Electronic Cigarettes effect on Cigarette Cravings

[glasseye]

I've tried the patch, it made my heart race and pretty much did nothing for cravings. Same with gum, which tasted terrible. 3 years ago I got a 510 e-cig with some tobacco juices. I don't think there was the variety of flavorings there are now. I've been reading here and most everyone says that none of the juice tastes like a real cig. The ones I got certainly didn't. Taking chantix was never an option for me, after hearing about bad dreams to out-and-out nightmares (I have enough of my own TYVM), not to mention all the other side effects...the stuff scares me. No way would I take it.
Last week I went to a local vape lounge and bought an eGo twist, some nice flavors like Butter Rum and Cherry Limeade and gave it another go. I haven't touched a real cig since then, 12/12/12. I had absolutely NO cravings until last night. I thought it strange, I thought all the cravings were going to be bad in the first 3 days not 4 days later. Today I'm still dealing with some cravings. Not enough to make me light up though. I have a pack of cigs in my bag, unopened, with my quit date in permanent sharpie written on it. I'm hoping I have the resolve this time so they remain unopened!

 

[patkin]

I posted earlier on the thread and have since read what others have said. I think the problem (if there is one) is how the definitions of "addiction" and "habit" have been intertwined and, therefore, each of them muddied in our culture. I'm not sure how the medical profession defines them currently though. For instance, I've given up caffeine (morning coffee) several times and suffered unpleasant physical symptoms from it. In the past, I have switched from caffeine-free Coke to other liquids and craved the missing throat hit but had no physical symptoms. I returned to Coke to get the feeling back but have been caffeine-free for years. Was I addicted to caffeine but Coke was merely a habit? This is, to me, a really important distinction as our society is becoming more and more judgmental pointing the "addiction" fingers and creating new socially-acceptable discrimination. Personally, I don't think I've ever been addicted to nicotine no matter of how long I smoked otherwise swallowing nicotine would have worked and it didn't. Maybe I don't carry the gene for that particular addiction? But, I do know the act of smoking was a habit and that's why vaping zero nic does work. Maybe I have an "addictive personality?" Hope I made some of this clear enough to say that it really doesn't matter which category the smoker falls into. What does matter is that vaping is a very effective avenue for either one to either get away from either their drug of choice or to break a harmful habit or both.

The other thing that matters so very much is doctors backing up the vaper no matter which category they fall into. They led the way in some of the current discrimination against smokers and I think it behooves them to equally lead the way in helping smokers now... and leave all areas of "politics" out of it. One of the best videos I've seen from the medical profession comes from UCLA Santa Monica Hospital, Chief of Staff, Dr. David Baron. If you haven't seen it, I would recommend this:

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRr8KubdhCA[/url]

the above is part 1 of 2 parts.

 

[POSEIDON]

NO NO NO !!. The harmful substance in a cigarette is "TAR". Without the tar the electric cigarette is a placebo. You are focusing on nicotine when nicotine isn't the issue, TAR IS. Tar is the killer !. It has nothing to do with addiction. It is to do with the fact it kills people. So which is more important to you ? I think i make this quite clear in my original post. ELECTRIC CIGARETTES ARE A PLACEBO. This makes them more acceptable, do you not understand that ?. Nicotine is present in electric cigarettes so the smart choice is to use the electric cigarette as a placebo to avoid the tar ? Nicotine is just the hook. BASICALLY, USE THE PLACEBO AS A REPLACEMENT FOR TAR. Could i make this point any clearer ?. So to encourage any government to accept the electric cigarette would be to suggest that it is a placebo, because it is. And again "nicotine has nothing to do with it". It's a tar replacement PLACEBO. And your comments are detrimental to the idea that electric cigarettes are acceptable in society. If your FDA understood this idea then everyone could benefit.
I did say in my original post that withdrawal symptoms from addictive substances aren't why people are addicted. What i said was, "it's more about the person and not the substance". They act like spoilt children that have to have their way. They want something and will do anything to get it. And "neural chemistry" doesn't change the fact that these types of people act like spoilt brats. And were doing so long before they ever knew the illegal substances existed. They blame all of there obnoxious idiosychracies on the substances they abuse. They hide behind it and use it as a sheild. It's like this "oh i feel cold" "must be the substance". "oh i feel good today" "must be the substance" Absolutely every aspect of their life is covered by their substance abuse. And to add insult to injury they expect everyone else to believe this ridiculous nonsense. I know dozens of people all "addicted" to this n that and they "all" claim sickness benefit based on the symptoms of withdrawal. I wasn't born yesterday, I am an observer. I've been observing this for about 20 years.

The amount of sheer medical wrong in this statement is astounding. Without the toxic chemicals(or more accurately with LESS of them) found in cigaretts, of which tar is ONE(of many), e cigaretts can not be called a placebo as they still provide the ADDICTIVE substance(unless a person vapes a 0 nic liquid). Your "observations" on addiction are a throwback to the 20's or 30's mentality regarding addiction. Addiction changes brain chemistry this is a FACT. People become addicted to these chemicals because the initial pleasureable effects that the chemical provides them. As longer useage becomes the norm people "need" the substance to keep their brain chemistry normal. With out the chemical present in their body the brain creates a chemical reaction that causes a physical reaction, this can be as simple as mood swings and as devistating as full(and sometimes deadly) withdrawl. What e-cigs provide is a replacement in delivery for the bodys "needed" nicotine. E-cigaretts are more akin to a long term nicotine replacement.

Some of us will vape(as long as its legal) for the rest of our lives, not because of addiction to nicotine BUT because of the habit we have developed of the hand to mouth. Others will use this as a cessation device and give up nicotine all together.

 

[frankyfive]

I've tried everything from...gum, patches, even Chantix. I will say I succeeded with Chantix years ago but I really had to avoid being in places where smoking was allowed. So hanging with friends had to be limited. In fact after of year of not smoking that was all it took to break. Hanging around smokers. I had to get a hit. and then another and game over back to smoking again. It took me the whole Chantix regiment to quit. I got my first vape kit on the 26th of Nov. In the first week I had already dropped off from being a pack an half a day smoker to 3 packs that entire week. This is the start of week 4 for me and I have not had an analog since the 7th. So far the benefits are real and impressive. I am starting to smell things again. I dont wake up with with tons of junk to spit up. I feel a ton better and I get a ton more things done quicker as I dont have to stop and take a smoke break all the time...and yes I've saved a few dollars on my journey. I still get cravings for an alalog and its strongest right when I wake up and right after a hearty meal but hitting my PV now takes care of that. I would have to say the act of vaping and the feel I get from vaping really takes the place of smoking so Im really not feeling like Im missing anything. Check back with me in 6 months =)

 

[Robino1]

I think I understand what is trying to be explained in regards to addiction and placebo. The ecig does satisfy, by being a placebo, to the habit of smoking. It is, in a much less harmful way, tricking my mind that I'm continuing the HABIT of smoking.

I don't know, now that you've made me think about it, if I have an addiction to nicotine. I will certainly let you know since I'm starting to decrease my nic level.

But there has to be some addiction to nic! Why else do I think about having an actual cigarette at different times? There are days when, no matter what juices I vape, I'm just not quite satisfied! I call those times the evil cig days. To me, that is when the addiction raises its ugly head. The ecig, during those times, certainly helps and enables me to fight through those urges.

Granted, they are not as severe as when I tried to quit smoking.....MANY times and many ways. The only method that I didn't try was chantix. That drug scared the hell out of me. I smoked a pack a day for almost 40 years. If I was not able to vape, I would be smoking again. No doubt in my mind. I even smoked while wearing the patch, no it never made me feel ill to do both.

I have a lot to think about......

 

[Kable]

NO NO NO !!. The harmful substance in a cigarette is "TAR". Without the tar the electric cigarette is a placebo. You are focusing on nicotine when nicotine isn't the issue, TAR IS. Tar is the killer !. It has nothing to do with addiction. It is to do with the fact it kills people. So which is more important to you ? I think i make this quite clear in my original post. ELECTRIC CIGARETTES ARE A PLACEBO. This makes them more acceptable, do you not understand that ?. Nicotine is present in electric cigarettes so the smart choice is to use the electric cigarette as a placebo to avoid the tar ? Nicotine is just the hook. BASICALLY, USE THE PLACEBO AS A REPLACEMENT FOR TAR. Could i make this point any clearer ?. So to encourage any government to accept the electric cigarette would be to suggest that it is a placebo, because it is. And again "nicotine has nothing to do with it". It's a tar replacement PLACEBO. And your comments are detrimental to the idea that electric cigarettes are acceptable in society. If your FDA understood this idea then everyone could benefit.
I did say in my original post that withdrawal symptoms from addictive substances aren't why people are addicted. What i said was, "it's more about the person and not the substance". They act like spoilt children that have to have their way. They want something and will do anything to get it. And "neural chemistry" doesn't change the fact that these types of people act like spoilt brats. And were doing so long before they ever knew the illegal substances existed. They blame all of there obnoxious idiosychracies on the substances they abuse. They hide behind it and use it as a sheild. It's like this "oh i feel cold" "must be the substance". "oh i feel good today" "must be the substance" Absolutely every aspect of their life is covered by their substance abuse. And to add insult to injury they expect everyone else to believe this ridiculous nonsense. I know dozens of people all "addicted" to this n that and they "all" claim sickness benefit based on the symptoms of withdrawal. I wasn't born yesterday, I am an observer. I've been observing this for about 20 years.

I think I understand what you're trying to say about the placebo, but a placebo for tar doesn't make sense, and calling something what it's not isn't going to help our cause, I don't think. I actually use the electric cigarette as a replacement for chewing tobacco, which doesn't have tar in it. Now, if people are using e cigs with zero nic, then that could accurately be described as a placebo, because there would be no active chemicals involved.

Everything you are saying about addiction is wildly inaccurate. Like someone else already said, addiction and habit are often used interchably, when they don't mean the same thing. Most people who smoke have both, which is why the e cig can be so effective. It replaces both. And most people I know who have addictions don't blame the substance. They blame themselves. This is detrimental to their mental health, and can perpetuate the spiral of addiction. Calling them spoilt children isn't productive, nor is it accurate.

 

[synthsiggy]

The amount of sheer medical wrong in this statement is astounding. Without the toxic chemicals(or more accurately with LESS of them) found in cigaretts, of which tar is ONE(of many), e cigaretts can not be called a placebo as they still provide the ADDICTIVE substance(unless a person vapes a 0 nic liquid). Your "observations" on addiction are a throwback to the 20's or 30's mentality regarding addiction. Addiction changes brain chemistry this is a FACT. People become addicted to these chemicals because the initial pleasureable effects that the chemical provides them. As longer useage becomes the norm people "need" the substance to keep their brain chemistry normal. With out the chemical present in their body the brain creates a chemical reaction that causes a physical reaction, this can be as simple as mood swings and as devistating as full(and sometimes deadly) withdrawl. What e-cigs provide is a replacement in delivery for the bodys "needed" nicotine. E-cigaretts are more akin to a long term nicotine replacement.

Some of us will vape(as long as its legal) for the rest of our lives, not because of addiction to nicotine BUT because of the habit we have developed of the hand to mouth. Others will use this as a cessation device and give up nicotine all together.

It is a placebo. And illegal drug addiction is not an illness. But that is not important and off topic.
It maybe true that the exact details i've mentioned about e cigs being a placebo are not completely correct. You may have clarified that by saying it is a nicotine replacement. But i am committed, so i have to say e cigs are a placebo. At least categorizing them as such would give people a better understanding of what e cigs actually are and how to define them. So if you can agree with that then i am happy to admit i made a few mistakes in my post.

 

[unlearnaddiction]

I have really sparked a wonderful debate here and I can tell you there is no right answer but I do want to chime in with my two cents as I have given this a LOT of thought.

To call electronic cigarettes a placebo is inaccurate. A placebo mimics something as much as possible. For example, if people are doing a drug study they will have a control group but you can't give the control group nothing as the power of the mind is very strong and some people get better just by THINKING they are being treated. Therefore they give the control group a sugar pill that looks as much like the real thing as possible. The key is the placebo needs to be as close to the real thing as possible but have no effect on the body. Some electronic cigarettes are similar to placebos in that they look as much like the real thing as possible. However, it cannot be said that they have no effect on the body. Even the nicotine free ones do still have many chemicals that likely do have some effect on the body but FAR fewer chemicals than the real thing. Last, a placebo by definition is used to trick someone into thinking they are being treated. So they can't know they are geting a placebo for it to be a placebo. So if you tell someone you are giving them a sugar pill its just a sugar pill because it no longer is convincing the person they are being treated.

But, and this is a very big BUT, electronic cigarettes do work very well due to their placebo like quality of replicating the feel of real cigarettes. Addiction works by associating sights, smells, feelings, tastes with pleasure inducing hormones/neurotransmitters in the brain. Millions of years of evolution have taught us that if something induces the release of dopamine in the brain it is something good and should be sought out and repeated (think high calorie food and sex). This helped our species survive. But drugs and cigarettes cause dopamine release too and are NOT beneficial in anyway. But the addiction part of your brain is not smart enough to know it is not beneficial and craves it anyway, because that is what milions of years of evolution have told it to do.

Electronic cigarettes trick the brain into thinking that you are still smoking by giving you many of the same sights, smells, tastes that you had with cigarettes. However, they have far fewer chemicals and just by knowledge of the ingredients they are almost certainly safer than real cigarettes. And lastly, if you use nicotine free ones they don't cause a dopamine release so your brain can UNLEARN the addiction because it realizes that doing this no longer causes dopamine release so this is not something beneficial and therefore not worth craving. And that is why people can quit smoking with electronic cigarettes when the gums and patches failed. Because your brain is not only addicted ot the nictine, it is addicted to the sight, smell, taste of cigarettes and that addiction was learned and has to be UNLEARNED to get rid of the cravings. Told you I gave this a lot of thought

 

[synthsiggy]

I have really sparked a wonderful debate here and I can tell you there is no right answer but I do want to chime in with my two cents as I have given this a LOT of thought.

To call electronic cigarettes a placebo is inaccurate. A placebo mimics something as much as possible. For example, if people are doing a drug study they will have a control group but you can't give the control group nothing as the power of the mind is very strong and some people get better just by THINKING they are being treated. Therefore they give the control group a sugar pill that looks as much like the real thing as possible. The key is the placebo needs to be as close to the real thing as possible but have no effect on the body. Some electronic cigarettes are similar to placebos in that they look as much like the real thing as possible. However, it cannot be said that they have no effect on the body. Even the nicotine free ones do still have many chemicals that likely do have some effect on the body but FAR fewer chemicals than the real thing. Last, a placebo by definition is used to trick someone into thinking they are being treated. So they can't know they are geting a placebo for it to be a placebo. So if you tell someone you are giving them a sugar pill its just a sugar pill because it no longer is convincing the person they are being treated.

But, and this is a very big BUT, electronic cigarettes do work very well due to their placebo like quality of replicating the feel of real cigarettes. Addiction works by associating sights, smells, feelings, tastes with pleasure inducing hormones/neurotransmitters in the brain. Millions of years of evolution have taught us that if something induces the release of dopamine in the brain it is something good and should be sought out and repeated (think high calorie food and sex). This helped our species survive. But drugs and cigarettes cause dopamine release too and are NOT beneficial in anyway. But the addiction part of your brain is not smart enough to know it is not beneficial and craves it anyway, because that is what milions of years of evolution have told it to do.

Electronic cigarettes trick the brain into thinking that you are still smoking by giving you many of the same sights, smells, tastes that you had with cigarettes. However, they have far fewer chemicals and just by knowledge of the ingredients they are almost certainly safer than real cigarettes. And lastly, if you use nicotine free ones they don't cause a dopamine release so your brain can UNLEARN the addiction because it realizes that doing this no longer causes dopamine release so this is not something beneficial and therefore not worth craving. And that is why people can quit smoking with electronic cigarettes when the gums and patches failed. Because your brain is not only addicted ot the nictine, it is addicted to the sight, smell, taste of cigarettes and that addiction was learned and has to be UNLEARNED to get rid of the cravings. Told you I gave this a lot of thought

Maybe e cigs should be shoe horned into the placebo category because you cannot get much closer. I have to say that before today i have never heard anyone call an e cig a placebo. Maybe that should change. Seeing as the term is quite a lose one with more than one meaning anyway. I think the e cig fits quite nicely into placebo territory. But someones going to tell me i am wrong. But that's ok.

 

[Robino1]

I have really sparked a wonderful debate here and I can tell you there is no right answer but I do want to chime in with my two cents as I have given this a LOT of thought.

To call electronic cigarettes a placebo is inaccurate. A placebo mimics something as much as possible. For example, if people are doing a drug study they will have a control group but you can't give the control group nothing as the power of the mind is very strong and some people get better just by THINKING they are being treated. Therefore they give the control group a sugar pill that looks as much like the real thing as possible. The key is the placebo needs to be as close to the real thing as possible but have no effect on the body. Some electronic cigarettes are similar to placebos in that they look as much like the real thing as possible. However, it cannot be said that they have no effect on the body. Even the nicotine free ones do still have many chemicals that likely do have some effect on the body but FAR fewer chemicals than the real thing. Last, a placebo by definition is used to trick someone into thinking they are being treated. So they can't know they are geting a placebo for it to be a placebo. So if you tell someone you are giving them a sugar pill its just a sugar pill because it no longer is convincing the person they are being treated.

But, and this is a very big BUT, electronic cigarettes do work very well due to their placebo like quality of replicating the feel of real cigarettes. Addiction works by associating sights, smells, feelings, tastes with pleasure inducing hormones/neurotransmitters in the brain. Millions of years of evolution have taught us that if something induces the release of dopamine in the brain it is something good and should be sought out and repeated (think high calorie food and sex). This helped our species survive. But drugs and cigarettes cause dopamine release too and are NOT beneficial in anyway. But the addiction part of your brain is not smart enough to know it is not beneficial and craves it anyway, because that is what milions of years of evolution have told it to do.

Electronic cigarettes trick the brain into thinking that you are still smoking by giving you many of the same sights, smells, tastes that you had with cigarettes. However, they have far fewer chemicals and just by knowledge of the ingredients they are almost certainly safer than real cigarettes. And lastly, if you use nicotine free ones they don't cause a dopamine release so your brain can UNLEARN the addiction because it realizes that doing this no longer causes dopamine release so this is not something beneficial and therefore not worth craving. And that is why people can quit smoking with electronic cigarettes when the gums and patches failed. Because your brain is not only addicted ot the nictine, it is addicted to the sight, smell, taste of cigarettes and that addiction was learned and has to be UNLEARNED to get rid of the cravings. Told you I gave this a lot of thought

I can concur to a point. The ecig that I use looks NOTHING like a real cig, the juice that I vape tastes NOTHING like a real cig. I was able to switch over from cigs BECAUSE the juices I use taste SOOO much better than smoking. I was able to sorta "trick" my mind into thinking that I just switched my "brand" of cigarette somewhat.

The ecig that I started with is the same one that I use today. It is not a cig-a-like. I vaped and smoked for the first month. The same day that I received my ecig, I immediately went down to 6 cigs that day. 5 cigs a day for about a week or so, then down to 3. I finally got to the point where I was only taking two puffs off a cig at night because it tasted so bad. That lasted for 2 nights.

How quickly the switch is made is really an individual thing. Some take a year or more to make the switch, some do it as soon as they receive their kit. It does work eventually. Even if it isn't a complete switch, what they DON'T smoke is a HUGE improvement. As I stated earlier, I have tried every way imaginable (except Chantix) to quit. I really had no hope that this would work either. I am so happy I was wrong. I am now cigarette free for 2 months.

I do hope that they don't take this from me because I know I would go back to smoking. I thought for sure I would die with a cigarette by my side. My husband even cannot believe that this is working for me.

 

[IsotopeFeaney]

I have been vaping for a week and have had no cravings for real tobacco in any form. I can't belive, that after fifty years of cigarettes, cigars, and pipe tobacco use, I could ever stop one day and start vaping the next day. I would have to say that vaping has worked for me.

 

[POSEIDON]

It is a placebo. And illegal drug addiction is not an illness. But that is not important and off topic.
It maybe true that the exact details i've mentioned about e cigs being a placebo are not completely correct. You may have clarified that by saying it is a nicotine replacement. But i am committed, so i have to say e cigs are a placebo. At least categorizing them as such would give people a better understanding of what e cigs actually are and how to define them. So if you can agree with that then i am happy to admit i made a few mistakes in my post.

Regardless of your opinions, calling e-cigs something that they arent does nothing but add more confusion to what they actually are. Calling them what they are(which is an alternate nicotine delivery device) simplifys the discussion and lessons the confusion.

As to your comment regarding illicit drugs and addiction, allow me to ask you where you got your medical degree from since, what you are in essence claming is that YOU somehow now better than the medical community. Addiction IS an illness, regardless of illicit or legal drug useage, this is an established fact. Hundreds, if not thousands, of studies have been preformed on the effects of addiction on the human brain. Now I'm no doctor, HOWEVER I am a physical therapist(ok one semester short) and the knowledge gained in that feild of medicine(yes I had to study addictions effects on the body) CLEARLY outline the issues with nicotine. It is addictive, and one of the more addictive chemicals in the world. Unlike other addictive substances most first time users have negative effects(caughing, eyes watering, nausea, ect) and yet they come back. Nicotine is a mood altering chemical, it is a cardiovascular stimulant, it is also a relaxant. The pharmacological and behavioral characteristics that determine tobacco addiction are similar to those determining addiction to ...... and ........ There is also a social aspect to nicotine, smokers are forced into small closed areas in public and, as humans are social creatures, they strike up conversations, plan thier breaks with other smokers at work, ect.

Aside from nicotine replacement, if as you claim e-cigs are a placebo, how do you account for the people that use other types of nicotine intake(be they pipes, chew, cigars, exc) who have made the change to e-cigs(not pipe mods, and there is no chew mods that I am aware of, the cigar mods, but e-cigs). Again it can ONLY be attributed to nicotine, being delivered.

 

[synthsiggy]

Let me reiterate my point even though absolutely everyone disagrees.

Cigarettes contain all kinds of carcinogens right, 1000's. "ONE" ingredient is nicotine. That particular ingredient is addictive. Whether any of the others are i've no idea. What i'm trying to do is compare an e cig, with or without nicotine, to a drug with no active ingredients. Call me ignorant but for this explanation i am going to deliberately ignore the fact that nicotine is present in an e cig and is an active ingredient. I'm focusing on the ingredients in a cigarette that are harmful which are not present in e cigs. Which by the way everyone seems to be overlooking, and appear to be doing so deliberately. No one seems to be mentioning 100% of poisons in cigarettes. Everyone is focusing on nicotine, and i'm not !. I totally understand what everyone means when they disagree about this subject. An e cig is not just a device for nicotine use. It is used for the same reasons, which are numerous, people use cigarettes. It's the habit or the act of breathing in smoke/vapour and breathing it out. Along with all the other idiosycracies that you'd relate to smoking. People vape in the car,at work,in a bar, restaurant, at home in front of the tv, having a cup of coffee the list goes on. All these activities are things that remind smokers what it was like when they smoke a cigarette. Do you think people smoke because they are addicted to nicotine or is it because it's just a lifestyle they became addicted to. The lifestyle outweighs any nicotine addiction by a mile. There are just so many reasons for smoking and nicotine addiction isn't one of them. So now i'm beginning to process what i've written.

I have reached a new conclusion, you are right and i am wrong. i admit it. It's the nicotine isn't it....NICOTINE IS THE PLACEBO. Now please tell me i'm wrong about this. Nicotine is the cigarette without all the harmful ingredients in the same way a drug without active ingredients is a placebo. Tell me i am wrong about this and i'll say no more about it. Nothing wrong with lateral thinking folks. Talk to me !.

 

[unlearnaddiction]

Wow, I really love the discussion I have sparked here. There are some great points.

Ok let me respond to a few things. First, I would not solely characterize electronic cigarettes as another nicotine delivery device. I say this for 2 reasons. One because it can be used with no nicotine. Two, it is so much more than a nicotine delivery device. It treats not only the nicotine aspect to the addiction but the functional aspect as well. It treats the cravings that come by the sight, smell, taste of cigarettes and unlike nicotine gum or patches can actually cure the entire addiction and get someone to the point where they have no more cravings even if they stop vaping. Because the addiction has been unlearned.

As for the placebo thing, I merely use that term to explain how it can be used in place of real cigarettes to trick the brain into thinking you are still smoking. Is it entirely accurate, no. A true placebo would be a water based only electronic cigarette that somehow miraculously simulated a cigarette so perfectly that you cannot tell the difference and that you do not know you are using but think you are using a real cigarette. So don't get fixated on that term.

Lastly no, nicotine is not the placebo. Nicotine is a drug and is addictive. But no it is not the only reason cigarettes are addictive. There are other chemicals involved. And some have pointed out that nicotine is not the reason cigarettes are so harmful. This is true. Most studies looking at nicotine in isolation show it to be about as harmful as caffeine. Which is not harmless but we can all agree is not as harmful as cigarettes.

I love this discussion. You guys are really making me think

 

[DoctorJ]

First of all, I quit analogs within 5 hours of using my first vaping device. Not sure why it worked so quickly for me, but it did. I had tried patches, lozenges, pharmaceuticals, hypnosis, homeopathic cures....nothing worked. I'm not going to enter the debate of placebos and what is addictive when it comes to nicotine.

HOWEVER, and feel free to disagree with me if you like and this is my opinion on the subject. We use the words addiction and illness/sickness/disease hand-in-hand; this is where I disagree with ANYONE who argues the point that addiction, be it to any drug (nicotine, narcotics, alcohol even food ..whatever) ADDICTION IS NOT AN ILLNESS,SICKNESS or DISEASE IT IS A WEAKNESS!!!! Addiction to any substance can be stopped if the addict wants it to. Yes there may be physical and mental withdrawal symptoms, but if the addict wants to quit, they can seek the assistance they need, whether it be medical, spiritual, psychological...whatever. Addiction doesn't make you "sick" per se, it just makes you want more of the substance you are addicted to. I look at it this way; we are not born "addicted" to anything. But if we start using a substance that has addictive qualities, ipso facto, we become addicted, not sick or ill. Nor can we "catch" an addiction. (Yes I know some babies are born drug addicted, but you know what I mean).

DSM-IV Symptoms of Substance Dependence (another word for weakness)
The criteria for substance dependence include the following:

The individual has developed a tolerance for the substance. This means that they have to use more in order to get the same effect.
The user continues to abuse these substances despite obvious evidence that it is causing them harm.
The individual experiences withdrawal symptoms when they stop taking the substance
The user finds it difficult to cut down on the amount they are using
Lack of control over the amount they consume.
Loss of interest in other activities that they once enjoyed.
Devoting increasing amounts of time to the substance abuse. This includes time spent obtaining the substance, time spent using it and time spent recovering from the effects.
If the individual experiences three or more of the above symptoms within a 12-month period then it indicates that they have become dependent.

( http://alcoholrehab.com/alcohol-rehab/dsm-iv-substance-abuse-disorders/ )

Please excuse this rant, but I am rather passionate on this subject (as you can probably tell ) Sorry if I belabored my point.

 

[dnakr]

I began smoking when I was 12 years old. I tried quitting using patches and gum, and I failed every time. I was constantly using a straw or pen as a cigarette.

I started vaping when I was 43. I was smoking almost 2 packs a day. Now that I have been vaping for 5 years, I honestly believe (and I am speaking for me only) that my main addiction is functional "hand to mouth" and "seeing smoke". Call it whatever, but I can never give up my device. Nicotine yes, my device - no....

 

[Whoust]

I find what e-cigs did differently for me in my struggle to quit was that it gave me something else to do rather than smoke... seeing myself exhale vapor was satisfying my cravings. I think i could of even used e-cigs with 0 nicotine and it would still have worked as a way to ween of cigarettes.. But I only smoked for 2 years. Still a successful example!

 

[Dvdx]

I've been a smoker for over 20 years and I've tried every method of quitting, but always reverted back to smoking in the end. 2 weeks ago I tried vaping. It was hard to switch as the first few days I would still have a cigarette or two. But as time went on, the smell of analogs slowly became unbearable. Now I can't even stand it. Vaping is awesome and I'm glad I tried it (after resisting for years).

 

[synthsiggy]

Wow, I really love the discussion I have sparked here. There are some great points.

Ok let me respond to a few things. First, I would not solely characterize electronic cigarettes as another nicotine delivery device. I say this for 2 reasons. One because it can be used with no nicotine. Two, it is so much more than a nicotine delivery device. It treats not only the nicotine aspect to the addiction but the functional aspect as well. It treats the cravings that come by the sight, smell, taste of cigarettes and unlike nicotine gum or patches can actually cure the entire addiction and get someone to the point where they have no more cravings even if they stop vaping. Because the addiction has been unlearned.

As for the placebo thing, I merely use that term to explain how it can be used in place of real cigarettes to trick the brain into thinking you are still smoking. Is it entirely accurate, no. A true placebo would be a water based only electronic cigarette that somehow miraculously simulated a cigarette so perfectly that you cannot tell the difference and that you do not know you are using but think you are using a real cigarette. So don't get fixated on that term.

Lastly no, nicotine is not the placebo. Nicotine is a drug and is addictive. But no it is not the only reason cigarettes are addictive. There are other chemicals involved. And some have pointed out that nicotine is not the reason cigarettes are so harmful. This is true. Most studies looking at nicotine in isolation show it to be about as harmful as caffeine. Which is not harmless but we can all agree is not as harmful as cigarettes.

I love this discussion. You guys are really making me think

No. Alright then. So what about this then. Smoking looks cool. People start smoking because they saw someone else doing it and thought it would make them look just as cool. Or in addition. Like that idea people get in their minds about having a nice cold pint of lager in the middle of a swelteringly hot day in the summer. Thing is one pint is the dream !. You can imagine how nice that would be so you'd do it. But it don't end there. You continue or repeat that same activity and end up drinking a dozen pints. But really all you really wanted was to fulfil that one very pleasant experience you imagined in the beginning, and drinking just the one pint would have been enough. Maybe it's the same with cigarettes. Maybe all you really wanted was one, but you continue to light up one after the other because you think it looks cool. So combine these two activities and what are you left with. Well you're left sitting down the pub chain smoking whilst drinking a few pints of lager and watching the footy. It's a lifestyle and everyone is still doing it because they've got nothing else to do or can't think of anything else to do because that's all they've ever done. It's an addiction to a lifestyle. And i don't think any of these people consider any kind of addiction to nicotine. Besides, what are you going to drink with your ..., or what are you going to smoke with your drink ?. Most can't have one without the other. Oh then there's the power of suggestion. Where people are told there is an addictive substance in cigarettes so in turn become addicted, and is this perpetuated by the medical profession ?. If people didn't know so much would they still be consciously addicted ? Or when they here other people say " i just can't seem to kick my smoking habit" then eventually at some point say something similar to someone else. Maybe it's a sociological thing. Maybe people that smoke just want to be part of a bigger group. To go along with the crowd. Maybe it started with peer pressure. Maybe it still is peer pressure. There must be thousands of reasons that encourage people to smoke. All of which are subliminal. So then there's vaping. Do pv's look cool ?. Do you think they look cool ?. Do you think you look cool when using one ?. Do you like exhaling large clouds of vapour and pretending you're a dragon hehe ?. Is it something you do instead of smoking because you thought you looked cool when you smoked ?. Are you part of a global sociological group that use pv's and your social life revolves around it ?. Do you frequent online forums regularly to talk about something you know everyone else there is involved with ?. Does any of this have anything to do with an addiction to nicotine ?. I don't think it does, does it ?. It's a lifestyle that you got tangled up in. And you like it. I just think that one thing leads to another . It's all relative !. A long string of events going way back to when you first started smoking is why you are here now. Nothing to do with any addiction to nicotine. But when it comes down to talking seriously with friends or family about why you do it, then the reason is because you are addicted to nicotine. Well it aint is it, you know it aint. But you can't explain why you say it even though it aint true. I for one aint addicted to nicotine. I gave up smokin for health reasons. But i still smoke. And i use a vapourizer. You want to call it vapin that's up to you. i smoke because i look cool. SMOKING IS COOL AND YOU KNOW IT !.

 

[pathms88]

I have cut down significantly since I have been vaping... I do tend to have a regular cigarette at times but my cravings for regular smokes has diminished a ton. It has taken some time and I can imagine that eventually the regular smokes will be something of the past for me. Take care all and happy holidays!