DIY issues.

[ronchinoy]

I finally figured out how to find my own threads on ECF lol.
Thank you so much for all the tips.
I would like to return something to the community. Just stuff I have not read anywhere else.

a. Find a good clean PG / VG vendor. I found mine at a lab supplier. Rates differ. I have paid 25 cents to 10 ML. And the same shop has 100 ML for 25 cents. The costlier the VG the better it vapes. But all this became moot when I found the lab vendor. He charges about 10$ for 500 ML of Lab grade PG / VG. This made a huge diff to my taste.

b. Do not try to mix anything in pure VG its too thick and flavors do not mix. And take ages. PG is the key. If VG refuses to infuse a flavor. Then PG is the bang opp. it sucks the flavor in. Even though PG is new to me and I dont like the idea of vaping it as much as I do VG. Why ?. I touched some and it generated heat on my hand. Dont want that stuff in my lungs. Just an un-educated thing. But Now Im using at least 10% PG just to let it suck up the flavors. So first I pour out my PG. Then I add the flavor. Then mix them then add the PG and then Mix.
Same thing goes for all my DIY NETs and flavors. Was getting nothing with VG. Used PG and bang my NETs are now smelling like tobacco.

c. When winding coils. Use a small fine pitch bolt. It gaps your coils perfect. And the coils come out perfect. Burn the coil to red on the bolt unscrew bolt and you have a perfect coil. Im machining up a few winding mandrels for friends. Ill post up a few pics when done. One if for RBA and one if for Kanger tanks.

d. Yes for some reason steeping is required for these perfume type flavors. I am experimenting with the flavors we get locally. These are 100% natural flavors i.e. the perfume component is zero. When you vape it you get strong flavor. It even makes you feel full. You belch and Im finally able to drop under the 100 Kg Mark. Cause vaping makes me feel full. You still need to have your meals on time. Cause the stomach is se......g acids to dissolve the food it things your eating. But its nice to see both sides of the fence. Local Flavors 0% perfume. American Flavors 100% perfume. Both work well. I switch between them to re-set taste buds.

e. When it comes to Tobacco Flavors. I think its best to just go buy the hangseng concentrate. The top 3 for me are 1. Indian Tobacco, 2. RY1 3. Camel. Little or no steeping. Compared to TFA. And tastes really good.

I got my 2nd consignment from WizLabs. Super service super rates. But the one new flavor I was keen to try the honey tobacco. Bottle broke. I also got some Tobacco Absolete Rustica and Bulgarian. Could not find any info on these two.

Also little or no info on Irish Cream and Cognac.

My plan is to give up on trying to mix something smokeable with the flavors. And instead just use the flavors as an addition to my NET.

Once again thanks for being so friendly and welcoming.

 

[ronchinoy]

Oh and I dont have any caramel or sweetener. So Im trying to make my own brown sugar extract.
First attempt with VG failed. 2nd time with PG and its getting there.
My new order has a flavor called. Tobacco Type Flavor Concentrate (TFA)
What kind of flavor does this give. Is this the same flavor you refer to in your RY4 doble flavor ?

Also have 2 flavors from SM
Commercial Tobacco Flavor Concentrate (SM)
Virginia Fire-Cured Tobacco Flavor Concentrate (SM)

Need to look up how people are using these. Or if I should just stick them into my NET

 

[RogerWilco357]

let us know how the SM works out for you . I to have these on my list of must buy..I hear Seedmans is good for mixing Ry4 batches and want to try mixing my own Ry4 with heavy notes of Vanilla,caramel and ? Well have to figure out the rest lol..good luck
Roger

 

[Blueser]

TFA does not have a tobacco flavor...they can say what they want but their tobacco's are anything but...

 

[ronchinoy]

Its been a 2 weeks and Im still not getting any real good tobacco flavor out of the mix. At least not alone.
I got the RY Asian to somewhat smokeable. By mixing in 40% from my Flue Cured Mix.
M Type Premium smells nothing like Ms. American Red also has zero tobacco taste or flavor.

Watermelon also a big fail for me even at 20% and 2 weeks.
Guess Ive been spoiled by the local Water Mellon flavor. And the retail Hangseng Tobacco flavors.
The Hangseng retail stuff was pretty decent.

So Blueser pls share who does make good tobacco flavors ?
Cause Fruit I have nailed with locally available flavors.

Have a rapid steep idea will find the pic and post when I get up.
Have you heard about Electric Curd makers ?. Heated plate 6 glass jars ? . Costs like 15$.

 

[DetraMental]

The highest I ever use is 10%, no more or I lose flavor. I'm with whoever suggested cutting your mixture in half with some pg/vg which will make it a 20%. You could further cut that to a 10% and let it steep.

 

[ronchinoy]

Im trying to locate the Camel Flavor at RTS Vapes.
Its the only item missing so I can buy some hangsen flavors.

 

[Blueser]

So Blueser pls share who does make good tobacco flavors ?
Cause Fruit I have nailed with locally available flavors.

Have a rapid steep idea will find the pic and post when I get up.
Have you heard about Electric Curd makers ?. Heated plate 6 glass jars ? . Costs like 15$.

I pretty much stay at a 50/50 pg/vg. There's a number of ways/combos I like for mixing tobaccos. Since you asked...try this...

Inawera - L S D Little Space Drop @ 2% +/-
Inawera - D N B Dirty Neutral Base @ 1% +/-


You can use the L S D & DNB as a standalone or as a base with another tobacco flavor. Or Inawera Toni D' Milano S'Camel and mix it to taste...2-4% with the L S D and/or DNB...

I find most all my mixes are good to go fresh mixed pretty much...at most I'll throw a mix in my CP for about an hour, giving a good shake several times. I've tried it all and honestly I find the difference minimal at best...with the right nic/flavors/percentages the mix should/will be good to go fresh off a mix.

 

[ronchinoy]

Well a bit late cause I just ordered Desert Ship in bulk. RY1, and Indian Tobacco in bulk. From VZ. RTS does not even list my country in its add billing details.

I have tried these flavors in Retail format from Hangsen and loved them. Now just need to see if the Flavor Concentrates and Retail match up. At Fast Tech they did not. Not even close. Same company. Same name. Different taste.

Somebody asked about the seedman flavors.
Personally I cant vape them. As is. But you can use them to adjust flavors. i.e. if on a RY4 you want a little less sweet and more tobacco or TH. Then add some fire cured. i.e. I take my 10-20% mix and add a few drops to a tank

After buying everything WizLabs sells. Then now buying the Hangsen in Bulk. If this does not work out. Im going to just give up and go to making my own ..... Got a complete lab distillation setup in Borosil for under 50$.

Sure beats blowing 100s of $ on trying to import flavors and shipping.

Like I said Ive understood my mistake. Not using enough PG. You need PG to carry the flavor and absorb it. Trying to do anything in pure VG is just not going to work.

Yes I agree. With the right flavor you should mix and smoke zero steep. That is how most of my fruit flavors are done.
There are very very few flavors from TFA worth using. Honey Tobacco is one of them.

The steeping setup I was talking about. Is more for when your trying to make your own flavor. i.e. right now I have some Dates Steeping PG. At 55C. After a week Ill distil it and try it.

If you want a real cheap distillation setup look at the Italian or French Coffee Maker. It works based on distillation.

Get this feeling none of the TFA flavors where ever made to make e-juice.

 

[ronchinoy]

I've kinda given up on trying to get a tobacco flavor out of the TFA stuff.
My net finally finished 6 weeks. Little or no coil Gunking.
Alone it tastes not so good. So what Ive started to do is experiment.
Using a mini Gene mod with a 1.5 ML tank. Im mixing up .75ml of my Net with .75 ML of my TFA flavors.
The very first one. Was with American Red 10% + 1% R-Type Prem. With my net. And Im in heaven.
The net is making it a little bit sweet. So will add some vinegar. Need to decide which tastes better the apple or Grape Vinegar.
But even as is I think Ive found something that really works.

My Net is made up off 100 Grms Andrha Tobacco cured. 10 Gold Flake Honey Dew analogues. And one Champagne Cigar. All this was soaked in VG for 2 weeks. Then extracted. Then the leaves where re-processed in pure PG for a few days. Both the liquids where mixed and I have landed up with 250 ML of NET. Passed thru 10 Micron. Still looking for the 1 Micron cloth. What I do is let the liquid sit for a few days and only pull liquid off the top with a dropper. No more coil build up. Plus this is an atty so cant tell if its gunking up or not.

To add the 3rd flavor what I do is take the 3rd flavor and just one drop on the wire mesh and see if it helps or detracts.
I have this sneaky feeling that even though M-Type is finally shining with something. The Black Hone + Net is what is going to be the best.
The plan is to test one new flavor everyday and take notes.
One of these weekends I plan to make a trip to coorg the home of my ultimate Tobacco in the world. Gold Falke Honey dew.
The leaves are cured using the roots off coffee plants. Not sure how it works. All I know is that its the best tobacco in the world.
Ill take some pictures when I get there.

Im just so glad I kept at working on my NET. Those of you into DIY. Do your self a huge flavor and try your hand at NETs.
You guys can get broken cigars. We dont get that here. Your lucky to find a shop that sells them whole. And they are costly.
Even the one Cigar I used was a gift. I think the sweetness is coming from the cigar.

Oh I also used a pressure cooker. At 10 pounds for 5 min. For the net. A glass container inside the pressure cooker.
Used 10 ML Vodka. 10 ML Apple Vodka 10 ML Barcade. Not by plan just what was left in the 3 bottles. The idea of adding alcohol was because I heard it helps dissolve some oils and tastes off the leaves.
Most of it has long evaporated.
The Mash as I called the net was heated in a glass jar almost every day in the microwave.
And I could see the level dropping.

Have some dates sitting and am sure that will add a nice flavor.

My new flavors from TFA I just plan to mix them or dilute them down at 10% with 50-50 PG /VG and just set them aside for steeping.
Then I can use them like flavoring additives to my NETs.

Will try vaping them straight. But I have my doubts they will amount to much alone. Without a NET your never going to get that taste.
With a good net I think any of the TFA flavors will work. Just steep at 3-4 weeks. Use at least 25% PG and you should have fun.

Ps: I cheated and tested 3 flavors with my NET. Am in vape heaven. The TFA flavors which tasted nothing like tobacco. Have all turned into mind blowing flavors. Each turning out better than the last.
Even Ry1 is wow.

What I need to do now. Is develop 2-3 different NETs.

The way to test is start with a 50-50 mix Of your net and the flavor. Then as the tank level drops. Keep adding the Net. Then next round again start 50-50 and as the tank drops. Top up with your TFA pre-steeped flavor. This way you know what will work best. American Red + M type taste better with more Net. RY1 tastes better with less Net.

I can finally see a light at the end of the tunnel.
Tomorrow I hit the Cigar shops looking for fancy broken Cigars. Thanks for the tip I got on this forum.

 

[Heabob]

I've kinda given up on trying to get a tobacco flavor out of the TFA stuff.
My net finally finished 6 weeks. Little or no coil Gunking.
Alone it tastes not so good. So what Ive started to do is experiment.
Using a mini Gene mod with a 1.5 ML tank. Im mixing up .75ml of my Net with .75 ML of my TFA flavors.
The very first one. Was with American Red 10% + 1% R-Type Prem. With my net. And Im in heaven.
The net is making it a little bit sweet. So will add some vinegar. Need to decide which tastes better the apple or Grape Vinegar.
But even as is I think Ive found something that really works.

My Net is made up off 100 Grms Andrha Tobacco cured. 10 Gold Flake Honey Dew analogues. And one Champagne Cigar. All this was soaked in VG for 2 weeks. Then extracted. Then the leaves where re-processed in pure PG for a few days. Both the liquids where mixed and I have landed up with 250 ML of NET. Passed thru 10 Micron. Still looking for the 1 Micron cloth. What I do is let the liquid sit for a few days and only pull liquid off the top with a dropper. No more coil build up. Plus this is an atty so cant tell if its gunking up or not.

To add the 3rd flavor what I do is take the 3rd flavor and just one drop on the wire mesh and see if it helps or detracts.
I have this sneaky feeling that even though M-Type is finally shining with something. The Black Hone + Net is what is going to be the best.
The plan is to test one new flavor everyday and take notes.
One of these weekends I plan to make a trip to coorg the home of my ultimate Tobacco in the world. Gold Falke Honey dew.
The leaves are cured using the roots off coffee plants. Not sure how it works. All I know is that its the best tobacco in the world.
Ill take some pictures when I get there.

Im just so glad I kept at working on my NET. Those of you into DIY. Do your self a huge flavor and try your hand at NETs.
You guys can get broken cigars. We dont get that here. Your lucky to find a shop that sells them whole. And they are costly.
Even the one Cigar I used was a gift. I think the sweetness is coming from the cigar.

Oh I also used a pressure cooker. At 10 pounds for 5 min. For the net. A glass container inside the pressure cooker.
Used 10 ML Vodka. 10 ML Apple Vodka 10 ML Barcade. Not by plan just what was left in the 3 bottles. The idea of adding alcohol was because I heard it helps dissolve some oils and tastes off the leaves.
Most of it has long evaporated.
The Mash as I called the net was heated in a glass jar almost every day in the microwave.
And I could see the level dropping.

Have some dates sitting and am sure that will add a nice flavor.

My new flavors from TFA I just plan to mix them or dilute them down at 10% with 50-50 PG /VG and just set them aside for steeping.
Then I can use them like flavoring additives to my NETs.

Will try vaping them straight. But I have my doubts they will amount to much alone. Without a NET your never going to get that taste.
With a good net I think any of the TFA flavors will work. Just steep at 3-4 weeks. Use at least 25% PG and you should have fun.

Ps: I cheated and tested 3 flavors with my NET. Am in vape heaven. The TFA flavors which tasted nothing like tobacco. Have all turned into mind blowing flavors. Each turning out better than the last.
Even Ry1 is wow.

What I need to do now. Is develop 2-3 different NETs.

The way to test is start with a 50-50 mix Of your net and the flavor. Then as the tank level drops. Keep adding the Net. Then next round again start 50-50 and as the tank drops. Top up with your TFA pre-steeped flavor. This way you know what will work best. American Red + M type taste better with more Net. RY1 tastes better with less Net.

I can finally see a light at the end of the tunnel.
Tomorrow I hit the Cigar shops looking for fancy broken Cigars. Thanks for the tip I got on this forum.

VZ Parliament is good IMO, no extra stuff, and alcohol-based.

I'd bet it would rock with your NET.

I'm gonna try some NET as soon as I get some Organic Virginia leaf samples.
PG cold extract method for 4-6 weeks.
May try growing my own tobacco, maybe next year, seeds are cheap...

 

[ronchinoy]

Just placed a huge order with VZ for some Hangsen flavors.
Ill keep parliament in mind for my next order.
My coils have started gi gunk up. So I get this feeling that Distillation is the only sure fire way to get zero gunk.

I dont have land to grow my own. And to be honest. It so cheap that why ?. 100 Grms of fully cured leaf is like 50 cents here.

The key I have found is in the cure. Better to let the Pros handle that process.
The Broken Cigar Idea is superb. Cause the results taste just like the cigar.
Each leak and cure method results in a different tobacco taste. My Andhra type. Has a very sweet taste to it. And Im getting bored of tasting it in all my flavors.
I need to get something from down south.

PG Cold extraction ?. I dont like the sound of that. Heat is a must have. Just under boiling.
A 5 min in the pressure cooker is also key.
And the last key is heavy heavy duty maceration. i.e. tons of pressure.
You can achive this using a Coffee Maker South Indian Style.

Need to solve my coil gunking issue. Problem is this .... is so good its hard to put down. Id rather strip and rebuild my coil every night.
Tomorrow Im off to visit the only cigar shop in town.
https://cigarsindia.in/
Hope I can get some other tobacco flavor to play with this sweetish stuff is getting boring.

Ps: The TFA flavors have started to come into their own. At around the 4 week mark.
The ones I left open to air have a milder taste. The ones I kept air tight seem to have a stronger flavor. What I did was just diluted my existing mix down to 10% with PG.
Dont know how Im going to do it. But really need to get my hands on their Honey Tobacco flavor. That is my fav TFA Flavor. Was only able to rescue an ML or two from the broken bottle and bag it was in. Enough to convince me its the best in their range.
By the way even your NET gets better with steeping.

 

[Heabob]

Have you seen this thread:http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/liquid-extraction-tobacco/

Lots of good NET info...

 

[ronchinoy]

wow nice find thanks.

I have started a study to collect info on every kind and type of cure in my country.
Here is a good starting point. With over 1000 friends on FB. I plan to try and get a few samples from each location.
TOBACCO Varieties

 

[ronchinoy]

So looks like what Im really after is WTA
If I was in the US I would just have ordered it.

Here is where Id disagree with some of the stuff being said there.

a. Dont mash the leaves. It causes more gunk. My 2 cents for best and strongest flavor transfer the more surface area you can expose the better. So I use a coffee grinder to finely powder my stuff.

b. Dont waste your time trying to achieve any transfer with VG it just wont happen.

c. Heat method is much better.

d. Use Vodka first to try and dissolve the oils. The steep in PG. For at least a week. Then maseration.

Just what I feel works for me.

 

[thetechshack]

Question. I hope this is an ok place to post it. Can I use normal food concentrates for DIY? Safe as any? I found some I wasn't to use.
Also - I have TPA Butterscotch. I can't get it to pop. 20-30% flavor. 60% VG. I want it to taste like Flavors by Joe. Any tips on butterscotch? Custards?

Thank you!

Kevin

 

[MD_Boater]

Also - I have TPA Butterscotch. I can't get it to pop. 20-30% flavor. 60% VG. I want it to taste like Flavors by Joe. Any tips on butterscotch? Custards?

I have never tried flavors by Joe, but for me, TFA Butterscotch (4%) and TFA Strawberry Ripe (1%) is delicious. I am going to try 3.5% BS and .5% SR as my next test batch. And no... I can not taste the strawberry in it at all. None of my friends can, either...

I can not imagine 20% TFA Butterscotch in any recipe. That seems like it would be just way too strong.

 

[thetechshack]

Can I use food concentrates and not buy from TPA and so on? Example - I found a great concentrate for sarsaparilla at a good price, used to make the real drink. Can I safely use concentrates like this?
I know most will recomend TPA, FA and the like but I am looking for cheaper, possibly better alternatives short of making my own.

 

[ronchinoy]

Without knowing what company or brand its going to be hard to answer your question.

On a basic level yes most of these flavors used in vaping are all food grade flavors. And food grade flavors is where it all started.
As long as the flavors do not contain that one chemical we are not supposed to smoke Diacetyl.
See here
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...s-may-contain-diacetyl-there-really-many.html

You should be ok.
I split flavors into two major classes. One is chemical and the other is Natural.
Most of the flavors I have imported from the USA seem to be chemical based. Most of the flavors I get locally seem to be Natural based.

Natrual flavors seem to give a more realistic taste i.e. I give somebody some of my watermellon and 10 out of 10 guys will go thats water mellon on the first vape.
Vs say I give somebody something with am american flavor say Mount baker Gava. 8 guys out of 10 will not be able to figure out what it is. When I tell them its Gauva they go. Oh yeah it is.

Natural flavors do tend to go off if not vaped in 3 months. Or lets just say the taste changes quite a bit. Chemical flavors cant be vaped for at least a week. And dont seem to have any issues storing them for months on end.

 

[KcGoods]

I know what you mean about the %. I just got new flavors in on Friday from a place I haven't used before. But it came highly recommended. I started out with a 2% flavor but wound up having to go to about 20%. In reading the fine print on their site the flavorings were natural flavors which it says are much lighter and recommended that you start with 20%. Not real happy with that so im going to order from capella's next and see how their flavors are. So you just never know it could be your pallet. It could be your flavors it could be the amount of heat its taking or the PG or the VG or the nicotine.