Equipment is Biggest Hurdle to E-Cig Proliferation

[slgshane]

I've been vaping for about three months now and have tried helping my friends quit smoking using it as a tool. Everyone is always on-board for the first few days, but then eventually their devices stop working as well as they did the first couple days. They stop and go right back to smoking.

Despite my lengthy experience, I honestly haven't had much more luck. I started by getting a Joyetech Ego-tank starter kit. Worked OK for the first couple days, but then the things started leaking, flooding, gurgling, and giving burnt vapes. Went to a local vape store and used a Vapeonly BCC Mega clearomizer. Loved it in the store and bought one. Worked AMAZING at first, and then three days later went to the same issues. Leaking and TONS of burnt vapes. Went and did more research and everyone was recommending the Kanger EVOD. Went and bought one of those. Again, worked incredible for a few days, and now here I am getting half the vapor I did on the day I got it and the vapes don't taste as good. I shouldn't have to replace coils after such a short period of use on these things.

What gives? Is there any non-drip solution that is actually reliable/consistent beyond the first few days? It needs to have a tank. Otherwise the whole process just becomes too much of a hassle. I feel bad that I've convinced friends to buy these devices and they stop using them after a couple days. I feel like that's the biggest issue. The equipment just isn't good enough yet. The average person isn't going to go into mods and hand-built Frankenstein projects. At that point it's just taking over your life. Is there a hassle-free solution with great performance?

 

[Baditude]

Some of the newer clearomizers and Vivi Nova tanks have rebuildable (meaning "replaceable") wicks and heads that can be relatively easy to replace when they stop working. The devices usually come with two extra heads, and additional ones are available to purchase separately where you buy the devices. I don't use them much myself so I can't give particular brands or models.

 

[zoiDman]

I would Never start a New Vapor with a Clearomizer.

Start them with Filler Type Cartomizers until they get the hang of vaping. And are thru he Non-Smoking nerves.

Then turn them on to Clearos.

 

[Baditude]

My go-to delivery device for the last year has been cartotanks. A little more involved than the "fill and go" simplicity of a clearo-type device, but I feel they are more consistant once you get the methodology down. I've written a blog on the more common juice delivery devices. Focus on both the cartomizer and the cartotank descriptions.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...k-what-primer-juice-delivery-attachments.html

I've also written a cartotank tutorial here, with step-by-step instructions and a couple of videos on cartotank use. One of them is the following cartotank tutorial done by PBusardo. Sorry about the extreme length, but there's a ton of info included in his video.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/baditude/3710-5-cartomizer-tank-setup.html

 

[Vault]

When I was smoking.... I had a favourite lighter.

It was a petrol powered, flint activated, wicked lighter made out of an old Browning 303 bullet.
It was the most awkward piece of kit to use but looked great.

Without a back-up lighter such as a Bic or Clipper I would have blamed equipment failure for me not being able to light-up. I never blamed the Browning lighter if it didn`t light but always cussed the Bic or Clipper disposables if they didn`t work when needed.

 

[mist opportunity]

slgshane, as a newbie I feel I cannot advise you better than longer serving members, but I can assure you I felt the same frustrations starting out. I expected to set up my kit and be away, no problems other than the clearo dying after a while. I didn't expect to encounter flooding, gurgling, leaking. I have since learned (mostly through browsing this forum) that like with any kind of equipment, maintenance is required and also early malfunction sometimes occurs. I have become quite curious on how to resolve the problems rather than just dumping them and giving up, so I searched for a way to fix them, resulting in much success.

I don't see vaping as an easy ride to quit smoking, rather than a new experience where I need to clue up on the subject. I'm learning a lot of trial and error is in order but I am quite prepared to put up with that rather than go back to analogs.

 

[eratikmind]

Is there a hassle-free solution with great performance?

Unfortunately . . . No. As relative to everything else, there is a premium for quality.

Actually, smoking created many more issues for me than vaping ever will.

- Andy

 

[Susan W.]

Sounds like you're having a run of bad luck there slgshane. Or really hard on your stuff. And maybe not filling right or something. Definitely need to have backups just in case and in my experience everything I've bought has been really reliable. I only burned up a carto the first time I filled one (or thought I filled it).

 

[Baditude]

slgshane, as a newbie I feel I cannot advise you better than longer serving members, but I can assure you I felt the same frustrations starting out. I expected to set up my kit and be away, no problems other than the clearo dying after a while. I didn't expect to encounter flooding, gurgling, leaking. I have since learned (mostly through browsing this forum) that like with any kind of equipment, maintenance is required and also early malfunction sometimes occurs. I have become quite curious on how to resolve the problems rather than just dumping them and giving up, so I searched for a way to fix them, resulting in much success.
I don't see vaping as an easy ride to quit smoking, rather than a new experience where I need to clue up on the subject. I'm learning a lot of trial and error is in order but I am quite prepared to put up with that rather than go back to analogs.

You bring up an interesting and equally important point, Mist.

Vaping is much harder than smoking ever could be. With smoking you just light it up and go. You can't get any easier than simple combustion of plant material and papar.

With vaping, planning and determination is involved. Some basic knowledge and a little experience of how each device works is necessary, and what to do to troubleshoot when a device doesn't work properly. Charged batteries need to be available or no vaping can occur.....this requires meticulous recharging of spent batteries or there will be no vapor. Backup batteries need to be available for those times when one unexpectantly dies on you at an inconvenient time.

Don't run out of juice! No juice, no vapor. Backup juice delivery devices are needed when the one we are using just stops. This is why many of us carry a small arsenal of vape gear with us where ever we go.

Finally, a person needs to be sincerely dedicated to quit smoking. As said above, vaping is more complicated than smoking, so when something doesn't work (and this happens more often than not) there needs to be a backup plan in place. Don't give yourself an excuse to go the easy route and run to the store to buy a pack of cigarettes. Backup for your backups.

Our current gear is actually much more dependable and consistant than what was available just one year ago when I started vaping. New and better devices are being released on the market almost every month. This is a brand new market relatively speaking, still in its infancy, and it will continue to get better for us.

 

[Vault]

It`s not easy giving up smoking, there are a couple of crutches and splints available such as patches/gum/hypnosis! or cold turkey.

I think almost every site I`ve seen (and most vendors) state that E-cigs in general are not nicotine replacement therapy or an aid to quitting.

Having said that for some (most and me included) it works that way but it`s not without it`s hassles!
You have to weight up the pro`s and cons of swapping the tobacco for a reletively new and reletively untested alternative.

Now I know this is`nt that helpfull to your original question and without finding out the specifics of why certain devices didn`t work for you or your friends (and i feel..you feel you`ve let your friends down by suggesting this?) it would be hard to help.

Pick a specific device (example the Evods) and post the symptoms and experience, maybe someone can give you a pointer on getting tha back on track and then you can pass this on to your friends

 

[Baditude]

It`s not easy giving up smoking, there are a couple of crutches and splints available such as patches/gum/hypnosis! or cold turkey.

I think almost every site I`ve seen (and most vendors) state that E-cigs in general are not nicotine replacement therapy or an aid to quitting.

Having said that for some (most and me included) it works that way but it`s not without it`s hassles!
You have to weight up the pro`s and cons of swapping the tobacco for a reletively new and reletively untested alternative.

Now I know this is`nt that helpfull to your original question and without finding out the specifics of why certain devices didn`t work for you or your friends (and i feel..you feel you`ve let your friends down by suggesting this?) it would be hard to help.

Pick a specific device (example the Evods) and post the symptoms and experience, maybe someone can give you a pointer on getting tha back on track and then you can pass this on to your friends

Those FDA approved devices and other crutches have a high failure rate. I'm not aware of the success rate of e-cigs to quit smoking comparitively, but I do know e-cigs were the only thing that got me off of the smokes. And I tried the other "crutches" multiple times and failed miserably.

Where the above methods fail, is where e-cigs can bring success. Rubbing a nicotine patch will not release more nicotine into our system during a craving, but increasing our vaping will. The above methods do not address the hand-to-mouth ritual that is so ingrained into our brains, but vaping does. The above methods do not address our need to fill our lungs with smoke, but vaping provides a substitute with vapor.

 

[Wow1420]

The closest I know of to no hassles would be to buy pre-filled cartomizers. Then all you have to worry about is keeping your batteries charged.

Next step if you can handle a little fuss in exchange for better selection of e-juice would be filling your own blank cartomizers.

Of the clearomizers I've tried, Vision Vivi Novas have been the most trouble free.

 

[unclestu]

I am new only three weeks into vaping anything other than gas station ecigs. I started with a Provari and Kanger protanks. I found that it was a lot eaasier one tank lasts the day. The 18650 bat lasts over a day so I never have a situation of running out of juice either electrically or ejuice. I know thaat a loot of vapers suggest working your way up to a Provari. For me I found that the reliability of the Provari and my experience with the Kanger Protank makes for a trouble free set up for a nube.
Stu

 

[hvac999]

I am partial to the Boge F16 carto tank. Boge F16 Cartomizer Tank (Clear) Fill it this way How to prime and fill a DCT (dual coil Cartomizer tank) - YouTube

 

[BillyTheWild]

I've been vaping for about three months now and have tried helping my friends quit smoking using it as a tool. Everyone is always on-board for the first few days, but then eventually their devices stop working as well as they did the first couple days. They stop and go right back to smoking.

Despite my lengthy experience, I honestly haven't had much more luck. I started by getting a Joyetech Ego-Tank starter kit. Worked OK for the first couple days, but then the things started leaking, flooding, gurgling, and giving burnt vapes. Went to a local vape store and used a Vapeonly BCC Mega clearomizer. Loved it in the store and bought one. Worked AMAZING at first, and then three days later went to the same issues. Leaking and TONS of burnt vapes. Went and did more research and everyone was recommending the Kanger EVOD. Went and bought one of those. Again, worked incredible for a few days, and now here I am getting half the vapor I did on the day I got it and the vapes don't taste as good. I shouldn't have to replace coils after such a short period of use on these things.

What gives? Is there any non-drip solution that is actually reliable/consistent beyond the first few days? It needs to have a tank. Otherwise the whole process just becomes too much of a hassle. I feel bad that I've convinced friends to buy these devices and they stop using them after a couple days. I feel like that's the biggest issue. The equipment just isn't good enough yet. The average person isn't going to go into mods and hand-built Frankenstein projects. At that point it's just taking over your life. Is there a hassle-free solution with great performance?

I am a newbie and I totally see your point and share your frustration. I am a very meticulous person, I spend a lot of time learning how to use and take care of the hardware. Still I have the same compliant as you do with them. However, at the same time, we need to put things into perspective. For the most part, these hardware are mass produced, cheap stuffs. A couple of bucks or so for an atty or carto, $7, $12 for a clearo or tank, etc. Considering this, perhaps we shouldn't be surprised. Maybe you will feel better too if you think about it this way. When my last clearo failed, I told myself, "well, it costs like one beer I had last night drinking with my buddies at the bar and I had WAY more than 1 beer last night", so, no biggie. I am sure they can make more reliable stuffs, but then again, we'll be complaining that it's too expensive to vape.

And, for this reason, even though it's common for more advanced vapers to blast the cig-alike, they do have an important place in the vaping community and the advancement of the smokeless movement. They are so easy for beginners. Pretty much 0 learning curve and no maintenance to speak of. Plug and Play!

 

[zoiDman]

The closest I know of to no hassles would be to buy pre-filled cartomizers. Then all you have to worry about is keeping your batteries charged.

Next step if you can handle a little fuss in exchange for better selection of e-juice would be filling your own blank cartomizers.

Of the clearomizers I've tried, Vision Vivi Novas have been the most trouble free.

This almost Exactly the Natural Progression I steer Newbies into.

Once they are Smoke Free and have a Handle on Filling Cartos, they can Branch out and try New Things.

But they Always have their Filler Cartos to fall back on when the Newest Latest and Greatest Clearo or Tank doesn't work with their e-Liquids/Voltages.

 

[qorax]

My fool proof system of never going back to smoking:
Three things that might just keep u off the cigarettes, for sure...

1. CORRECT GEAR:

a) Main Unit: Always have a minimum of two (2). And buy quality ones AFTER some serious research on ECF... yes, ECF and nowhere else... b'coz it's only here that u'd find non-partial, non-partisan, like-minded people. Though I've all Mechanical Mods, one could go with one Electronic and the other being Mechanical. Having one Mechanical is always wise, b'coz they typically do not fail, badly. A sound 'electronic' main unit will be the Vamo (inexpensive) and if the budget permits - the the Provari (yah, yah!). Yes, there r many others, but I'd like to only 'add' them to my main-units. The other 'main-unit', a mechanical, could be either the Kamry K-100, or the Kamry-KTS, or a Sigelei #8, or the Smoktech Natural. These r the cheap ones - and they perform equally good (straight out of the box) as their more expensive cousins (like the Caravela, Poldiac, GP-PAPS, Chi-You etc.) do. I'd commence my vape journey with the former ones and try fetching the later only once I'm a bit 'senior' in this game.

b) Juice Delivery Device: These u must have at least double the amount of Main Units u hold. A sound option will be to go the Carto-Tank way. Something like the Boge F-16 series, or the Smok U-DCT or the Smok Stubby. These don't leak... I use the Boge F-16 as my main going juice-tank and it has never leaked. Don't ever think of RBAs until u've matured into vaping... and when u do - start with an IGO-L (dripping atomizer) - the most easy to setup & maintain, AND for a RBA tank it should be the Smok-RSST (yah, not an Aga-T2!). I'd not try RBAs for atleast 6-8 months into vaping. These carto-tanks r inexpensive. We could dwell on the higher priced ones, but they do not perform any better than these... so, could be a next step, not a must.

c) Batteries & Charger/s: Common sense prevails here... that we need to buy only the best. Our vape time will only be as good as the batteries inside the main-units. Remember, I've opined the Vamo, or the Provari and the Mech. Mods earlier... and they take-in user introduced batteries, unlike the built-in battery systems like the Cigalikes or the Penstyles. And for the love of God[vape], buy only Panasonics, or AW or Efest. The Panasonic CGR18650CH is a hybrid Li-ion, which works well with both the 'electronic' and the 'mechanical' mods. Beg, borrow, steal, but definitely get a few of these. HERE's where it usually is available and darn cheap. As with the Main Unit, have at least two (2) Battery Chargers, lest one fails. The Xtar, Pila, and Soshine r fool-proof chargers, while the Nitecore Intellicharger is good too.

2. CARE & MEAINTENANCE: As with any 'gadget', our e-Cig/APV is a 'device' too, periodic care (and love) sure gives them additional milage. Firstly, we need to handle our kit with care, exactly as we usually do with our cellphones (I'm yet to spot one who doesn't!). Secondly, time-to-time inspection and common maintenance (generally keeping the contacts clean) will be good enough to see the gear thru for a long time. Using quality cartos in the tanks (eg. the Boges, the Smoks and the Ikenvapes) will get u satisfying vape. While filling/refilling and replacing the cartos Baditude has the best blog around for the subject (linked before), I follow it to tooth-n-nail and nothing failed. Part of this 'care' is also to maintain our 'supplies'. We need to always have enough of the e-juices, batteries and blank cartos. I usually fetch them every alternative week. Some get consumed, while some remain 'in stock', so a healthy quantity is always at hand. This is not paranoia, it's planning. But even if I'm paranoid - what the heck, I'm off ciggies, ain't I?

3. DETERMINATION: Enough has been already stated by foregoing members on this thread... we need to "go smokeless in one go" with vaping. I did, so can u. The moment we think, "oh, let me puff just one...", u r doomed - b'coz, that opens-up the choice to go back whenever, we think, our vape-gear failed. And that choice is the devil's calling. If u didn't have that choice - u'd find way arounds to continue vaping. The fact remains that we r into vaping b'coz our smoking was a difficult habit to quit, but we wanted to, and thus started looking for alternatives. Vaping is THAT ALTERNATIVE, it assures quitting, nothing else could (yah, we tried!), so why falter that design? Be strong.

BOTTOMLINE: The gears and the quantities, those I mentioned above, are our fool-proof gateway to quit smoking. And could be collected within $100. Do that and u'd always have the perfect combination/gizmo to vape always / anytime without fail. And if u get to vape, when u want to, u'd not look for the cigarette. We don't want that... and their's always a way out. I had been smoking for 30+ yrs., a pack+ a day, of Benson & Hedges, AND the moment I held my first vape eqpt., took a drag (not a 'toot' as Grimmgreen says), I've never gone back. And I'm not the best or the only example - there r scores of them here (on ECF). I want u to be one as well.

Good luck!

Qorax

 

[spaky]

Sure the equipment could always be better, but its still better than the equipment to smoke. Would you believe that I had to replace a pack of cigarettes at least once a day at $7 a pack? That's a really high and expensive replacement rate.

 

[Ryedan]

What gives? Is there any non-drip solution that is actually reliable/consistent beyond the first few days? It needs to have a tank. Otherwise the whole process just becomes too much of a hassle. I feel bad that I've convinced friends to buy these devices and they stop using them after a couple days. I feel like that's the biggest issue. The equipment just isn't good enough yet. The average person isn't going to go into mods and hand-built Frankenstein projects. At that point it's just taking over your life. Is there a hassle-free solution with great performance?

There is no completely hassle-free juice delivery solution on the market yet. When I set up a friend a few months ago I explained about cartos and Vivi Novas. Cartos give fantastic flavor and vapor and there is no maintenance required, but once they are done all you can do is throw them out. Juice selection will typically determine a cartos lifespan and sometimes you can get a bad carto. VNs are not as good in flavor or vapor, but they always work and can be cleaned many times before they fail. OTOH they need to be cleaned regularly or performance will degrade quickly, again depending on juice selection.

My friend chose VN's and I showed him how to use and clean them. He's a happy camper and has stared using cartos lately also.

I think knowing that maintenance is/is not required and how to do that maintenance from the get go is very important for the new vaper. I know this education is not done by manufacturers or suppliers and I've always thought this was very shortsighted of them. As someone else also said already, prefilled cartos are almost fool proof, but you still have to know the signs that it is running dry and install a new one before you get burnt hits. There will also be the occasional dud in a pack. These systems also tend to come with very small batteries so you will be recharging or swapping batts often.

This part of vaping sucks, especially for people who just want it to work with no user input. Of course, cars, motorcycles, houses, swimming pools, DSLRs, all my wood working tools, bicycles and a lot of other things need regular maintenance, or they will eventually fail or perform so poorly they may as well have failed. Just depends if these things are worth it to you.

 

[Dvx67]

Nothing is really plug and play, or I should say.. Plug it into a battery and forget it. Cartos are the easiest but you still need to learn how to experiment and tweak devices to your liking, especially with clearos or refillable tanks. I have yet to buy anything that was just perfect from the factory. It's the nature of the beast currently.