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MannyMI

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Hey all,

I'm a journalist, based in the UK, currently working on a piece looking at the subculture of vaping. Would anyone be up for answering a few questions either by email or even on here?

Will be a positive piece (I vape myself, as it happens) and I won't be asking anything too intimate. Interested in things like how you got started, the cultural associations, whether you mod/mix your own flavors, what your attitudes are towards regulations, the language, whether you think people are well educated, what the community is like, and how you think vaping is perceived. Will be more specific if and when someone is up for talking to me.

You can certainly be anonymous if you prefer. The publication is around behavioral insights, and I can answer questions you have for me.

Cheers,
Manny
 

Eskie

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Hi Manny and welcome! I'm not sure how it exactly works, but if you're going to gather information from members, the site's administrators usually have to approve it. If they take this thread down it may very well be so they can get in touch with you and determine if it's a go or no go. I have no doubt plenty of folks are happy to supply you with info once that's done, and I did learn one thing from your post. I never knew I was in a subculture before.
 

zoiDman

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Hey all,

I'm a journalist, based in the UK, currently working on a piece looking at the subculture of vaping. Would anyone be up for answering a few questions either by email or even on here?

Will be a positive piece (I vape myself, as it happens) and I won't be asking anything too intimate. Interested in things like how you got started, the cultural associations, whether you mod/mix your own flavors, what your attitudes are towards regulations, the language, whether you think people are well educated, what the community is like, and how you think vaping is perceived. Will be more specific if and when someone is up for talking to me.

You can certainly be anonymous if you prefer. The publication is around behavioral insights, and I can answer questions you have for me.

Cheers,
Manny

Hi Manny. Welcome to the ECF.

Why don't you put together a Brief Questionnaire and run it by a ECF Administrator? I believe the ECF Ownership likes to give approval before Information is Solicited from members.

retired1
 
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MannyMI

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Seems fine to me. Good luck Manny.

Much obliged! Appreciate it.

Can I be a second generation 32 year old Jamaican woman that makes crystal infused pottery that I learned to make at my father's knee after we immigrated from Ireland? With an eye patch and a wooden leg?

i wanna be a viking

You can be whoever you like! Might have to be an unspoken backstory unless it directly pertains to any of my questions (I like to mix mead flavoured blends because it reminds me of my icy Norse home etc) ;)

Hi Manny and welcome! I'm not sure how it exactly works, but if you're going to gather information from members, the site's administrators usually have to approve it. If they take this thread down it may very well be so they can get in touch with you and determine if it's a go or no go. I have no doubt plenty of folks are happy to supply you with info once that's done, and I did learn one thing from your post. I never knew I was in a subculture before.

Ha, well - if you're posting in a special interest forum, it's a subculture! Same as it would be in a Harley Davidson or a jazz group.
 

Eskie

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Hi Manny, now that it's declared legit, and the subculture thing isn't about out our Satanic rituals (although I've gotta say, not a single seeping tank since), I'd be more than happy to participate. I don't mind doing right on here, maybe others will find the info useful. Not sure how you want to do it, but if you post a set of questions, I'd respond. I'm sure you'll find many others here who will as well.
 

retired1

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I'm a journalist, based in the UK, currently working on a piece looking at the subculture of vaping.

I don't view my vaping as being part of a sub culture. I look at it as a means to replace smoking cigarettes.
 

suprtrkr

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Hi and welcome!

I got started because I wanted to quit cigarettes.

The cultural associations, like everything else in the USA, are politically divided. There is a group of people, about half of us, who see anything-- anything at all-- and want to regulate it "for our own good"; as if we weren't capable of making the determination. And the other half of us tend to mind our own business, simply avoiding anything we find too annoying. Vapers tend to vape-- the polite ones avoid annoying others-- the uninvolved libertarian leaners ignore it, and those horrified by the idea clutch their pearls and moan "but the children..." This may not have answered your question: if so, then I think most people who vape to stay off tobacco see is as a crutch or an enthusiast hobby. Nonsmokers, or never-smokers, who vape-- IMHO in particular the younger ones-- I think primarily do it to look "cool." I know for a fact, however, the latter is not universal; my woman vapes because she likes a (no nic) cinnamon-apple flavor. She calls it "dessert without calories."

I have been known to build the occasional mod, and I mix my own juice.

I see no need to regulate beyond the market and tort law. That's a political attitude and has nothing to do with vaping. I wouldn't regulate anything. I further see proactive regulation as fundamentally futile. It doesn't actually control anything; rather it provides a defense to prosecution for market actors who technically remain within the regs while cutting corners everywhere else. Further, such a system is impossible to achieve in practice this side of superhuman, near-deity regulators, most of whom can not imagine everything market actors will use to skirt the regs. A proactive regulatory scheme is, in engineering terms, a positive feedback control scheme; all such systems oscillate, sometimes out of control, "hunting" for the sweet spot in the middle. A proper negative feedback scheme should be used, in those (MHO very rare) cases where regulation is deemed necessary or useful. In regulatory terms, this would mean simply banning the bad outcomes, with draconian penalties, and let the market actors figure out how to keep their necks out of nooses. You won't have to hang too many of them to get the message across. Trying to hem them in with a specified rule-book is stupid.

The "language" is too broad a topic. I could write for days an only hit the high spots. Allow me to suggest you peruse some of the threads here; you'll pick it up quickly. If you have any specific questions, drop us a line and ask. Nobody will laugh at you.

Some people are well educated; others are not. There's a Darwinesque principle involved. The poorly informed blow themselves up, unless they stick to prefab coils and so forth. There is no need for such ignorance for as long as this board exists. I have little doubt this board contains at least 1000 times the information as held by the entire Health Department. Indeed, if their regulations are any guide, what the Health types know about vaping can be written on a cocktail napkin with a lipstick.

The communities vary: this board, for example, is friendly and knowledgeable and helpful. Others, perhaps not so much. Every vaper out there has a horror story about a "bad" vape shop. All the employees sitting in the lounge blowing cloud and refusing to talk to anybody who isn't interested in big vapor or whatever.

I touched on the perceptions a bit above. People who understand vaping, and have a good bit of technical knowledge about it, tend to see it for what it is; or perhaps better, see it for the many different things it can be for different people. Those lacking such knowledge either ignore it, equate it with smoking, or use it as a vehicle for the nightmare-du-jour. Some of them, it's hard to blame: the parent of a teenager who blew himself up-- both of them knowing next to nothing about vaping-- can be forgiven for demanding draconian regulations. People who know nothing about it but wish to use it as a means of minding other people's business for them... well, I know what to do about that. Pity it isn't lawful.
 

djsvapour

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Most vapers I know are unlikely to fit into the definition of subculture. Mixing liquids are making coils is very much a part of normal vaping for a proportion of vapers.

Is someone who makes cakes part of a/the subculture of cake-eaters?
Is a real ale drinker part of a subculture of people who like beer?
"Sub" as in Subculture (iSub, youSub - vapers joke) suggests a variation away from the common values and widely adopted norms in the main culture.
..I digress...

I can answer your questions later, it would be a pleasure.
 

djsvapour

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Yes, some kind of structured questions and I'm sure you'll get responses. :) At least he didn't call us a counter culture :)

Anna

The only counter culture now in Europe is the 'under the counter' culture of procuring 24mg e-liquid. :eek:

Not that I know anyone who has attempted such a preposterous challenge. Not since yesterday, anyway. :p
 

Alien Traveler

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Manny, for vaping subculture you need to find a vaping forum for youngsters. Most vapers here are seasoned ex-smokers. OK, some (most?) of us are obsessed with buying shiny things. A lot of shiny things. But smoking was more expensive anyway, wasn't it? (at least they say so...) Is obsessive compulsive shopping a subculture?
 

zoiDman

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... The publication is around behavioral insights, and I can answer questions you have for me.

Cheers,
Manny

Looks like there is a Green Light for this thread. My story is Typical of many in my age group (55 ~65).

Pack a Day (PAD) Smoker most of their adult life.
Used all methods to quit with the Exception of Chantix.
Could quit with Extreme effort. But couldn't stay quit for substantial amounts of time.
Tried e-Cigarettes in late 2009 as a Last Resort due to decline in Health. Dual used Cigarettes/e-Cigarettes for about 6 Months ramping down Cigarettes while ramping up e-Cigarettes.
Became Smoke Free in early 2010 and saw an Increase in Over-All Health over the next 6 months or so.
Within 1 years my Cardio, Lung Capacity, BP, etc., numbers were normal for Never Smoker in my age bracket.
Within 2 years, with Slight Diet change and Regular Exercise, my numbers were more in the 45 ~ 55 bracket.

e-Cigarettes worked for me because they mimicked the Hand to Mouth association of smoking.


So here are a Few Questions I have for you.

What is your Last Name or what Byline Name do you use?
What area(s) of Journalism to you specialize in?
Who do you work for?
If you Freelance, who has Published your work?
 

Smoke_too_much

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Hi Manny, happy to give you my 2 cents, well actually just 1.4 cents because I'm Canadian.

Interested in things like how you got started, Had some prior positive vaping experience which I decided may prove beneficial in smoking cessation so I went to the web and learned about vaping as it pertains to nicotine.

the cultural associations, I think I am only one of two in the country I live in that vape and the other person does more smoking than vaping, so I would have to say I'm getting very little cultural experience out of it. ECF is a good place to get answers and info and to help others if you are so inclined. I don't really see it as a community nor I a member of any special community.

whether you mod/mix your own flavors, definitely, not only are the cost savings ridiculously significant but more importantly the ability to achieve good taste is good too. None of the store bought juices taste right anymore as they always have too much flavor and sweetener now that I DIY.

what your attitudes are towards regulations, unnecessary for the most part, intrusive as the govt really should have no say in whether I vape or not, nor in how I do it, greatly influenced by money particularly from big Tobac and big Pharma in that money is doing the talking and greed the listening, something to be ignored and worked around like so many similar intrusions into our personal freedoms, every anti-vaper claims it is to protect the kids but they've obviously long forgotten what it means to ba teenager, if left as a smoking cessation activity well that's pretty uncool and won't interest many teens, if made through legislation into a heavily restricted taboo sub-culture practise then you may as well hang a red flag for all rebellious teens to take up vaping.

the language, you mean from the regulators/politicians? Like everything else it's just a load of bafflegab, kind of like our little sock puppet traitor who does whatever he wants to and then tries to BS to convince us he did the right thing, they do what they want to and spin it whatever way they can and then wonder why we have no respect or trust left in them

whether you think people are well educated, I will assume you are referring to a vaping education and as such will have to say no, ECF and the other forums are really the only place to get real information, govts spin it one way (though yours surprisingly isn't that bad on this issue), vendors spin it another, and dishonest reviewers spin it another. The industry is so new and has such a huge potential for profits it has been like the Klondike gold rush days. ECF and the others are the only sane places to be in this storm of opportunity, but we the people will weather it and sort it out for ourselves. We don't really need any of the others.

what the community is like, on trips I've had the opportunity to see other vapers, usually in the stinky smoking area, a nod of acknowledgement is about all I have experienced and would expect, not much of a community in my eyes just a lot of nice folks

and how you think vaping is perceived. well my wife perceives it as just one step up from smoking but I did get a chuckle when I fell off the wagon and she began complaining about the smell of the stinkies and suggesting I start vaping again, folks in the office would object strongly if I smoked but after commenting how nice the vapes smelled now say nothing, beyond that I wouldn't know or care
 
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stols001

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How I got started: Well, I started smoking at age 18 (now 43) when I went to England over a summer to visit my best friend, who is a terrible influence. I was a runner and biker, couldn't bring my bike and my hip was acting up. BF was *dying* to teach me to inhale, and finally I was like, "I bet this will be a good weight loss addition since I can't exercise," (I said I was 18 :) ) and let her to teach me to inhale. I was quite convinced that I'd stop upon my return and pretty much my life up until a month ago was either quitting for periods of time or smoking intemperately, like 3 ppd sometimes. I quit when I was 23 for like 3 years but I got pregnant accidentally and was not about to be "that" pregnant person so I quit for like 3 years but I wasn't doing it for me, just the pregnancy/breastfeeding part, soon returned to tobacco. I had a few times where I tried exhaustively hard (one time, I used gum for 6 mo, tried the patch, etc. These were all major failures, and I couldn't try Chantix because I'm bioplar and my docs were like, "No, Anna, you'll live longer if you just smoke." Welbutrin worked briefly but I was like, "Oh, this is easy, I'll just take it again when I'm really ready." Only for me, Wellbutrin worked *once*. Each time the "quit effect" was weaker. I am unhypnotizable, though my mother earnestly tried accupuncture for a while.
I knew about vaping and even quit once for 2 weeks only then I got a new stressful job and smoked on the way to the interview.... I dual used on an off over the past couple years, but never with the intent to quit, only to reduce my smoking. Then, at 41--42 I basically got repeated and worsening pneumonias and my throat got so hoarse for months at a time, my doc sent me for a throat cancer scan. That being said, I started to experience the joys of what was pretty much early onset COPD and decided to vape, period. I'm a very stubborn person and it took *me* experiencing what I assume was a tiny taste of how to die by drowning ridiculously slowly and became convinced that vaping was my only option and gave it all I got, including joining here because I knew I'd need info and support. It's been like 28ish days, I guess, and I dual used the first week but now I feel AMAZING. All my docs are like, "Hallelujah" because it's not like they didn't bring up the topic of my imminent death and how it would be, for quite some time beforehand.

Cultural associations? I'm not sure what you mean. Initially, vaping in the US was kind of presented as this novel, interesting, and harm reduction thing, but the main draw at the start was "vape everywhere" and the guy who showed me it was a coworker who already had COPD and found his sx vastly improved. So he was demonstrating all over. I'd say the culture now is "this is the same as/as bad as smoking," and I don't think that really started until ppl were blowing clouds in all directions, and also sales were high enough that Big Tobacco and the FDA decided they really needed to "do something about this" (my opinion only) and vaping has become more polarized in this country due to various reasons, and now you will find people who say "this saved my life," (I am one of them) and people who say the risks are totally unknown and it will likely turn out to be worse than smoking.

I mixed my first flavor last week and I plan to continue, as well as learning to build/rebuild coils. I'm not dying to build coils but I will learn how because I don't want to be in a situation where I cannot do most of what I need, vapewise, on my own, because I don't like how BT and the FDA are handling this situation and I find it ironic that the one thing that seems sustainable may be diminished and/or so expensive that it's an incredible hassle. That said, I enjoy learning these things, but I feel bad for smokers wanting an alternative a few years from now (my opinion only).

Gov't restrictions: I'm a weird cross between a socialist and a libreratarian. I don't mind paying a tax on vaping if it were *reasonable* and some of that money were spent on harm reduction. I do mind what is happening now in the US, and I don't think there will be any "reasonableness" coming down the pike any time soon. My liberatarian side then goes, "F you and your taxes, I will find a way to do what I need." And truthfully, I am a pretty resourceful person and if I want to vape in the comfort of my own home, car, etc. then I see no reason not to (unless it becomes breaking the law or something, in which case, I will... be even more resourceful.) OK, that's all I'm going to say about that. Oh, except that I engage in some reasonable advocacy, but I don't expect it to hold much sway.

Language? Are you talking RTA/RTDA/mod/coil kind of stuff? It's perfectly understandable once you get going, and if you want a primer yourself, search for the accronym/abbreviations thing to figure out some stuff yourself, it might be useful. I think it's no different than for any other device. I think smoking was the same way, it's just been around for so long the language is more accessible. For example, pretty much any smoker is going to know what a "menthol" is, for example.

Are people well-educated? Well, for most people, I'd say "no." Vaping is percieved as more negative than it is, unless a vaper is either excited by blownig big clouds/hardware, etc., or they join a community to learn. I don't think most vape shop employees are necessarily the most educated people either, many shops just try to sell the most expensive equipment they can. They also may only carry one brand as they have a deal with the manufacturer, or whatever. So if even vape employees don't know very much, then the general public certainly doesn't.

The community: I'm not sure I'd consider vapers a "community" in real life. Most of the time if I visit my vape store it's not to hang out (which it was designed for originally and it was a massive FAIL, in fact they don't even have bathrooms now.) I guess there are cloud competitons which I don't think are GOOD for the community, harm reduction isn't about how much vapor and what shapes you can generate. So there can be something of a divide between cloud chasers and mouth to lung, less "visible" devices but I think overall vapers feel positively towards each other, and if vapers become friends they might try different flavors/mods etc. I feel NO negativity toward smokers, either, I was one for a LONG time and my husband still smokes cigarettes. I try to not rock the boat, stick to designated areas, even though in my state it's "vapeanywhere" for now. But, everyone's different. The online community *here* is helpful, but it's specifically vape focused, so that makes sense. I don't think the majority of vapers are using an online community but some certainly do.

How is vaping perceived? That's a person to person thing. My entire family was super relieved that I transitioned to vaping, especially my husband and son, but all sibs and parents are congratulatory. However, they also know the ramifications of smoking and what I've tried *before* so if I vape forever, they'll be fine with it. Sometimes, people are interested in my mod (it's pretty) and I have a fairly hefty set of vape enthusiasts but I go to AA so a lot of people transitioned to vaping the past several years, as they are aware of the harm reduction aspect. That's nice, most people don't comment and/or make faces if I'm vaping, I may educate them, or not.

I'd be happy to give you my real, full name, via PM.

Anna
 
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