Does this seem right to you?

[beckdg]

Send em all to the moon? Or maybe Uranus?

I'm a bit of a tight wad tho...

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

wait a minute, are you saying that having the same group of people make up industry, the regulatory body overseeing that industry, and the government branch overseeing the regulatory body is not a good idea? Or that industry contributing to campaigns for the government representatives that appoint and oversee the regulatory body that regulates that industry is a conflict of interest?

That's just silly.

Ummm...

Waitaholdit...

If the industry is for the greater good the first part works out pretty often.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Last time I met with a regulator was when my dad was selling his long island home. Dude came in to give a building inspection on the home. I was a kid. He walked around with my dad and I with his clip board in hand (late 1970s early 1980s). About 2 hours later, he started talking to my dad. My dad opened his wallet and handed him 6 - crisp 100 dollar bills. He threw the clip board sheet away and said change those outlets.. and pointed, everything else looks good. Yes. that is a true story.

I've done that

For a living

In too many industries to care to admit

Hence why I inspect any restaurant I go into as well as a patron can before I decide if I'm just walking right back out.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Zoeller calls on FDA to protect youth from e-cigs

"Bunch of garbage"

he will “continue to urge for stronger regulation of these products

And will continue to win small battles so long as we give him a foothold.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

This is troubling

"In the recent letter, Zoeller and Mills reiterated the following policy suggestions, urging the FDA to not only include e-cigarettes under the tobacco Control Act, but also:

• Subject e-cigarettes to the same advertising and marketing restrictions as combustible cigarettes.
• Ban characterizing flavors.
• Require stronger health warnings on e-cigarettes, noting that nicotine is a harmful and addictive product and e-cigarettes contain potentially harmful chemicals.
• Prohibit all non-face-to-face sales of tobacco products to prevent youth from purchasing e-cigarettes off of the Internet."

What bothers me is that when I drive down I-75 to get back and forth to work there is no signs that say driving on this highway may cause inhalation of potential dangerous chemicals as the 16 wheels belches forth a blackened cloud that makes me scramble to get my recirculating air conditioner setting on, while dodging the 16 wheeler on my right and the lady on the left that thinks she is one of the rare human creatures that is able to text/drive/listen to the radio and talk to her passenger at the same time.

16 wheeler?

Somebody running duals and super singles on the same tandems?

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Why are we so worried about kids vaping? The more kids that vape, the more money gets pumped into the American economy. Under funded schools? Have the schools initiate a "juice making" hour. The schools can sell the juice! Kids are small and have small hands - who better to make 30ml bottles? Learning the formulas would help them learn math! Understanding which flavors sell better and how much of each supply to order - economics! Learning to let the smartest kids lead the teams - management! Letting the creative kids make the labels - art! Watching the occasional dumb kid drop a 55 gallon drum on himself - safety, science and natural selection! Letting the sport kids load and unload everything - physical fitness! Using a few of the hot moms in promotional materials - advertising and self esteem! There is no downside to attracting kids to vaping. Except stupid reactionary "we must save the kids from imaginary dangers" adults who some how slipped through the natural selection process.

And just how do you plan on selling this theory to the moderate senators?

(Poke, zoiD)

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

He might be a good candidate for a twitter bomb, though it might be less helpful than fun.

I don't know how to kick off a successful social movement in less than six weeks, I really don't.

Unfortunately I've only been a follower myself. Thus unqualified for the task.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

I don't know if there is a good answer to this. If the AG's mind is set it makes it very challenging to change it without studies that take time. We may find, unfortunately, that we will have to work backwards.

Doing great this far.

And I agree.

To forcing them to prove the relevance of their studies relates and pertains only directly to ecigs and is without convoluted bias.

This should be step one at all times.

Ought to buy us a decade or three at some battle within this war.

Force factual science.

And make them prove it.

But we need warm bodies.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Perhaps people should start think about Getting Organized on the Local/State level and thinking about doing "Letter Drives" to their Federal House and Senate Members?

It would be Nice if Every State had a 100,000+ Signature Petition say that Vapers are Opposed to Flavor Bans, Face-2-Face Sales Only, Limits to Nicotine Levels and Closed System Cartridges. Al Least ALL Vapers could agree on that.

But we would need the Help of B&M and Online Retailers to make a Petition really go.

I wonder how many ECF Registered Suppliers would be Willing to Help on something like this?

And make notarized copies for the president and the speaker of the house.

Imagine them pouring in from every state eventually.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Might be a good idea, but we'd need to work on how to word it. It's better to have a petition For Something rather than Against Something.

Protect access to flavors, which many feel is an integral part of the appeal of vaping.
Protect access to online sales that allow consumers to procure exactly what they want from anywhere in the world.
Protect access to all nicotine concentrations, which the ability to customize helps make vaping a successful alternative to tobacco.
Protect access to open container systems, which make vapor products more economically viable than tobacco products.

Of course the first response from the ANTZ will be, well, how do we protect the children?

Retract anywhere in the world
Insert where that vapers preferred specific product is available
Reiterate harm reduction and documented health benefits vs the alternative over and over

(You get the credit... I'm just running with the idea like a steak knife)

Tapatyped

 

[Jode]

What do you Suggest we do then?

Remember, we Don't have Years anymore. We probably have less than 6 Weeks.

We may not have years, but the position we take now is very important. If we need to work backwards then the stronger our stance is now the better it will be for us. It will be kind of hard to say well yes we conceded on some issues but that was because of the pending doom of decimating vaping, we didn't really think that way. It is kind of like giving somebody money that says you owe the to get them off your back even though you know you owe them squat. By giving them money you are recognizing the debt. Even a dollar paid back is acknowledging the debt so now is the time to stand strong no matter what.

 

[beckdg]

I would Suggest that Anything that a Person comes up with Should have a Paragraph which Includes Why Vaping is Important. Because it is Harm Reduction.

I think the Core Message should always be that Vaping is a "Safer" alternative for Adults who Smoke.

What zoiD said but also a few of my quibbles:

Protect access to flavors, which many feel is an integral part of the appeal of vaping.

Get rid of the word appeal. Whenever I hear that word now I cringe because of the overuse of, “appeals to children.”

Protect access to online sales that allow consumers to procure exactly what they want from anywhere in the world.

To buy the equipment they feel is best suited for them to be able to quit smoking at an affordable price.

Protect access to all nicotine concentrations, which the ability to customize helps make vaping a successful alternative to tobacco.

Current nicotine strengths to help get over the initial cigarette cravings and then wean themselves off gradually.

Protect access to open container systems, which make vapor products more economically viable than tobacco products.

Open/reusable systems that are more cost effective, use fewer resources and create less refuse and pollution.

Errr... yeah

That's what I meant.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Me likes! Where do I sign?

BTW, I was reading along the other night but not signed in when Steve arrived on scene. Husband wanted to know what I was laughing so hard about. At least he's consistent. Gonna bite him in the .... one of these days. [emoji38]

You guys have been making excellent points, tip of the hat to you.

Don't you dare call me naughty. [emoji317]

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Here it is:
Would a change dot org petition help us? | E-Cigarette Forum

Please to give me location of this thread?

Damn links always opens up crappy browser on my phone instead of tapathing.

Thx

Tapatyped

 

[bluecat]

16 wheeler?

Somebody running duals and super singles on the same tandems?

Tapatyped

Yessir.

 

[beckdg]

Yessir.

I have yet to notice that configuration. I'll have to keep an eye out.

Tapatyped

 

[mattiem]

3rd FDA Workshop - Comment Opportunity

http://blog.casaa.org/2015/06/fda-call-to-action-submit-comments-on.html

 

[HauntedMyst]

And just how do you plan on selling this theory to the moderate senators?

Um, the good old fashioned American way - with bribes and hookers. Those are the grease that keeps the American law machine working. Duh.

 

[beckdg]

Um, the good old fashioned American way - with bribes and hookers. Those are the grease that keeps the American law machine working. Duh.

Tapatyped

 

[bluecat]

I have yet to notice that configuration. I'll have to keep an eye out.

Tapatyped

How about 14 wheels. more or less a dump truck. Sorry am not a big rig aficionado.