Hawaii legislation (HB 2557) would tax e-cigarettes at 70% of wholesale price, ban sales to minors
- Thread starter Bill Godshall
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Yup, and Bill - your testimony is there -
thank you for all the latest links to the info we need to enlighten folks deluded by ignorant others.Hope that one got exposed ... in general Hawaii tends to be behind the curve in terms of up-to-date knowledge... but folks don't come here for that!
And NOT ONE reference (that I saw) citing actual usage by a minor (other than maybe sampling at a kiosk)! I've NEVER seen a minor use one in over 2 years of vaping.
Yes, I noticed that claim - and have NEVER heard it elsewhere - is this factual? I doubt it; I think another letter from a kid said "killed". Can you imagine trying to drink enough ejuice to kill you??? I immediately gag if it gets farther than the tip of my tongue!
If anything, these ignorant 'professionals' and 'leaders' are poisoning these kids minds with untruths, in making them do their bidding.
Just the facts, please!
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Of course it's false. I'll forgive her because she's young.
We are very fortunate that e-liquid tastes so bad. Of course, that hasn't stopped infants from eating cigarette butts and chew, so parents, uncles, aunts, etc. still need to take extra precautions.
Placebo Effect - I can see forgiving her because she is young but what about the adults and ANTZ groups that are coaching these 6000 kids feeding them a pack of lies? These are 6000 anti e-cig robots that are going to continue to grow up and discourage all the teen smokers who could benefit from e-cigs from using them to quit smoking. Even past their teens - I can see a 21 year old smoker say, " Oh yeah we studied that with REAL and found e-cigs to be bad so we'd rather smoke." These kids and this REAL organization needs to be re-educated before the adults behind them do serious harm.
PE, that 17 year old's letter sure hit all the bullet points that the ANTZ like to "foster" as truth. I wonder who might have actually prepared it?
Video of Hearing on local news channel: E-Cigarettes Under Fire At Legislature - Honolulu News Story - KITV Honolulu
and here:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46317143/ns/local_news-honolulu_hi/#.TzN4vMVYp60
and here:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46317143/ns/local_news-honolulu_hi/#.TzN4vMVYp60
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Hoooray!
Senator David Y. Ige Offers Remarks on Senate Bill 2819 @ Hawai'i Senate Majority Caucus
"It's very clear that the part where they tried to tax the electronic cigarettes ...is very problematic and I will be recommending to the Committee at this point that we remove that portion from the bill".
Senator Ige is Chair of this Committee.
(Note: He erroneously uses the term 'real cigarettes' instead of the correct 'tobacco products' but his intent is clear from the video)
Senator David Y. Ige Offers Remarks on Senate Bill 2819 @ Hawai'i Senate Majority Caucus
"It's very clear that the part where they tried to tax the electronic cigarettes ...is very problematic and I will be recommending to the Committee at this point that we remove that portion from the bill".
Senator Ige is Chair of this Committee.
(Note: He erroneously uses the term 'real cigarettes' instead of the correct 'tobacco products' but his intent is clear from the video)
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Yes, I noticed that claim - and have NEVER heard it elsewhere - is this factual? I doubt it; I think another letter from a kid said "killed". Can you imagine trying to drink enough ejuice to kill you??? I immediately gag if it gets farther than the tip of my tongue!
If anything, these ignorant 'professionals' and 'leaders' are poisoning these kids minds with untruths, in making them do their bidding.
Yes, Kai, the "Nicotine is a deadly poison that threatens the lives of our children" is a recurring theme among the ANTZ. It featured prominently in presentations at the FDA TPSAC meetings about dissolvable tobacco products. They tried to turn it into a mathematical problem: 1 gm of nicotine x 20 orbs in a package equals twice as much nicotine as the lethal dose for a child.
Only problem with the validity of that viewpoint is something you experienced in person. It is very difficult to get that lethal dose to stay down. Nicotine triggers vomiting.
There was one reported case of a child who was sickened by the nicotine in orbs because his father took all of the orbs out of their individual blister packs and put them into a screw top jar. He then left the jar in a room where a three year old was playing unsupervised. The child commenced vomiting and was hospitalized overnight, discharged the next morning with zero lasting effects.
After the first hearing, a scientist from Altria looked back through 27 years of annual reports from the American Association of Poison Control Centers. Despite the fact that there were over 200,000 exposures to tobacco products reported, there was one death. However, the death was not attributed to tobacco, because the child had both cigarettes and Valium in his or her system. My guess would be that the Valium overcame the body's natural defense mechanism of purging the poison.
Link to the abstract: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21821089
So I agree with your conclusion. The only true poisoning going on is of peoples' minds.
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Sounds like we did very good at showing them we do not support the tax part of the bill:
The Volcanites and vaping community can do amazing things when we band together and fight against these bills and other bans.
I would also like to thank everyone at CASAA for all the work they do to find these things and bring them to the vapers so we can fight them and for all the hard work they do helping us fight them.
The Volcanites and vaping community can do amazing things when we band together and fight against these bills and other bans.
I would also like to thank everyone at CASAA for all the work they do to find these things and bring them to the vapers so we can fight them and for all the hard work they do helping us fight them.
Hi Vocalek!
Many many thanks to you, Krisitin and all the other folks who are helping vapers worldwide. I haven't had much time to watch the legal threads over the last year, so I must confess I had to look up 'ANTZ' to confirm my guess. I guessed 'zombies' but 'zealots' is the more politically correct. ;-)
SO yes I agree with you and other posters that we need to enter into a direct dialog with these smaller groups if we want to enlighten them. I found this one news item quote from the hearing, in the Hawaii Reporter link TomCatt posted above (and have heard the same begrudging confession reported by others):
"Also testifying in favor of the measure were the ... Coalition for a Tobacco-Free Hawaii.
Coalition executive director Deborah Zsyman told the committee ...“I think if we find there’s evidence that this is really a product that is safe and does help people quit smoking, then, yes, we’d be supportive of it,” she said."
Coalition executive director Deborah Zsyman told the committee ...“I think if we find there’s evidence that this is really a product that is safe and does help people quit smoking, then, yes, we’d be supportive of it,” she said."
Great find Vocalek! - thanks for posting - I'll post that on a few more sites as well.
Though I'm elated at the Senators' responses, this battle not over -
I am very concerned, on the implementation of the the "banned minor sales" aspect of the bill. That component requires that definitions of an ecigarette be codified in section 709-908, HRS. The language defining the product is critical.
SB2819.DOC
Mr. Godshall, do you (and everyone else!), want to weigh in on this?
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So a 16 year old kid that goes to the hardware store to buy some batteries, wire, heating elements etc for a school science project cant buy those things because they COULD be used to make an electronic cigarette.
Volcano has just posted a video of today's Senate Hearing conclusion on their Facebook page: Welcome to Facebook
UPDATE: there is a reference to "technical" changes to the remaining parts of the bill. I am hoping this means the legal definitions.
UPDATE: there is a reference to "technical" changes to the remaining parts of the bill. I am hoping this means the legal definitions.
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- Apr 2, 2009
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Per kai's inquiry, I suggest the following changes in the definition, with deletions in red and additions in blue
The words in red (to delete) aren't necessary, are duplicative and are excessively broad.
The wrds in blue (to add) help clarify, include e-liquid, and appear to comprehensively cover all e-cigarette products.
The words in red (to delete) aren't necessary, are duplicative and are excessively broad.
The wrds in blue (to add) help clarify, include e-liquid, and appear to comprehensively cover all e-cigarette products.
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This is a great victory and certainly cause for celebration.
But continue to monitor the situation. The bill has a ways to go before it get to a point where it can be signed into law, and it was the Governor who asked to have the bill introduced with the original wording. I have received no response to the letter that I sent to the Governor.
Make sure that the taxation thing doesn't come back as the bill goes through any other committees and then to the full Senate, and and make sure that there is nothing more added. Then the same thing has to be repeated for the House version of the bill.
"Eternal vigilance is the price of freedom."
But continue to monitor the situation. The bill has a ways to go before it get to a point where it can be signed into law, and it was the Governor who asked to have the bill introduced with the original wording. I have received no response to the letter that I sent to the Governor.
Make sure that the taxation thing doesn't come back as the bill goes through any other committees and then to the full Senate, and and make sure that there is nothing more added. Then the same thing has to be repeated for the House version of the bill.
"Eternal vigilance is the price of freedom."
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