Help me understand Mech Mods and figure out if it's right for me...

[timastyle]

So I've been reading up quite a bit on mech mods and trying to understand whether or not it's for me. I currently have a Zmax V5 VV/VW with PT2 and Davide tanks with 1.5 ohm coils. I don't really have any interest at this time to build my own coils, but I do like the slick and compact looks of the mechs. Thanks to a forum member (Tactical) and reading threads on here, I understand the safety issues that one should be aware of before jumping into a mech mod, but there are things that I don't understand still. I'm hoping you all can help shed some light on these things for me to help me make an informed decision:

1. If I'm not planning on sub-ohming or building my own coils, what advantages would I have using a mech mod over my Zmax? Will the flavor and cloud be any different assuming I'm using the same tanks as I currently have?
2. From what I understand, a mech mod starts off with higher voltage (around 4.2V) and decreases as the battery starts getting drained. Wouldn't this make a mech mod less consistent in the vape experience vs. a VW that pushes out the same watts each time?
3. If I'm using 1.5 ohm coils with 32 kanthal, I figure I won't be able to push the high wattages that the sub-ohm users get without burning the wicks.
4. I've been told that a RTA/RDA provide better flavor and vape experience overall, but as I stated before, I don't have a desire to build my own coils. I have found some pre-wound coils that I can purchase for the same price as the Kanger coils even as low as .8 ohms, but I don't know how easy it would be to pair them with a RDA/RTA or even if it's possible. Any thoughts/suggestions on if it would be possible? Here's a link of the coils I found: http://www.avidvaper.com/rebuildable-atomizer-coils/

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

 

[timastyle]

One more question...reading the juices forum, it seems that different flavors, blends, makers, etc have different optimal wattage for the best flavor/cloud. With that being said, how do mech mod users adjust for this?

 

[donnah]

when I started vaping 3 and a half years ago... mechs were pretty much all there were. Egos were popluar and the variable voltage was just coming out. 2.5Ω was considered low resistance. People wanted more power. Variable voltage supplied that power. The kick came out, and people could once again use their mechs. Then genesis atomizers became popular but to run them.. and run them well.. you needed to coil them low and run them on a mech. That is why mechs gained popularity again.

A mech isn't going to magically give you an awesome vape. That awesomeness depends heavily on the atomizer that's on top of it. I did get into genesis attys and mechs but missed the regulated voltage and protection of my provari's. Keeping a genesis upright all the time was getting old. I then found kayfuns and was able to use the provari's again. But now I've got 2 mechanicals (Rollers) that I still want to be able to use. So I keep a couple kayfuns coiled at .8-1Ω to use on the Rollers and the others are coiled higher to use on the Provari's.

But then I had a couple genesis attys that I wanted to be able to still use. So I put micro coils and cotton in them.. and they work great on either the rollers (kicked) or the provari's. All problems finally solved LOL

Mechs are nice and all but if you're not interested in building your own coils then they may not be for you unless you put a kick in them. I got a couple kick clones from fasttech and have been playing around with them but I think I prefer a .8 coil in a kayfun on an unkicked roller. Remember, with a mech (without a kick) taking in consideration the voltage drop.. the highest voltage you're going to get is around 4volts and that's with a fresh batt that it won't stay that high for long. The voltage is going to drop as the batt discharges.... and yes, that makes a mech mod less consistent in the vape experience vs. a VW that pushes out the same watts each time. You have to match your coil resistance to that scenario to get the vape that you want.

I ordered those same premade coils from avidvaper back when I wanted to get into rebuilding and wanted to see what they looked like. I wasn't impressed.. the wicks sometimes slides too loosely inside the coil and that will cause problems.

The flavor and vapor will depend on the voltage applied to that coil... whether it's a mech that's giving you (at the moment) 3.8 volts or a vv/vw device that's set at 3.8v (or the wattage equivalent) The difference is the mech will continually drop in voltage and the zmax won't.

I hope I helped you understand a little more.

 

[donnah]

One more question...reading the juices forum, it seems that different flavors, blends, makers, etc have different optimal wattage for the best flavor/cloud. With that being said, how do mech mod users adjust for this?

Umm.. well... (you ask some good questions that makes one think!) I pretty much don't adjust for this. I mostly make my own juices and run them to where they taste good (as far as voltage goes) I run the same juices in subohm kayfuns on mechs and they taste the same.. warmer maybe.. a bit more intense and more vapor but pretty much the same.

 

[jpcwon]

I am new to vaping and just got a Smok Magneto mech mod. I was wondering the same things (are mechs for me? Will the voltage drop over time affect my vape? Do I want to build my own coils?)....I must say that I am LOVING my new Magneto! My VTR has taken a back seat to it at the moment! Now granted I AM using a Kick 2 in it...The Kick is a fantastic little gizmo....Having VW is great and all, but I really like the added protection that the Kick gives you (short circuit protection, low battery warning)....I am currently running a 2.1 Ohm iClear 30B on the Magneto at 10 watts, and I am getting a wonderful vape! In fact, any tank I've put on the Magneto (30s's, Davide BDC's, Aerotanks, etc..) has worked flawlessly.

All in all, I really like the simplicity of the mech mods. But I would highly recommend getting a Kick 2....It makes the mech experience much more enjoyable IMO and really gives you some flexibility as far as what you can put on top....I just got an RSST RBA delivered as well as some stainless steel mesh, so I am looking forward to building my own setup! But I would not hesitate to dive right to mech mods in if I were you...I am really enjoying mine!

 

[Stosh]

donnah laid out a lot of good advice, and a bit of vaping history... I'm also a throwback to the era of mech mods being the standard mod available. To add another tip with a mech / single voltage mod, you can control the voltage - power going to the coil with your thumb on the fire button. If the coil is getting too hot, let go, pulse the button on and off while drawing to lessen the heat. If it's too cool, fire the button a 1/2 second before drawing, and hold it longer. A little practice and it's almost as good as any VV/VW mod....

I use coils, pre-made attys and home built RDA at about 1.8Ω to 2.2Ω, I find it gives you the most room to adjust with your thumb while the battery voltage drops over the life of the charge...YMMV

p.s. If you're not using a Kick, be sure to use a fuse in your mech for safety's sake...

 

[itskohler]

I am in the same boat as jpcwon, literally. Just got a Magneto to dip my toes into the mech world. So far I love it. I only went mechanical because of the simplicity of them and the cleanliness they present. Most have very clean lines, look great sitting on the table and feel good in the hand. I haven't had any issues with the vapor production since I pulled the battery off the charger 13 hours ago. If my memory serves me correctly, you'll start at ~4.2 then quickly drop to 3.7 where it will plateau for a while. My battery is the Sony 2100mah 18650 30A so it should last a full day at my vape rate with a 2.0 ohm carto. MY suggestion would be to use your VV mods at ~3.7 volts to see if you enjoy it, then decide after that.

 

[TrentTC]

You can get a decent vape off a mech with stock coils. A 1.5 ohm coil with a freshly charged battery will give you about 11 watts and will run down from there. There is no way possible to get high wattages without sub ohms or using a dna or high wattage device. With a kick2 you can push up to 15 watts but this turns your mech into a variable wattage device which most advanced mods do now anyways. An RDA or RTA does provide better flavor but it's also completely up to the coil build. There is no reason you can't use either on a vv/vw device either. Rebuildable atomizers don't have to run on mechs. If you just want to use stock coils on rba without rebuilding I do have to warn you that most of them aren't very good. Neither are the premade coils that are sold. This is just my opinion but to me it doesn't sound like mechs are for you. I find that mechanical mods shine at 1 ohm or less where most vv/vw devices are unable to fire because of limitations built into their circuitry. There are people who feel differently though who are satisfied with higher resistance coils on mechs. They enjoy the simplicity and form factor of the mods.

 

[crxess]

A unwillingness to do the simplest of coil build installations would lead me to believe Mech Mods are Not for you.

Even with a Kick for a more controlled over all Vape, you will still be relying on off the shelf pieces to hopefully give you something more.

My 10 minute, once every week or two(juice dependent) Build is truly lightyears beyond anything any of my Clearo tanks could ever hope to accomplish.

Nemesis(clone) Mod
FT(unbranded) 12Watt Kick
Efest 18500
Kayfun Lite Plus Black edition(clone)
1.8ohm Micro coil
Cotton wick

I use the common off the shelf tanks, mostly T3-mini's on a daily basis, but I am so glad I ventured into building. My off time is my relax and enjoy time and with the addition of a Few well designed RBA tanks I truly do enjoy just kicking back and Vaping.

 

[Baditude]

My first mods were two mechanicals: a BB and Silver Bullet, both from AltSmoke. I was pretty happy with those using cartotanks...except for when the fire button got stuck in one of them and over-discharged the battery, which proceded to go into thermal runaway. Despite the battery being a protected ICR battery and the mod having a collapsable hot spring, those so-called protections failed to stop the battery from venting violently.



This would have never have happened in a regulated VV/VW mod, which has built-in protective circuitry to prevent over-discharge of a battery and a timed cutoff of the fire button. Regulated mods use safer-chemistry, high-drain batteries which do not typically vent violently.

With variable voltage, you can fine tune the voltage to the specific flavor you are using. You can also fine tune the voltage to the resistance (ohm) of your factory-made atomizer. You can't do that with a mechanical mod.

As pointed out before, a mechanical mod is at the mercy of the battery's voltage. The vaping experience will never be as good as when using a fully charged battery, it will be downhill as the battery is drained in use. You can achieve battery regulation in a mech using a Kick, but if you are going to do that, why not just use a regulated mod? Since a mechanical mod has no built-in protection, I suggest using a Vape Safe mod fuse on the negative end of the battery for short circuit protection.



My mechanicals are collecting dust since I discovered regulated mods. When I got into rebuildable coils, I had full intention of putting them on my Silver Bullet, an attempt to re-discover its usefulness (I don't do sub-ohm coils). I found that I preferred using the RBA's on my regulated mods more, so the Silver Bullet remains on a shelf just looking pretty and not in use.

 

[timastyle]

Donnah - Thank you very much for the thorough response and the history lesson. From what I gather, a Kick (had to look up what it does) basically turns a mech mod into a VW that, as jpcwon noted, provides short circuit protection and low battery warning. My Zmax provides both of these, so it seems like that would make it a lateral move to go from a VW device to a mech mod with a kick. Help me if I'm misunderstanding please. Would you know any other prebuilt coils that are better rather than the Avid ones?

jpcwon - Can you explain what you mean by what you can put on top of a Kick and how your options increase? Also, how are vaping a 2.1 ohm coil at 10W without a burnt taste? I have real trouble doing anything more than 8.5W with my 1.5 ohm (with a 2.5ohm, anything above 7 ohms and it was a burnt hit). I also tend to chain vape, so maybe that has something to do with it.

Stosh - So I take it you build your own coils as well if you're using RBAs right? Can you elaborate on your fuse comment and how do I know which has one? Been looking at a HCigar Nemesis clone if that helps any.

itskohler - I'll try that tonight and see how things go. Since I've had my Zmax, I have yet to utilize the VV aspect of it. I set the wattage and let the electronics do the rest. I consistently get the wattage I set it to until the battery starts getting low, then it doesn't put out the same watts.

TrentTC - It's probably the gauge of the coils from Kanger that does this, but I haven't been able to get more than 1 or 2 pulls at 11W without getting a burnt taste, let alone what it would be like at 15W. With the 1.5 ohm, it seems like it's sweet spot for me is around the 8.5W. I also understand that I can use RDA or RTA with my VV/VW mod. I was just asking in general terms about the better flavor and cloud about those vs. the clearos I've been using. The problem is that since I don't want to build coils just yet, unless I find a good source for prebuilt coils, then I can't really use one. I know you said most are not good, but do you have any suggestions for prebuilt coils that are of good quality?.

 

[timastyle]

crxess - With all due respect, what's the simplest of builds to one isn't to another. I have ruined 2 Kanger coil heads just by trying to pull the wicks out, let alone trying to build the coils from scratch. It's not something that I'm saying I can't do, but it will take time to learn and with a 15 month old running around the house and a pregnant wife a few months away from having our second child, time is not on my side for trial and error work. I will probably get into it a little later, but I would like to have my options. Most of all, I like the sleekness and compact sizes of mech mods. In doing the math, even if I continued to use the same tanks as I am now at the ohms I am, I can probably use a mech mod with no issues.

Bad - I've seen a number of your posts regarding the importance of having the appropriate batteries for mech mods. I currently have IMR Efest 18350 and 18650 10A batteries. I did the math and if I used a 1.5 ohm coil at 4.2V, I would only be drawings 2.8A. Even if I went with a .8 ohm coil, I still wouldn't draw 4.5A. The Efests have been tested to 6.5A (according to DV) even though they claim 10A. I think if I were to go with a .8 build, then I would probably go with a Sony 30A battery for safety sake. Better safe than sorry.

 

[Stosh]

As Baditude mentioned, the Vape Safe mod fuse on the negative end of the battery for short circuit protection. They are available at most vendors, reasonably priced for piece of mind...

I do build some of my coils, buy others when feeling a bit lazy
or just want a nice one piece atomizer.

 

[TrentTC]

Part if it is definitely the wire gauge in the kanger heads that causes burning but it also has to do with wicking. The wicks just can't keep up with the heat generated by high wattage. I really can't recommend any rebuilt coils for rbas. Even if there were any of decent quality you'd still have to install them yourself. If you like 1.5 ohms and 8.5 watts seems to be your sweet spot in no way can I recommend a mech for you. The only way to maintain that wattage would be with a kick and since your vv/vw device already does that I agree it is a sideways move. If you ever feel like getting into building your own coils, using thicker gauge wire and lower ohms then by all means get a mech. Otherwise your vv/vw device will probably offer more to you for the time being

 

[timastyle]

Stosh - I didn't see Bad's response prior to responding to you. Can you recommend some coils or attys for when you're "feeling lazy"?

Bad - the more I'm thinking about it, I'm not sure I see the value in going to a mech for me at this moment. Can you recommend a regulated mod that's compact and sleek? The Zmax is good when with a 18350 battery but not so much with 18650.

 

[timastyle]

TrentTC - I was saying that with the setup I have now, that's what the sweet spot is to get good vapor and flavor without a burnt taste. The only experience I have with a mech was when I was at a local B&M and the guy working had me try his ADVICE flavor out of his mod. The hit was nothing I've experienced or come remotely close to with my setup. He had a. 5 ohms coil in it (I asked) and the experience was out of this world. Just trying to find a happy medium.

 

[Stosh]

Stosh - I didn't see Bad's response prior to responding to you. Can you recommend some coils or attys for when you're "feeling lazy"?.

510 Series is one option, there are many vendors that have the old school attys in the "bargain bin" from time to time, just keep an eye out for them. Re-builds are the go to these days, so clearance sales are around....

Check this thread for dripping gear ideas ... http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/atomizers-cartridges/405910-regular-atty-drippers-dying-breed.html

 

[timastyle]

Thanks Stosh! I'll check out that thread. Seems to me that there are quite a few posts to go through.

 

[donnah]

Donnah - Thank you very much for the thorough response and the history lesson. From what I gather, a Kick (had to look up what it does) basically turns a mech mod into a VW that, as jpcwon noted, provides short circuit protection and low battery warning. My Zmax provides both of these, so it seems like that would make it a lateral move to go from a VW device to a mech mod with a kick. Help me if I'm misunderstanding please. Would you know any other prebuilt coils that are better rather than the Avid ones?

Yes the kick will turn a mech into a vw device. But changing the wattage requires taking your device apart to get at the little wattage dial inside. Not a huge deal but not as easy as clicking a button. Plus, the real ones are $45. I don't know of any other prebuilt coils but the coils from avidvaper look like they're meant for devices such as evods or protanks... not true rebuildables. I use 28 or 30g wire and cotton in my rebuildables. You asked how you could vape over 10w without burning. (another good question) You pretty much can't with things like cartos or maybe clearos but with a rebuildable.. as long as the wick is wet.. it won't burn.

If you do decide to get a mech.. there are lots to choose from but the first choice is whether to get a "name brand" or a clone. I decided when researching my first mech (there were no clones back then) to get a nice one.. one that when it came, I wouldn't have to do any modding to contacts or worry about it falling apart. Now I read post after post about clones needing this or that to make it work well. I don't have a huge collection of devices but the ones I have are highend. I did buy a eh pro kayfun lite clone and had to drill out the air hole to be able to vape it. Quality control isn't top priority on many of the cloned items but I've heard they're getting better. I use and enjoy Atmizoo Rollers but I wouldn't recommend them as a first device because of the complexity of the switch. (mine probably need to be disassembled and cleaned but I keep putting if off LOL)

 

[Baditude]

Stosh - I didn't see Bad's response prior to responding to you. Can you recommend some coils or attys for when you're "feeling lazy"?

Bad - the more I'm thinking about it, I'm not sure I see the value in going to a mech for me at this moment. Can you recommend a regulated mod that's compact and sleek? The Zmax is good when with a 18350 battery but not so much with 18650.

The ZMax is a good example. It is available in a Mini ZMax version. I have a stainless one myself, which I've loaned out to my daughter to try since her only two mods are a couple of AltSmoke BB mechanical mods - purple and pink, of course . The ZMax is also available in a telescopic model, which can use either an 18350, 18490, or 18650 battery.

Mini ZMax

AltSmoke BB mech mods (14500 batteries)

Many people like the iTaste V3 for its slim profile and pocket-friendly form. Uses a non-replaceable rechargeable (800 mAh) battery like the iTaste MVP and can be used with the USB charging cord as a pass through.

Innokin iTaste V3