Drawing more current than Mooch's CDR

[Metsyl]

Hello everyone,

I am really new to vaping, might as well call me a n00b. So I have this question in my head for a couple of days now and I couldn't found any direct answer for it. Here I go:

Should I draw more than 19A from my VTC 6?/What would be the consequences?.

Furthermore, I got my smok alien starter kit which came with, as you may know, baby beast pre-installed q2 coil at 0.4 ohm. Now I am about to change pre-installed q2 with t8 which is 0.15 ohm. Depending on my calculations, at 60W (which is said to be in t8's sweet spot range) I'm going to draw 20A from my VTC 6.
Now with all those horror stories going on about vaporizers, I am delaying this change that I mentioned above until I clarify my safety questions. Considering the fact that my face could explode this is the least I can do right? RIGHT?!? xD

Please illuminate my way, for I am lost like a blind man who lost his way. Thanks in advance for your kind answers!

 

[sonicbomb]

All the answers to your battery related questions can be found within Mooch's Blog.
On a regulated device the resistance of the coil not important. What matters is the wattage and the amps it will draw from your batteries particularly when the batteries are discharged as this will be the highest value. A 20 amp battery is good for 60 watts, so your Alien is good for 120 watts as it has two batteries.

Calculating battery current draw for a regulated mod | E-Cigarette Forum

In answer to your question about exceeding the amp limit of an 18650 -

Exceed it by 20-30 percent and you prematurely age it.
Beyond this you are into dangerous territory. Push a cell too hard and it may vent mildly ejecting gas and hot chemicals. Or if you are unlucky or are really pushing it, it may vent violently going into full thermal runaway spewing sparks flames and toxic smoke like a rocket motor. If this happens in a mod without adequate venting, you have a pipe bomb.

Even exceeding the CDR of a cell by a small amount can have consequences other than premature aging. If the mod fires continuously without you realizing it, it may get hot enough to vent or at the least be permanently damaged.
Stay safe, keep under the CDR.

 

[Metsyl]

Thank you for your advice, I will keep that in mind.

 

[Spirometry]

Furthermore, I got my Smok Alien starter kit which came with, as you may know, baby beast pre-installed q2 coil at 0.4 ohm. Now I am about to change pre-installed q2 with t8 which is 0.15 ohm. Depending on my calculations, at 60W (which is said to be in t8's sweet spot range) I'm going to draw 20A from my VTC 6.

Your mod is a Dc-Dc voltage converter. Your calculation above is from the mod's board to the atomizer. We need to calculate from the batteries to the board.

Regulated mods draw more amps from the batteries when empty rather than fully charged. So when calculating amperage from the batteries, you want to use the low voltage cutoff on your device. In your case 2.8v per cell. Your mod has 2 cells, so cut the wattage in half. The board isn't 100% efficient, it is good practice to add in 10% by dividing by 0.9 .

(30W per cell/ 2.8v) / .90 = 11.9A

 

[Metsyl]

Your mod is a Dc-Dc voltage converter. Your calculation above is from the mod's board to the atomizer. We need to calculate from the batteries to the board.

Regulated mods draw more amps from the batteries when empty rather than fully charged. So when calculating amperage from the batteries, you want to use the low voltage cutoff on your device. In your case 2.8v per cell. Your mod has 2 cells, so cut the wattage in half. The board isn't 100% efficient, it is good practice to add in 10% by dividing by 0.9 .

(30W per cell/ 2.8v) / .90 = 11.9A

Well, this is the most direct answer as it gets. Cheers mate!

Just to be sure, this calculation is always the same at 60W for any given resistance right?

 

[KenD]

All the answers to your battery related questions can be found within Mooch's Blog.
On a regulated device the resistance of the coil not important. What matters is the wattage and the amps it will draw from your batteries particularly when the batteries are discharged as this will be the highest value. A 20 amp battery is good for 60 watts, so your Alien is good for 120 watts as it has two batteries.

Calculating battery current draw for a regulated mod | E-Cigarette Forum

In answer to your question about exceeding the amp limit of an 18650 -

Exceed it by 20-30 percent and you prematurely age it.
Beyond this you are into dangerous territory. Push a cell too hard and it may vent mildly ejecting gas and hot chemicals. Or if you are unlucky or are really pushing it, it may vent violently going into full thermal runaway spewing sparks flames and toxic smoke like a rocket motor. If this happens in a mod without adequate venting, you have a pipe bomb.

Even exceeding the CDR of a cell by a small amount can have consequences other than premature aging. If the mod fires continuously without you realizing it, it may get hot enough to vent or at the least be permanently damaged.
Stay safe, keep under the CDR.

The Alien has an unusually low voltage cutoff, around 2.9v, so that has to be taken into account. 105w in order to stay within the cdr of two 20-amp batteries.

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[Hawise]

Well, this is the most direct answer as it gets. Cheers mate!

Just to be sure, this calculation is always the same at 60W for any given resistance right?

For a regulated mod, yes, although you do have to take into account any variation in the low voltage cutoff as @KenD says. Mech mods use a different calculation and the resistance does come into play for them.

 

[SteveS45]

Been using my Alien for months and have had no problems with the supposed Low Voltage cutoff.

 

[KenD]

Been using my Alien for months and have had no problems with the supposed Low Voltage cutoff.

It needn't be a problem. In fact, it's the reason for the fantastic battery life. But it needs to be accounted for when calculating the amp draw.

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[SteveS45]

Ken I do not need your explanation because it holds no value for me. Thanks but NO Thanks

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

The only thing you need to know is that you really don't need to go uber low with the OHMs... 0.2 and up can give you a great vape and eliminate any danger should something go wrong, but regulated mods tend to be quite safe as long as you have decent batteries and keep them charged.

 

[Ben85]

Ken I do not need your explanation because it holds no value for me. Thanks but NO Thanks

Is this really necessary? This is a public forum, just because your post was quoted doesn't mean you are solely the person who should be interested. Ken is making a comment which is regarding safety. Such comments should be encouraged, not picked out like that.

 

[SteveS45]

Is this really necessary? This is a public forum, just because your post was quoted doesn't mean you are solely the person who should be interested. Ken is making a comment which is regarding safety. Such comments should be encouraged, not picked out like that.

Yes it is because he has said this over and over again and I do not need him quoting me and doing whatever it is he thinks he is doing. I have heard it before and I own an Alien which does NOT do what he says. And I said Thanks but NO Thanks.

 

[KenD]

Yes it is because he has said this over and over again and I do not need him quoting me and doing whatever it is he thinks he is doing. I have heard it before and I own an Alien which does NOT do what he says. And I said Thanks but NO Thanks.

Look, you obviously have some sort of problem with me. I kindly ask you to drop it. I haven't been rude or hostile towards you and this kind of animosity is simply unnecessary and detracts from proper discussion. I'm only the interested in the safety of my fellow vapers and correct information. The Outside is a suitable place for bickering, but let's not bring that kind of stuff here. Ok?

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[SteveS45]

Look, you obviously have some sort of problem with me. I kindly ask you to drop it. I haven't been rude or hostile towards you and this kind of animosity is simply unnecessary and detracts from proper discussion. I'm only the interested in the safety of my fellow vapers and correct information. The Outside is a suitable place for bickering, but let's not bring that kind of stuff here. Ok?

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

When you stop quoting me I will stop stating that what you say is incorrect because the devices I actually own do not do what you claim.

 

[KenD]

When you stop quoting me I will stop stating that what you say is incorrect because the devices I actually own do not do what you claim.

My Alien does discharge to about 2.9v. Several other owners have the same experience. Testing by Djlsb vapes shows the same. Clearly the Alien does discharge the batteries low for many users. It's not a problem, the batteries can handle it, but it does affect the amp draw. How low does your Alien discharge the batteries? Have you measured the voltage when the mod stops firing due to low charge?

This is about more than this particular thread though. You're antagonistic pretty much every time you respond to anything I post. It's unnecessary and tiring, and I'm sure I'm not the only one with that opinion. I don't respond that way to you. Could you please just show some respect, if not to me then to others on this forum, and just drop it.

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[SteveS45]

My Alien does discharge to about 2.9v. Several other owners have the same experience. Testing by Djlsb vapes shows the same. Clearly the Alien does discharge the batteries low for many users. It's not a problem, the batteries can handle it, but it does affect the amp draw. How low does your Alien discharge the batteries? Have you measured the voltage when the mod stops firing due to low charge?

This is about more than this particular thread though. You're antagonistic pretty much every time you respond to anything I post. It's unnecessary and tiring, and I'm sure I'm not the only one with that opinion. I don't respond that way to you. Could you please just show some respect, if not to me then to others on this forum, and just drop it.

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

But you keep quoting me and offering others experiences. I DO NOT CARE what you claim because the devices I own PROVE otherwise.

 

[KenD]

But you keep quoting me and offering others experiences. I DO NOT CARE what you claim because the devices I own PROVE otherwise.

So I'll ask you again, and not for the sake of argument but because it's of interest. How low does your Alien discharge the batteries? Have you measured the voltage when the mod stops firing due to low charge?

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[SteveS45]

I have asked you previously to prove your claims without posting links to reviewers.

3.2V was the lowest and I will ask you again PLEASE stop quoting me and stop giving me examples from paid reviewers.

 

[KenD]

I have asked you previously to prove your claims without posting links to reviewers.

3.2V was the lowest and I will ask you again PLEASE stop quoting me and stop giving me examples from paid reviewers.

Did you measure the batteries with a multimeter? Did you run the batteries down all the way to the cutoff? Did you measure straight away after you pulled the batteries or did you let them rest a while (how long?) before? And which version of the Alien do you have, the A or the B? And a question to other Alien users: how low do your batteries discharge, when run down all the way to the low voltage cutoff?

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