Evolv-ing Thread

[Steamer861]

I forget which atty this was (it was a gift), it had a 5/6 wrap and was a bit too powerful for me.

Now I use mainly Merlins , a 4/5 wrap with a 3mm ID is my standard build. 100w preheat, hits 450f almost instantly.

View attachment 790729

It's a Pharaoh You could take out a few wraps off that coil
I find 100 watt preheat, is just rite for these Big Fused Claptons
I like a quick hit 2 or 3 seconds & get a satisfying hit
@36mg, I could understand how this setup would be "Too Powerful"
I vape real low nic, down to 1 mg now. A lot easier to to use these "Big coils" with low nic

 

[Steamer861]

15 Mil Bubble Glass on the Plus's
They don't look too bad, considering I gained 5 mils of capacity

 

[mikepetro]

My experience with bubble glass is they break easier when knocked over. Unless you use one of those vape rubber band things, which makes it even bulkier. My wife breaks her bubble glass frequently, where the straight sided ones hardly ever break. But then again, she drops her mod a lot

 

[Steamer861]

Bubble Glass is more vulnerable for sure! I had a mod just fall over on the coffee table & crack the glass The quality of said glass was questionable. The extra capacity lures me in, the $ was very reasonable, worth a try Will say the bubble glass don't look as thick as the straight Glass on the Plus I am very careful, have broke few atty glass's in my time

BTW the single coil decks for the Plus's are quite a nice upgrade for they way I use them
I have all ways run them in single coil mode, the single coil deck more concentrates the air flow & produce a little better flavour, My best atty's just got a little better

 

[BillW50]

Breaking glass tanks... well people scared me when I first started vaping saying glass tanks always break and something you are just going to have to put up with. So all of these years I have been buying spare glass for all of my tanks. I even just purchased spare Kayfun 5 glass for the Kayfuns I just started using 4 days ago. And to this very day, I haven't chipped or cracked a single glass tank yet. So I am not sure what all of the fuss is all about?

 

[Steamer861]

I to have a drawer full of spare atty Glass If I have them I don't need them, if I don't I do. Murphy's Law

 

[BillW50]

So your thinking Steamer861, that higher coils, less wraps, and using more rayon wicking produces a hotter vape? Hmm... I never thought about it that way. While I was leaning more like this Aegis Legend mod is lying about its output. And maybe I should toss it on one of my Triades and then see what happens.

 

[Steamer861]

Yes Bill, I'v been using this atty for all most one year now, build it as close to these pics as you can

Better yet get the single coil deck

 

[awsum140]

Be sure to get the coil black and semi-gunked too (no offense Steamer) Actually, for a year that looks pretty darned good. Low sugar, carbon, liquid I'll bet.

Seriously, I think that original coil you posted is pretty much at the sheer mass limit of what a mod can handle, unless it's a mech and you don't mind the risks. That's an awful lot of wire in there.

 

[Steamer861]

Be sure to get the coil black and semi-gunked too (no offense Steamer) Actually, for a year that looks pretty darned good. Low sugar, carbon, liquid I'll bet.

We joined these coils all ready in progress

Low flavouring percentage is the trick. I remember when I first started DIY 15 to over 20% was normal! Big mistake! I have recipes at 4% now & the flavour is intense! More flavour just makes more gunk, not better tasting juice

 

[BillW50]

Its on a Triade 250C now, I started at 40 watts and 75 watts preheat. It goes straight to 450F while firing. See! This is why I find live updates not very useful at all. As you can't see it while you vape and thus what good are they?

But the DNA Cs has this graph. They show you what exactly happened during the vape. And when I DL vape, it isn't even getting close to 400F. So changed it to 100 watts preheat and 60 watts TC. Now it is getting to 450F right dead on the 1 second mark from a 3 second DL vape. It takes 1.5 seconds during a vape to get to 450F if I let the coil cool down. It's still isn't anywhere the vape I get from my FreeMax Triple Mesh Pro coils though. And the mesh is also set at 60 watts without any preheat (.15 ohm). But then again they're Kanthal and not nickel.

Oh by the way Steamer861, 15 days with this rayon wicking and no leaks yet.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Do you not use Steam Engine to model your coils prior to build? I understand it may not be a true representation of the actual built coil given the many variables, but it can be an excellent guide that could demonstrate on how the coil may perform. Punching your 11 wrap Ni200 clapton numbers into Steam gives a Heat Capacity of 300+ mj/k. That is a large value for a single coil (or even dual) so no wonder you are having troubles heating it up. Although I do not use Nickel, the same principle applies with all metal types. I try to aim for a Heat Capacity <200 for a single coil and <120 each for a dual. These are max values, lower equals less power needed to heat the coil.

 

[Steamer861]

Maybe it's the nickel? I use titanium 2 by 24 wrapped in 30, I honestly get flavour from that build as good as the triple coil mesh tank
PID is giving you real good advise! Make a custom CSV file for your build, makes all the difference

 

[BillW50]

 

[Punk In Drublic]

Maybe it's the nickel? I use titanium 2 by 24 wrapped in 30, I honestly get flavour from that build as good as the triple coil mesh tank
PID is giving you real good advise! Make a custom CSV file for your build, makes all the difference

A custom CSV may aid in temp control, but that coil is still a beast and will require alot of power to heat up to preferred temps. Will also require longer time to cool down.

Out of all the types of metal used for a vaping coil, Nickel has the highest Specific Heat Capacity. This means if we could build an identical coil in Kanthal for example (it’s impossible but just saying), where resistance and mass are equal, given the higher Specific Heat Capacity of Nickel it will always heat up slower. The Heat Capacity within Steam models this in relation to the coils mass.

Titanium has the lowest Specific Heat Capacity out of the popular metals. Same dimension Clapton as the coil @BillW50 made (26 core, 32 wrap, 3mmID 11 windings), a Ti 2 coil will only have a Heat Capacity of 182 mj/k. This is still high in my opinion but acceptable and controllable in relation to heating up and cooling down.

 

[BillW50]

I used to use Steam Engine Punk In Drublic for Ni200 coils. But building nickel coils for 2+ years I know what it is going to say anyway, so I don't bother anymore for nickel. Okay try something else for wire, eh? Well let's see, besides nickel I have:

• 26g Kanthal
• 26g Nichrome
• 26g SS316L
• 28g x3 Twisted Kanthal
• 26/32 Clapton Kanthal
• 28g Kanthal
• 32g Kanthal

Any suggestions? Most of this wire I purchased years ago and never used.

 

[Punk In Drublic]

I used to use Steam Engine Punk In Drublic for Ni200 coils. But building nickel coils for 2+ years I know what it is going to say anyway, so I don't bother anymore for nickel. Okay try something else for wire, eh? Well let's see, besides nickel I have:

• 26g Kanthal
• 26g Nichrome
• 26g SS316L
• 28g x3 Twisted Kanthal
• 26/32 Clapton Kanthal
• 28g Kanthal
• 32g Kanthal

Any suggestions? Most of this wire I purchased years ago and never used.

But you were puzzled as to why it took so much power to heat up. The coil is a monster and with that specific Clapton wire you are challenged at keeping its resistance above the DNA 250C limit which I believe is 0.08 ohms, and keeping the Heat Capacity to respectable levels. It’s not a good Clapton in my opinion.

Why not strip the wrap and just use 26awg Nickel?

 

[Punk In Drublic]

26 awg Nickel. 11 wraps on a 3mm ID = 0.1 ohms and a Heat Capacity of 71.42mj/k. This would be a good coil.

Could even go to 12 or 13 wraps if it would fit.

 

[BillW50]

But you were puzzled as to why it took so much power to heat up. The coil is a monster and with that specific Clapton wire you are challenged at keeping its resistance above the DNA 250C limit which I believe is 0.08 ohms, and keeping the Heat Capacity to respectable levels. It’s not a good Clapton in my opinion.

Why not strip the wrap and just use 26awg Nickel?

DNAs fire much lower than .08 ohms. Even Busardo knows this. Yes I was wondering why it couldn't get up to 400F on the Aegis Legend. Although it is now on one of my Triade 250C and it shows (as well as EScribe) it is getting to 450F just fine. Although flavor just doesn't even come close to those FreeMax Triple Mesh coils.

 

[BillW50]

26 awg Nickel. 11 wraps on a 3mm ID = 0.1 ohms and a Heat Capacity of 71.42mj/k. This would be a good coil.

Could even go to 12 or 13 wraps if it would fit.

I didn't list any of my nickel wire since I thought the plan was maybe nickel was killing the flavor and so as to use something else. So I listed all of my something else wire. And now you want me to build the exact same coil as before, but using 26g round nickel instead of 26/32 nickel Claptons? I don't even have to try it, as I have tons of experience with that exact build. And it isn't going to increase flavor, nor vapor, but it will indeed require less power. And that is all it will do.

You know what? I already have these FreeMax coils and they are working just fabulously. And I already have 30 of these FreeMax coils and that will last me about 2 more years. So perhaps I should work on this Plus tank stuff after those coils are gone.