How are clones allowed?
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If you want a case of patents getting out of hand, here is a case.
A manufacturer develops a device to safely stop a blade on a table saw and patents it. Minor problems in that, it costs a lot more then most saws out there and when it fires to stop the blade, you have to replace bunch of the parts.
The big problem is that the patents is for any system "that retracts the blade rapidly within14 milliseconds using any retraction technique after detecting contact." What incentive is there for anyone to develop a system that does the job better then the first one.
See bottom of page 6 here.
http://www.popularwoodworking.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/PTI-Statement.pdf
BTW, the head of this company is a patent lawyer.
Thank the gods for the ignore list. While I'm on the subject,does anyone know why we can't put moderators on our ignore lists?
And I blame corporate greed -- the lawyers are just enablers. Copyrights once lasted only 17 years. But then a company that built itself by retelling stories taken from the public domain (Sleeping Beauty? Cinderella? Beauty and the Beast? ... the list goes on and on) became concerned that its exclusive rights to those recreations would soon expire. They lobbied like crazy and as a result, copyrights last the life of the creator plus 75 years. That means that THREE GENERATIONS of heirs, who had nothing to do with the original work, will benefit from the protected status and royalties from that work. And no contemporary of the original artist will ever be able to extend its popularity by breathing new life into a tale or extending it to new media.
The longer terms of today's copyrights and patents have left many works lost in an intellectual property limbo, either because the current rightsholder chooses not to use those rights or because no one can figure out who the current rightsholder is. We have no mechanism to release orphaned works to the public domain. The most grievous examples are the pharmaceutical companies who stop making particular drugs because the market of users is too small to make a profit ... but want huge fees to release their rights to smaller companies who might be able make them economically.
Sorry, I know I've taken the topic off the rails a bit, but it's a pet rant. I get set off every time someone tries to attach a moral/ethical argument to intellectual property "infringement." Copying is not theft. Cloning is not cheating. And don't even get me started on those who think that because they were the first to try patenting some common sense idea that has been in the market in one form or another for years, they should be able to use the threat of legal action to get rich!
I am happy to say that I have never in the past or present have bought a clone and never will in the future.
There are so many cloned/copied/knock-off products on the market, why would the ecig industry be any different? If there's sufficient demand for a product then clones will be produced and sold. Even well know, high profile & public companies don't escape the cloning.
China takes knock-offs to a new level, copying entire stores - USATODAY.com
China takes knock-offs to a new level, copying entire stores - USATODAY.com
Can you give specific example of mods that fit your criteria? ==> Grabbing someone's product, "making a mold of it" I don't see that with mods. It's prevalent with clearos and eGo type batteries though, but I'm pretty sure that's not what the OP had in mind. OP, please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on that.
Patents last for 17 years.
Copyrights last for a lifetime or longer, depending on who holds it.
And don't blame corporate greed. Blame shareholders who hold board members and executives to the notion that their job is to maximize shareholder value. I do. Companies do not exist to serve anyone other that the shareholders.
ETA: As an investor, the last thing in the world I want a company I'm holding stock in is to make a bunch of moral judgments. Maximize shareholder value and you won't hear from me at the next shareholders meeting. Fail to do so, and...
If you have a 401(k) plan with your employer, then you are a shareholder and YOU TOO are to blame.
Live it. Learn it.
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I stand corrected. Corporations themselves have no ethics, no conscience and no morality. They exist solely to generate profits. And the degree to which shareholders are willing to hold corporate leadership accountable certainly influences decision-making.
However, in the case of intellectual property, legislation has given benefits and rights to corporations that once -- by default -- belonged to the public. Shareholder activism can't restore those lost rights and benefits to us. It can only be accomplished by legislative action. As long as the public swallows propaganda like "copying is theft" or "cloning is lazy and evil", they will never recognize what has been taken from us and never act to have it returned.
IMHO, there's a parallel to our situation as vapers. Right now, the rights and benefits of vaping are ours by default. And by "ours", I don't mean just vapers. The public stands to benefit greatly when millions of former smokers and their loved ones live longer, healthier, more productive lives. But there are those who profit from tobacco use and treatment; they may stand to lose if vaping becomes widely accepted. And there is absolutely no doubt that they will act in the interest of profit, not innovation.
Right now, the "wild west" nature of vaping development is serving all of us. Makers are extraordinarily responsive, technology improvements are announced almost weekly, and the market is growing exponentially. Embrace it, folks. Hobbyists will always be able to find expensive, custom-crafted, exclusive mods. But clones, copies, and cheap knock-offs are what will make us a demographic with a voice big enough to be heard in town halls and legislative chambers.
Vape on.
How about the clone of the Kick...they even used Evolv's pic of the Kick to advertise it. What about the Caravela clone? They used a pic of the real one to advertise it as well, when they started production they copied the look minus the logo just about 100%. Cloners are thieves, period. The K100 was a pretty obvious copy of the Empire.
They really don't enforce trademarks patents and copyrights. I received a charger one time from China that actually said "Counterfeit" on the charger.
You missed a spot.
Due to the Sigelei-K, Evolv is now preparing to release and updated Kick. Higher output, lower ohms capability and hopefully less buggy.
Competition has its rewards
Noticed you Included the Sigelei-K - but excluded the Crown(US designed)hmmm
In a capitalist system there would be no government controls and no patents. So it would not be theft. The morality of capitalism is money and profit.
It's kinda funny that you all are defending these knock offs as though though one style line makes them legit. As I've said SEVERAL times in this thread. If you want to say "I don't think xyz is worth 150 bucks, when someone made a copy for 50" just say it. No need to fall on the sword defending their legitimacy.
Saw several posts talking about pure capitalism. If you think businesses operate without morals or ethics, aka strictly profit driven, please get out of your college class and work at a major corporation. Yes, profit is the goal, but ethics and morality are a HUGE part of everything. As long as customers value those qualities, businesses will as well.
Saw several posts talking about pure capitalism. If you think businesses operate without morals or ethics, aka strictly profit driven, please get out of your college class and work at a major corporation. Yes, profit is the goal, but ethics and morality are a HUGE part of everything. As long as customers value those qualities, businesses will as well.
Equivocation isn't necessary. I think we were all talking about American capitalism. Freedom with borders, not economic anarchy.
The Chinese are pretty casual about copyright laws. If you fight them in a Chinese court, you'll lose. There's a market for the clones, and the original makers can sell everything they produce. Their customers are willing to pay for the quality when it's available, and they'll settle for a clone when they can't get the real thing.
I think you're pretty naive. No sense continuing for me, I'll never agree.
Ah, picky, picky.....just trying to be domestic here!
Karl Benz = Hon Lik (Ruyan)
Looks for like a bike imo.
But are you happy now?
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