Wow, so few voices of reason in this thread...
Nicotine - Scientific Review on Usage, Dosage, Side Effects | Examine.com
Nicotine - Scientific Review on Usage, Dosage, Side Effects | Examine.com
dont know who to believe :(
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I am a paramedic with a good amount of advanced education in pharmocology, epidemiology and physiology. I practice emergency medicine, and occasionally treat things like pneumonia and flu like symptoms.
I dont believe in 90% of western medicine, psychiatric medications are the number one offender on my list. I believe quite a few of the permenantly alter a brains chemistry. I believe that some of the drugs ( Abilify being one of them ) will turn a fairly normal person into a stark raving lunatic. Out of the very worst mental health emergency calls I have responded to that was a common factor when looking at currently prescribed medications.
I think arguing if a grown adult should or shouldnt vape is kind of silly when you think about the poison the medical community have pushed through FDA approval. I am talking about drugs with very serious side effects, liver damage, cardiac deterioration, anemia, suicidal thoughts, risk for stroke...
My opinion does not count for anything... but I bet the nicotine is safer in the long run than anything the doctor prescribed.
I dont believe in 90% of western medicine, psychiatric medications are the number one offender on my list. I believe quite a few of the permenantly alter a brains chemistry. I believe that some of the drugs ( Abilify being one of them ) will turn a fairly normal person into a stark raving lunatic. Out of the very worst mental health emergency calls I have responded to that was a common factor when looking at currently prescribed medications.
I think arguing if a grown adult should or shouldnt vape is kind of silly when you think about the poison the medical community have pushed through FDA approval. I am talking about drugs with very serious side effects, liver damage, cardiac deterioration, anemia, suicidal thoughts, risk for stroke...
My opinion does not count for anything... but I bet the nicotine is safer in the long run than anything the doctor prescribed.
My ex boyfriend awhile back was always talking about crime cases. Most of the suicides he dealt with had prozac in the medicine cabinet. Most of the worst abusive drunks were on Budweiser.
Dan, I applaud your stance and bravery for making these comments. Especially since you are in the emergency medical sphere. I hope such comments do not impact you (stating publicly). I am not in your field but in today's society (what with all these Cold War border guard) regulatory bodies that we have, personal opinion is even being stifled. OH that sounds like our vaping world and the potential looming issues we face.
To the OP, my wife bravely fights through her mental issues and is in a very good place now. All I can say is, I wish you all the very best.
Be strong, hold your head up and BE PROUD of who you are
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Here's the problem: When a person not known to have any type of mental or psychological problem "bucks the system," goes against the "received wisdom" of the talking heads and the "authorities" -- and that's exactly what vapers are doing, since we know that that "received wisdom" is pure bunkum -- everyone just shrugs and leaves them to it. If someone known to have a mental or psychological condition does it... well that's a different matter entirely. Are they right, and all those "authorities" wrong? Or are they merely succumbing to a delusion?
The safety of vaping vs. smoking is absolutely NOT a delusion, but it sounds as if both his mom and his shrink have succumbed to ANTZitis, and he's stuck in the middle between all the sensible people here telling him don't worry it's not dangerous, and his interfering mother and clueless shrink. Not a comfortable spot, I'd imagine, especially if one has been conditioned to think one's own judgment faulty.
But the thing is, even if you have a mental or psychological problem, that doesn't automagically make all those "talking heads" right. This struggle about vaping has NOTHING WHATEVER to do with vaping's safety, and EVERYTHING to do with all the money being lost by BT, BP, and BG -- who are ALL willing to lie themselves blue in the face to protect their bottom line, and since all the media outlets are bought and paid for by huge-money consortiums who also have an interest in all that lost revenue, the "talking heads" will say whatever they're told to, and nevermind its truth or lack thereof.
Andria
The safety of vaping vs. smoking is absolutely NOT a delusion, but it sounds as if both his mom and his shrink have succumbed to ANTZitis, and he's stuck in the middle between all the sensible people here telling him don't worry it's not dangerous, and his interfering mother and clueless shrink. Not a comfortable spot, I'd imagine, especially if one has been conditioned to think one's own judgment faulty.
But the thing is, even if you have a mental or psychological problem, that doesn't automagically make all those "talking heads" right. This struggle about vaping has NOTHING WHATEVER to do with vaping's safety, and EVERYTHING to do with all the money being lost by BT, BP, and BG -- who are ALL willing to lie themselves blue in the face to protect their bottom line, and since all the media outlets are bought and paid for by huge-money consortiums who also have an interest in all that lost revenue, the "talking heads" will say whatever they're told to, and nevermind its truth or lack thereof.
Andria
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Well excellent, sounds like dallyllama's psychiatrist has finally found a true hazard of vaping--it has negative effects when used in conjunction with antipsychotics.
Can't wait until he publishes his research study confirming this.
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The best advice you can get is from your own body it will let you know when things are influencing it in a way that would bring harm to you. If you doing OK I wouldn't worry about it at all but then if your body gives you signs that something is working wrong that's another story and deserves to be look into. After all you've left behind over 4000 bad things from smoking and now yeah your still using nicotine and a few other things that we get all the time from food and etc.
There won't be any data out there for around 10 to 20 years that will prove one way or another but were not looking at someone that never smoked before and pickup vaping that would be adding something new and I don't suggest anyone do that, were going from 4500 harmful substance that we once put into our body down to very few Nicotine, PG, VG, flavors. I believe vaping next to cig smoking is 99.99% better and healthy and only a fool would say it's NOT.
If it was easy to quit smoke before vaping came about almost all of on the board would have done it, like everyone else I tried all those quit smoking pills, patch's and nothing worked.
There won't be any data out there for around 10 to 20 years that will prove one way or another but were not looking at someone that never smoked before and pickup vaping that would be adding something new and I don't suggest anyone do that, were going from 4500 harmful substance that we once put into our body down to very few Nicotine, PG, VG, flavors. I believe vaping next to cig smoking is 99.99% better and healthy and only a fool would say it's NOT.
If it was easy to quit smoke before vaping came about almost all of on the board would have done it, like everyone else I tried all those quit smoking pills, patch's and nothing worked.
I am going to try and help you so please listen and don't take the harshness of truth to mean otherwise.
You admit to having some mental stuff, nothing wrong with it really in this day and age. This is an insane world, maybe you are more normal then the rest of us and can't take the bull! How about that? What is it that you have a hard time adjusting to? The same ole same ole bull that dulls all our lives?
Anyway, you found something you love, and your doc pushing them pills on your dumb .... is not happy. You killed his business he gets a kickback on all them meds. If you are having such a hard time finding a true doctor then come to NJ, my doctor almost danced and gave me a hug when I told him I was vaping. My other doc who did some surgery on my hand was also very pleased, so were all the ladies on his staff. Bottom line is this, not everyone is who they are supposed to be, some doctors are like used cars salesmen, some are not.
As far as you mom, what mom is not the exact way you describe yours? All a mom has to hear is that her son should not have salt, and from there on you will never be able to have a potato chip without her breaking your ballz.
So my friend, you found something you love and are happy? They are getting in the way of someone pushing the pill?..too fecking bad enjoy life! And if you can't find anyone you trust how about trusting yourself for a change?
You admit to having some mental stuff, nothing wrong with it really in this day and age. This is an insane world, maybe you are more normal then the rest of us and can't take the bull! How about that? What is it that you have a hard time adjusting to? The same ole same ole bull that dulls all our lives?
Anyway, you found something you love, and your doc pushing them pills on your dumb .... is not happy. You killed his business he gets a kickback on all them meds. If you are having such a hard time finding a true doctor then come to NJ, my doctor almost danced and gave me a hug when I told him I was vaping. My other doc who did some surgery on my hand was also very pleased, so were all the ladies on his staff. Bottom line is this, not everyone is who they are supposed to be, some doctors are like used cars salesmen, some are not.
As far as you mom, what mom is not the exact way you describe yours? All a mom has to hear is that her son should not have salt, and from there on you will never be able to have a potato chip without her breaking your ballz.
So my friend, you found something you love and are happy? They are getting in the way of someone pushing the pill?..too fecking bad enjoy life! And if you can't find anyone you trust how about trusting yourself for a change?
Correlation does not equal causation. The reason why so many people who commit suicide have Prozac in the medicine cabinet is because they suffer from depression...depression is much more of a cause of suicide than Prozac. My nephew committed suicide last year. He was on Prozac and other anti-depressants as a child and did well while he was on them. Due to all of the negative press that anti-depressants have, he refused to take them in his late teens, and things went downhill from there. He was 23 when he finally decided to end his own life. Anti-depressants can be very effective when prescribed, and taken, properly. But, just like any other drug, they can cause major issues when wrongly prescribed and the prescribing doctor isn't following up with their patient. I've been on citalopram for many years for anxiety, and it has been wonderful for me. My doctor retired two years ago, and her replacement decided that I "needed" to be on Wellbutrin instead. After about a week, I was a miserable mess. I was a grown man, curled up on my couch crying like a child for 3 days, and had no idea why I was so depressed. Thankfully, my wife noticed and told me to cut my dose and to and call my doctor. My doctor was out that day, so the head doctor took my call...he put me back on citalopram, apologized for what happened, and immediately assigned a different doctor to me.
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Please don't recommend a person who suffers from schizophrenia to ignore his doctor and to not take the pills prescribed to him. That's absolutely ignorant, and you could cause him severe harm. Schizophrenics suffer from a very horrible problem and they can't tell the difference between reality and their thoughts when it gets out of control. To the OP...if your medicine helps, then please don't take advice from people on a vaping forum.
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Not everyone is as lucky as you, and you are extremely ignorant of the facts regarding mental health. These problems existed 40+ years ago. The difference between then and now was that people were pulled from their homes (and families) and carted off to loony bins to live the rest of their lives in misery.
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Moved to Health, Safety and Vaping from General Vaping Discussion
Clean up the conversation in here and quit attacking each other.
Seeking medical advice on a forum is not a wise thing to do.
Clean up the conversation in here and quit attacking each other.
Seeking medical advice on a forum is not a wise thing to do.
Not on a high horse brother, simply stating the fact that we have all become cows to BP. While these problems did exist 40 years ago, and families were torn apart these were a % of the American people, they are now giving this to everyone with abandon yet you are the cheerleader now for this are you not? You want to dismiss everything I said based on the fact that some people need the medication. Not everyone in the world needs these meds, yet BP will give these to everyone and you are on board, with abandon, and you want to promote more of it.
Lucky? No I am not lucky I feel like I have a curse at times. Being lucky as I am I would be well for me to go fishing and enjoy myself lost in my own little lucky world. I care about my fellow man, and perhaps they have not made a pill to cure this yet. But I'm sure given the time and the pain that I happen to cause their profit, I'm sure they are working for a pill for me right now, I just hope they hurry to up.
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I agree. Schizophrenia is most definitely a condition that requires medication. Other problems, maybe yes, maybe no; medication can make a real difference in a lot of problems, but it's my own belief that medication should be a last resort for things like depression and anxiety, when other treatments are just not working -- I was IN therapy, and had a supportive family, when I suffered my last severe bout of PTSD, depression, and my anxiety disorder, but nothing was working till I tried Effexor -- it was a beast and a half to get free of, but when I needed it, it was a godsend; it literally saved my life, because I could not have gone on suffering as I was.
But schizophrenia is a very different condition, and there really ARE no options; without medication, schizophrenia can go completely out of control, leaving the afflicted with a huge uncertainty about what is real and what is not. I would never ever suggest that anyone stop taking their medication for any condition, and certainly not schizophrenics. My belief, though, is that if the OP was *smoking* while taking that medication, then vaping is not going to hurt him; there are thousands of chemicals in cigarette smoke which are not in e-cig vapor, and many of those chemicals are truly deadly, AND psychotropic, AND dependance producing. If he managed to survive smoking while taking that medication, then vaping will not harm him.
Andria
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I never once said that everybody should be on meds. In fact, if you read my previous post, I said "Anti-depressants can be very effective when prescribed, and taken, properly. ". How did you decide that my comment defines me as a cheerleader for BP and/or everyone being medicated? All I asked of you was to not recommend that a person with schizophrenia go off their meds.
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I want to start again with you so we can narrow what we are saying to one another. Sometimes I feel like we are talking past one another. The OP did state he was happy, and his doc was opposed. Somehow we can't help the op or state that there are sharks giving meds. All is good to you as long as he takes his meds, because they all care about the human.
Fact of the matter is to a lot of people we are just used cars, or cows. It was the OP who stated " I don't know who to believe " it is more then clear to me that he is having an issue with how he feels and what he is being told by a pill pusher. It is the OP who is asking us for help. And you, you are pushing him on the pill, because the Doc knows best, please dude!
This is not about you or me man, this is about the OP. So let me ask you this how have you help him?
One more thing chargingcharlie I am sorry about the loss in your family. I mean it. It is not easy to believe in something and argue with a total stranger on the net, but we have to consider what we are doing here. I think I am helping the OP, maybe you too, but the OP is complaining about him loving and being happy to witch he is being forced to swallow a damn pill, his words not mine.
Again sorry about your loss, lest not kill someone else in the process, either from your standpoint or mine.
Kind Regards,
Again sorry about your loss, lest not kill someone else in the process, either from your standpoint or mine.
Kind Regards,
The OP stated that he vapes 6mg nicotine and
"well I went to my psychiatrist today and asked him about vaping, and he said basically we don't know the long term effects. and he said its possible it could be effecting the meds I take for my schizophrenia."
Nowhere did the OP state that his doctor told him stop vaping or that the doctor is claiming a medical discovery.
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Not so many years ago psychiatrists would allow some patients to smoke if it helped with their mood and didn't interfere with medication. The benefits outweighed the risks. That may still be true today.
For all I know some psychiatrists may think the same way about vaping today. I haven't seen any articles about this one way or the other.
For all I know some psychiatrists may think the same way about vaping today. I haven't seen any articles about this one way or the other.
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