DinosaurVapor

[lintz69]

I don't know. But the testimonials IS working because Silence(John) left a testimonial feedback and worked fine. I am really surprised more people aren't going on and giving them a peice of their mind. People are complaining here (Justifiably so) but not on the site that could help maybe make a difference. Ok, so this is selfish of me, but I don't want to completely take his site down due to a fight between my ethics and my morals. But I was thinking if EVERYONE who is having problems (looks at everyone here lol) posted a flame testimonial, then he will either a point his domain somewhere else(my ethics and morals can rest at night) or b people will see that and not order from any of hsi sites (again, my morals and ethics can sleep at night)...

But for crying out loud people...Leave feedback on his site so my ethics can finally sleep. lol

 

[68stang]

I dont see how taking down a website you built and host for free thats ripped so many people off would be a moral problem for you?

 

[lintz69]

I dont see how taking down a website you built and host for free thats ripped so many people off would be a moral problem for you?

Morally it's not. My Morals(what my parents taught me) says he is screwing people, I should do anything in my power to take down his site and kick his ... if I lived close enough. So no problems AT ALL morally.

It's ETHICALLY that I have a problem. Ethically if he was a paying customer, then regardless of how he ran his business, it is not up to me to do anything to his service. I cannot control businesses, nor is it my responsibility. So ethically I should not do anything. Then again, I should have had some type of "terms and conditions" that included "screwing customers you go bye bye" but I didn't. So business ethics states that my "business" is to design and host his site. Not tell him how to run it.

Where I am getting twisted, is the 2 are arguing lol. I am pulled between doing what is ethically right and morally right. In this case, unfortunately they are not the same. You have to understand my point. I don't KNOW what the right decision is. And I am a reasonable person, who does not make decisions lightly.

The other thing, that I am not sure of, is "ethically" a "paying" customer I would definitely not take down. But he didn't pay. And it is my server, and I was helping him free. So I am on disability. This is a hobby, not a business. I am not making money. So am I still bound by the same "business ethics." And the answer is I don't know.

Please, please, please do not think that I am leaving it up there because I support his actions, or because I don't care about you guys. Because I msot certainly do. YOU guys have been there for me when he has not. My loyalty is, was, and always will be to this forum as it is the closest thing(sadly enough) to a family as I have. And I want nothing more(morally) than to take it down.

I just am a fair person, and am trying to decide the appropriate actions to take. To me, nothing is ever black and white. You ask me "do you want mc donalds or burger king" It will take me an hour to decide. Well mcd's is cheaper with dollar menu, but burger kind is better meat. But mcds has sweet tea, but burgerking has....." I have hard times making decisions, and in cases like this I want to make the right one.

I feel at the moment I have made a good compromise. His "store" part that I have control of is shut down. Nothing can be ordered. I have added a "testimonials" to give everyone here a voice (where I can not ethically have). I cannot ethically even leave a testimonial saying "I made this site but he is screwing people". Again ethically I cannot do that. So the compromise at this moment is: He can't sell anything. You guys have a voice. Hopefully he will decide "If I can't sell anything, and everyone is bad mouthing me, I am going to take this site down before it reflects badly upon my other site". Thus I have made a decision, without making a decision. I am playing a game of chess. I can't just kill the dang king, but I will make it so he has to make a move that will end this game.


So to anyone that is upset at me for not just shutting it down, I truly, honestly apologize. And I really do hope, from the bottom of my heart, that you guys can at least see the dillema this has put me in. And hopefully you can see(after my multiple walls of text) that this is a very personal matter to me, and that it has me confused and conflicted. And I wish all of you the best, and wish you all to get your money back. I wish you would post your negative feedbacks on his site. But at this moment I am unsure.

I started helping people as I stated above because of how people helped me. But this one situation is making me question whether or not I should keep trying to help people with websites? It's not worth me losing my dear friends on here for stupid things like this. It's not worth the (quite literally) sleepless nights I have had of recent. But I don't want one bad apple to spoil the rest. But then again, I have helped about 12 people with websites. Maybe that has been enough to fulfill my karma obligation, and I should start charging, even a minimal amount so that this won't be an issue. But I am afraid of charging becasue I can't lose my disability for "working" now when I can't do this full time due to mental issues.


Sorry, once again I am sure this is a big wall, and I again apologize for the wall of text. Hopefully it clarifies why I have not taken it down, and belays my apologies to you all.

Your true friend on the forums(whether I know you or not we are memebrs of this wonderful forum making us friends)

Joshua

 

[lintz69]

Dang... That was a big wall. I am sorry. Feel free to skip it. lol sorry. Just had to get that out.

 

[Wireguy]

Hey lintz, don't worry about it. I've kept up with the drama and your needs in this. When you get a couple of more sites to reference then pull it down.

 

[316lvm]

Hi Lintz -
I've been following this "drama" with Dino, you, members and customers.

Hopefully he will decide "If I can't sell anything, and everyone is bad mouthing me, I am going to take this site down before it reflects badly upon my other site".
Joshua

You are assuming he has the same moral and ethical values as you. He doesn't as has been shown by his actions. I'm sure he could give a rat's poot wether it reflects badly on his other sites or himself. If you read his postings and his customer postings you'll see that while he was supposed to be filling orders and mailing them, he was online goofing off.

As for your disability - I totally understand. I don't know about where you live, but here in Minnesota - those on disability can work up to a certain amount per year for 3 years without having our disability taken away. Do you have an advocate or social worker? If not, I'd suggest contacting your mental health organization and getting one. NAMI is also another place to look for assistance.

You can PM me if you want someone to talk to about. I supervised a clinic in Phoenix with 1,600 patients and 200 case workers. Made $165,000 a year down to $661.00 on disability. So I know.

You have done everything you need to do - don't need to apologize. The thing is, there will come a time when ETHICALLY - you need to take care of YOU. If you can't take care of you, and your world is upside down, then you won't be able to help others down the line.

I will keep you in my prayers, and if you EVER, EVER, EVER, need anything - juice, atty's, someone to talk to, whatever, don't ever hestitate to contact me. If I can help, I will.

Best and keep on keeping on.

 

[68stang]

Dang... That was a big wall. I am sorry. Feel free to skip it. lol sorry. Just had to get that out.

It's ok bro you are in a bad spot! Ethically speaking he has not payed youand ethically if you do not pay for your services you loose said services...which means you can take it down Ethically he isn't paying (even if you never intended to have him pay hes not paying) If I don't pay for my cable they shut it off. You are definitely not doing a bad thing if you take his site down

 

[doots]

I think it is easy really to determine what to do.

If he isnt paying you take his site down. send him a copy of his cpanel file and wish hm good luck somewhere else.

 

[macscac]

just an update..
i did file a paypal dispute and my funds were replaced today by paypal.
so im happy.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Ok, maybe I'm missing something here, but I understand lintz69's reasoning and agree. With the amount of posters with complaints on this thread, why are not more leaving comments on the site?

 

[68stang]

lol I was bored and went to there website...it says on top 'get them before they go extinct" kind of ironic now huh? lmao

 

[kase]

Hahha, I thought that too. LOL

 

[lintz69]

For what it's worth, I tried to contact him again. He never responds unless I "embarress him". So here is one screenshot of me professionally calling him out, and a screenshot of his QUICK reply.

 

[CloudBurst]

I read his old posts as well, when I was waiting a month for my order...you're tight! OH MY...I got my battys but, no more orders from me!

Good $0.01 Light

My $0.02 would have been far less kind with out doubt.
I did read Dino's posts when he hit ECF.

Oh my.

 

[Ellis]

He took me for a $15.00 money order(he was nice and knocked a $1.93 off my total purchase price), which I sent on Jan 7th. I just called his voicemail and left a message telling him that I am contacting the money order company, the BBB, and his local police department tomorrow if I do not hear back from him, and I will. After I left my message I thought I would come here and check to see if anybody else had been ripped off and I found this thread. In my message I told him it was not about the money now. On the 14th of Jan. I asked him:

Hi Brandon.......................just checking to see if you had received my money order yet?

His e-mail reply:

I got it today =]

Will be out tomorrow

I have e-mailed him SEVERAL times since then and received no reply. I am not one to stand for fraud. It's illegal and very easy to do something about it. Not very easy to get your money back but very easy to get the process started and let the person commiting the fraud to know that it will not be tolerated. I would not care if my money order was for $1.00, I will not accept having my money stolen. Just think, if every person he ripped off did the same thing I am going to do, he would be arrested for fraud, and in my case mail fraud, in a very short period of time.

P.S. I can't believe the guy who built the site will not take it down. If it were not for the site I would have had no way to contact him to place my order( at least that I know of and that's all that really matters in my case). What if one of the website designers potential paying customers(it could happen) googles Dinosaur vapor and finds this thread? Talk about ethics!!!!! Just my two cents. Just think how many people are being taken via the search engines directing them to dinovapor, in which he built!! Not to mention how many people are being taken via search engines and have no idea this forum exist, with the designer of the dinovapor site defending his positiong on ethics LOL! What a bunch of . A huge steaming pile of . What do you think ALL those ripped off consumers would say to him? It's a no brainer. Rant over, back to planning all my free legal options with dinovapor.

 

[Thyestean]

The site that is referred to in this thread has been disabled for taking orders and only left up for people to leave comments on to warn others of his "business practices". The other site that was still up and running and able to take orders, last I checked about a week ago, is run by a different company entirely.

 

[firhill]

P.S. I can't believe the guy who built the site will not take it down.

What do you think ALL those ripped off consumers would say to him?

I think maybe, thanks to the site builder leaving it up, it's the only way ALL the perturbed consumers can say something to him.

 

[Thyestean]

Not to mention how many people are being taken via search engines and have no idea this forum exist, with the designer of the dinovapor site defending his positiong on ethics LOL! What a bunch of. A huge steaming pile of. What do you think ALL those ripped off consumers would say to him? It's a no brainer. Rant over, back to planning all my free legal options with dinovapor.

So even though you asked the questions and I responded, and explained to you about the two different sites and why the one is still up, you still found it necessary to edit your post 12 minutes later and add quite a bit of that "rant" into your post?

Why bother asking questions if you obviously don't care about the answers?

 

[Ellis]

So even though you asked the questions and I responded, and explained to you about the two different sites and why the one is still up, you still found it necessary to edit your post 12 minutes later and add quite a bit of that "rant" into your post?

Why bother asking questions if you obviously don't care about the answers?

Hey Einstein....I was editing typos. I had no idea I had a response right after I hit enter. But that is neither here nor there, the topic is the website and fraud. Further more, speaking of the website, I only know of one Dinosaur Vapor - Home. If you go to the website, it has a "contact us" button. Which gives you his cell phone number. This is how orders are still being placed(including my own). For all those on this thread that have actually lost money to this guy.......... I just got off the phone with moneygram and they verified my money order had been cashed. Next call is to his local police department. If you have been scammed by this guy, I suggest you call them as well so they can see this is not an isolated crime.

 

[doots]

good idea to report to local police. I dont know how much good it will achieve but it needs to be done. They may ask or demand that the webhost take down the siteor go to the domain registrar and request that this site be taken off line.