I think we need the FDA, I really do.

[Robino1]

There are probably not that many until the FDA starts requiring certification. It will happen at some point. There are suppliers who claim FDA certified/FDA certified ingredients.

Here's one that claims FDA certification.
Wholesale E-Liquid Products and Supplies, FDA certified E-Liquid Lab, cGMP



I think it's more about using FDA approved ingredients at this point.

Hmm wholesaler. I wonder what makes them a FDA certified lab? I can see the ingredients being FDA approved, that's a well known fact that all the ingredients that goes into making e-liquid are USP FDA approved. Nicotine that is sourced is FDA approved. It is the lab part that becomes the sticking point. If our vendors use FDA approved ingredients, technically could They say they are FDA approved? Or is it the "Lab" part that makes the difference?

Interesting.

 

[stevegmu]

Most of the regulations on food processing and preparation are based on scientific evidence and aim to ensure the adequate quality of the food coming out of those processes. Moroever, everyone eats and unless you grow your own food, you have to buy it from someone, so the quality of the food available affects everyone. Does this mean that I trust the government on all their food regulations? No. For instance, do I favor the government regulating the amount of added sugar in processed food? No, as I consider that as long as the label is accurate as to added sugar, it is my own decision to consume food with added sugar content or not.

The route taken by most governments regarding e-cig regulation does not have much to do with the evidence on the health risks associated with the products, but has a lot to do with restricting the competitivity of those products to protect the pharmaceutical industry smoking cessation products and/or to ensure high taxation to compensate revenue losses from decreasing tobacco sales due to the adoption of vaping. If the government wanted to regulate e-cigs out of real public safety and public health concerns, they would not deem it a tobacco product, which it is not: alternatively, they would not treat it as medication, which it is not either.

Actually I am just referring to standards...

 

[zoiDman]

There are probably not that many until the FDA starts requiring certification. It will happen at some point. There are suppliers who claim FDA certified/FDA certified ingredients.

Here's one that claims FDA certification.
Wholesale E-Liquid Products and Supplies, FDA certified E-Liquid Lab, cGMP

...

Awh Yes... American e-Liquids Company.

I wrote them when they first started saying that they were FDA Certified. And asked to see their Certification. I received a Rambling reply which basically said that they Used FDA "Approved" Food Ingredients. And that they worked to FDA Guidelines.

But I never say what they said they were FDA Certified to do. Or a Copy of any Certification. Now things may have Changed since then. So I can't say what the Claim, or Infer today is Not True.

I would be Curious to hear what replies people get when they Contact them regarding FDA Certification?

Contact Us |

 

[Elizabeth Baldwin]

Some labs are FDA certified, meaning only the lab is certified By the FDA, meaning nothing about the ingredients. Any lab using a clean work space, properly labeled containers, and wearing gloves can get FDA certified. But.... Getting the ingredients certified has never been done with eliquid.

 

[tj99959]

Hmm wholesaler. I wonder what makes them a FDA certified lab? I can see the ingredients being FDA approved, that's a well known fact that all the ingredients that goes into making E-liquid are USP FDA approved. Nicotine that is sourced is FDA approved. It is the lab part that becomes the sticking point. If our vendors use FDA approved ingredients, technically could They say they are FDA approved? Or is it the "Lab" part that makes the difference?

Interesting.

I can see it all now

"I make e-cig juice"
My lab is FDA certified
My ingredients are FDA certified
My technicians are FDA certified
The tune I'm whistling is FDA certified

 

[Scaralouche]

not to mention that imported e-liquids will no longer be allowed, im sure. too many headaches will come from the inevitable invasion by our governmental overlords.

 

[DaveP]

Hmm wholesaler. I wonder what makes them a FDA certified lab? I can see the ingredients being FDA approved, that's a well known fact that all the ingredients that goes into making E-liquid are USP FDA approved. Nicotine that is sourced is FDA approved. It is the lab part that becomes the sticking point. If our vendors use FDA approved ingredients, technically could They say they are FDA approved? Or is it the "Lab" part that makes the difference?

Interesting.

I think it's all about meeting certain standards as someone stated above. Until the FDA decides to exercise inspection rights and demand compliance in the chemistry of the formulas and ingredients, there will be no FDA certified ejuice as such.

I like the statement that Madvapes issued. I've seen pictures of their clean room facility. It looks like an airlocked area with people wearing clean room attire.
About TopVapor E-Liquid

 

[zoiDman]

Here is some Interesting Reading...

FDA does not approve companies.

FDA does not "approve" health care facilities, laboratories, or manufacturers. FDA does inspect product manufacturers to verify that they comply with good manufacturing practices.

Owners and operators of domestic or foreign food, drug, and most device facilities are required to register with FDA. Blood and tissue facilities also must register with the agency.

Mammography facilities must be FDA certified. Mammography facilities are required to display their FDA certificates where patients can see them. The certificate indicates that the facilities have met stringent standards and can provide quality mammography.

Is It Really FDA Approved? 

 

[Robino1]

Here is some Interesting Reading...




Is It Really FDA Approved?.

Very interesting indeed.. and the plot thickens. How does an e-liquid manufacturer get FDA approval then? Curious

 

[KODIAK (TM)]

I stopped reading after this:

I think we need control, and I think we need regulation.

Ok, I really stopped reading after the next line:

Right now, it's the wild west.

So far it sounds like an FDA/Zeller talking point festival so I dare not go any further.

 

[zoiDman]

Very interesting indeed.. and the plot thickens. How does an e-liquid manufacturer get FDA approval then? Curious

I think a lot of what is Going On is the Way Words are Being Used/Perceived.

There may be FDA Certification for say the Safe Handling of Chemicals. Or the Traceability of the Supply Chain. But that does Not Mean that the Finished Product is FDA Certified. Only that the Chemicals used to make the Product were Handled Correctly. And that the Origin/Path from the OEM to where the Final Product made is Traceable.

I would Like to Here what FDA Certifications American e-Liquid Company Holds? And then determine How they Apply to the Finished Product?

 

[Robino1]

I stopped reading after this:


Ok, I really stopped reading after the next line:


So far it sounds like an FDA/Zeller talking point festival so I dare not go any further.

It's not as bad as it looks on the face of it. The thread actually has some good points in it and are worth reading

 

[bm2112]

Everyone who thinks we need the FDA is clueless. The FDA does not care whatsoever about the health of the American population. You want to see what ejuice would be if it were regulated by the government? Check out the ingredients in Nicorette Quickmist.

Electronic Cigarettes vs. Nicorette Quickmist » The Electronic Cigarette Buyers Guide

Hydrochloric acid and anhydrous ethanol in your ejuice? Would you like that? So what if a guy makes juice on a table in the back of a shop? Do you think he goes out of his way to purchase toxic chemicals and put them in your ejuice?

This thread is infuriating. Maybe its a paid shill trying to get people on board with FDA regulated ejuice.

 

[Robino1]

I think a lot of what is Going On is the Way Words are Being Used/Perceived.

There may be FDA Certification for say the Safe Handling of Chemicals. Or the Traceability of the Supply Chain. But that does Not Mean that the Finished Product is FDA Certified. Only that the Chemicals used to make the Product were Handled Correctly. And that the Origin/Path from the OEM to where the Final Product made is Traceable.

I would Like to Here what FDA Certifications American e-Liquid Company Holds? And then determine How they Apply to the Finished Product?

I think they are putting all the qualified FDA certs together to say that they are FDA approved. Just my VERY uneducated guess only.

 

[Robino1]

REMINDER: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ecf-forum-rules/51178-forum-rules.html

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Anytime we discuss FDA and such, it can become a heated discussion. Please remember the above when discussing such hot button topics.

Live by this one:

9. Personal attacks
You can disagree with the subject matter of a post, but never personally attack the poster - “Attack the post, not the poster”. Treat people as you would like to be treated yourself: with courtesy.

And this:

10. Misconduct
a. These are not permitted -
Flaming (insults).

 

[KODIAK (TM)]

Everyone who thinks we need the FDA is clueless. The FDA does not care whatsoever about the health of the American population.

Mrs. Kodiak had cancer 10 years ago. There was a treatment drug the FDA would not approve at the time (but now approve it because some big PHARMA lobbyists/money got involved - go figure). That drug put her in remission but we had to go out of country for it. About $50k out of pocket too.

So I have very little luv for the FDA. I also move along the political spectrum daily. Today I have my Libertarian badge on.

 

[Despraci]

First off: I'm a very happy converted smoker. Let's get that out of the way (check my other posts).

Now, my rationale for this big FDA claim is simple. I think we need control, and I think we need regulation. Right now, it's the wild west. There is an abundance of indie e-juice vendors that are under little to no regulation or control whatsoever. It's actually pretty weird.

I visited a B&M while in SF a while ago and was talking up my favourite juice. The owner said 'I can clone it for you!'. I was intrigued and came back later with the bottle. He took me back to his 'lab' which was little more than a dirty dinner table with all sorts of junk spread out among bottles of juice and VG. Filthy. I walked straight out.

This started me thinking though.. With this Diacetyl scare, and the replacements in custard juice. We have no idea. It's all good and fine if you're vaping pure VG, but flavours.. we have no idea. And I get it. Cigs are worse. It's not about that. It's just scary. You try to put faith in these indie juice businesses but the reality is, we just have no idea. The point of swapping to vape from Cigs is usually a health reason, and it'd be nice to have SOME idea what's going on.

I think an element of certification and regulation will hurt us, financially and from a selection point of view.. but gee.. I'd probably welcome that in return for a bit of peace of mind and research.

What do you guys think. I'm assuming I don't have a popular opinion, but I'd like to hear yours.

I do agree with you 100% and many others will as well. But the problem is that the FDA and any government agency tends to "overdue" the regulations. I think anybody that buys their juice would vape with more confidence if we knew that every company was following standards... which many already do by their own freewill. But I've heard more then one horror story about poor conditions where e-juice is mixed or mom and pop shops (or startups) are cutting corners and cost to make a buck with unsafe ingredients.

But the reverse side is... the FDA doesn't show restraint when handing down common sense regulations and overly precautions regulations.

 

[bm2112]

If you think your ejuice is contaminated with chemicals now, just wait til the FDA gets their hands on it. They'll make sure they load it up with plenty of toxic preservatives and other chemicals.

Please explain what kind of unsafe ingredients vape shop owners are putting in there juice. I would really love to know. I thought VG, PG, nicotine concentrate, and flavor was a pretty simple formula.

 

[FattyJ]

If regulation of e-juice means that the makers of e-juice have to abide by a sensible standard of making e-juice and the regulatory efforts are to protect/educate the consumer I am all for it. If regulation is done under the guise of this but in reality it is done because of greed on a billion dollar level then no thanks.

 

[tj99959]

If you think your ejuice is contaminated with chemicals now, just wait til the FDA gets their hands on it. They'll make sure they load it up with plenty of toxic preservatives and other chemicals.

Please explain what kind of unsafe ingredients vape shop owners are putting in there juice. I would really love to know. I thought VG, PG, nicotine concentrate, and flavor was a pretty simple formula.

http://gfn.net.co/downloads/2014/posters/122 Farsalinos - DA_AP.pdf

that was easy

Also:
Ya know that Biggie that was what the FDA founded their first try to regulate e-cigs over (DG) ???

Turns out it seems to be coming from having paper products in the same room that the liquid is mixed in.