'm never going back. Especially after the cancer diagnosis

With that said... I work in a vape shop part time. We have everything from eGo starters to mech mods and drippers. I'm really surprised at how many people come in who have never smoked in their lives- especially young people. I think they see it as a way to be "cool" and smoke without all the danger. And people are really drawn to the high-tech look of the stuff.

I feel a little conflicted about selling a 22 year old a setup when they've never smoked before. I know they're adults and can make their own choices, but I wonder why they want to vape at all? We do offer 0 nic juice and I always steer them to that, but still... I didn't expect to sell to anyone who had never smoked. It's odd if you ask me.

But the reality is that if they vape 0 nic, what's the harm? Chances are they will never feel the same way about vaping as someone who smoked for many years, and they will stop after the fad part of it slows down.

 

[Harlen]

95% of the people I know tried vaping to get off the cigarets and have tried menny methods to quit but just was unable to stay off them.
Now all of them are vaper's some don't even vape now and are off the cigarets .

 

[Rickajho]

The issue as I see it is people who quit smoking and started vaping are coming at this from the perspective of harm reduction. We do know what smoking does to you. There are certain things we can assume, at best, as to why vaping is less harmful that smoking. But if you come in here trying to justify vaping for someone who has never smoked with a "What's the harm?" argument the fact is we don't know and you don't either. It may be a considered a "hobby" to a non smoker, but you will have to get back to us in 20 years or so and then tell us what the harm is or is not. Right now with more and more people cloud chasing and ingesting larger and larger amounts of the contents in vaping liquids "What the harm"? keeps being a moving target with no research to answer that question.

Short version: I only vape because I smoked. I wasn't looking for a poops and giggles hobby.