Is VG juice killing my 510 attys?

[Kurt]

I am using VG-only juices, since PG causes all sorts of problems with me. Most of my juices are very thick, but I've recently started cutting them with a little vodka. None the less, I used very thick juice for weeks. For some reason, my attys, specifically black 5-pack attys from TW, are dying. I have washed the attys with 100 proof vodka, but only rarely. They do get clogged easily with thicker juice, and I often blow them out. I am a fairly heavy vaper, and enjoy very long drags. I am suspecting that VG is making the atty have to heat too high for too long and this is killing them quicker. Some last only a week. They do get pretty hot to the touch.

This seems like it makes sense, but I wanted some feedback from the veterans about VG vaping on these attys. Also, I'm wondering if anyone is vaping VG juices with higher voltage?

Thanks!

 

[Sun Vaporer]

Kurt--I would not blame it on the VG--I have been using VG for a year now with no issues that I can identify that link atomizer life to use of it. You should thin thick e-liquid out with high proof vodka to cut the viscosity anyway for better wicking.


It is always hard to pinpoint why the elusive atomizers fail---and a heavy residue over time will do it. I would look more to the high voltage going though that coil. Some atomizers just can not handle the load. Remember that they were designed for 3.7 volts. A high volt load of a 510 will hold but if you got some weak ones--then the load may be to much. Try shorter draw times.


Sun

 

[Scottbee]

I am using VG-only juices, since PG causes all sorts of problems with me. Most of my juices are very thick, but I've recently started cutting them with a little vodka. None the less, I used very thick juice for weeks. For some reason, my attys, specifically black 5-pack attys from TW, are dying. I have washed the attys with 100 proof vodka, but only rarely. They do get clogged easily with thicker juice, and I often blow them out. I am a fairly heavy vaper, and enjoy very long drags. I am suspecting that VG is making the atty have to heat too high for too long and this is killing them quicker. Some last only a week. They do get pretty hot to the touch.

This seems like it makes sense, but I wanted some feedback from the veterans about VG vaping on these attys. Also, I'm wondering if anyone is vaping VG juices with higher voltage?

Thanks!

Kurt,

I honestly don't think that VG is your problem.. unless you are running some really nasty VG!

I vape VG exclusively (ECOpure mostly) and my attys last a good long time (although I do clean them regularly). But.. my attys don't run hot either. Usually if they start running hot I know that they are either near-flooded or running "starved". Starved is easy to determine since it is accompanied by the burnt taste.

When they run near-flooded they can get really hot too... and when that happens the bottom internal plastic disk in the atty can melt.. become distorted.. and the air hole in it can start to close-down. This will make the atty run even hotter (and feel clogged).. then the situation becomes a Chernobyl runaway.

A 510 atty that is running properly will sizzle and hiss. If yours isn't doing this.. try to figure out why!

 

[Kurt]

Thank you, Scottbee and Sun! Your two responses answer almost all my questions, and some I didn't even ask! I have indeed experienced all the symptoms you described. Very heartening that it is not likely the VG. But it is likely the thickness, as when the juice is thinned with vodka the atty runs MUCH cooler, and it is all round better. So I think now, yes, it IS the VG, but it is VG not thinned properly, so yay I can keep using VG-only juices. Besides, a little vodka gives a nice TH, and I think it liberates nic better than pure VG dilutions.

Sun, I'm not using high voltage yet, still enjoying 3.7V thoroughly...jeez, wonder what 5 or 6V is like, then? Must be like getting kicked in the throat by a mule...but a mule that really tastes good! Or something...

Scottbee, your description of the warping and runaway overheating is exactly what I think one of the 510 attys did. I thought it was just chronically clogged, but vodka washing and blowing did nothing. Then I thought that there was so much wick that IT was clogging the airholes. It looked like that, as the wick was more like a small bush coming out from under the bridge. I made the decision, winced, and pulled the wick out. Suddenly the vapor performance was OMFG spectacular! For about 20 minutes. Then it died. Cold. Not clogged, just dead. So its possible it looked that way because of a warped base, and pulling the wick just broke it enough to work better than any other atty I've had for a few minutes, then face down, no pulse. Seriously, I would pay $30 for an atty that worked like that one did before it died. Like James Dean in his legendary Spider careening into history. Hope I die like that...

Thanks again guys! Time to get some PGA. I've not tossed the dead attys...maybe when I have time I'll continue to torture them with some coke, or peroxide, or Crest mouthwash, and see if they can be resurrected. Cold is not a good sign though.

 

[a2dcovert]

Hey Kurt,

The real question we all want answered is: "Does anyone know how to prevent atomizers from dying?"

 

[Kurt]

Hey Kurt,

The real question we all want answered is: "Does anyone know how to prevent atomizers from dying?"

word a2d! two things I figured out, with some catalytic comments by sun and scottbee:

1. Up the vodka a little, about 10%. this helps a LOT.

2. i use disposable facial sponge cut in ~1/4 in strips, folded in 1/2 with straw. if the straw is too short, and you can't see the top of it when it is in the cart, then it stops working entirely with this filler. if it is long enough to be RIGHT at the top of the filler pushed down from the bridge...so maybe touching the bridge a bit...then it works like a champ.

these two things in place, and clearly the atty is having to work only a fraction of before, getting warm but not hot, and wicking very well. far longer time before getting the starved taste. and far fewer needed blowouts.

if this stops working i'll post here, but for right now it seems it is less me killing attys...but then that doesn't answer your time-honored question.

i'm gonna try some of heaven's gifts 510 attys...6 month warranty?!?!

good vaping tonight though, for sure.

thanks everyone...still so much to learn, huh?

 

[a2dcovert]

word a2d! two things I figured out, with some catalytic comments by sun and scottbee:

1. Up the vodka a little, about 10%. this helps a LOT.

2. i use disposable facial sponge cut in ~1/4 in strips, folded in 1/2 with straw. if the straw is too short, and you can't see the top of it when it is in the cart, then it stops working entirely with this filler. if it is long enough to be RIGHT at the top of the filler pushed down from the bridge...so maybe touching the bridge a bit...then it works like a champ.

I've been doing both of those things for while now. I use everclear at about 10% in my mixes.

I've also been using the RSP mod with the PB material for a couple of weeks. One new problem caused by the RSP is that I have to be careful to not run the cart dry. Twice now I have run the cart so dry that I had to reprime the atty. That's not good for the atty.

 

[Kurt]

I've been doing both of those things for while now. I use everclear at about 10% in my mixes.

I've also been using the RSP mod with the PB material for a couple of weeks. One new problem caused by the RSP is that I have to be careful to not run the cart dry. Twice now I have run the cart so dry that I had to reprime the atty. That's not good for the atty.

Sorry, I'm still new to some of the cart mod lingo. What is RSP and PB?

The sponge I'm using works best when I cut it off about 2 mm above the mouth of the cart, rather than flush, and if I cut a small v in the top of it, so that the bridge fits into the sponge a bit rather than just pushing it down. Like the original poly fill, it loses some of its wicking ability after a couple of days of use, but regains it with just pulling the top of the sponge back out a little.

But one thing I read here over the weekend was a post by TropicalBob stating that juices containing tobacco extracts have a high particle content, and can causes blockage problems. This seems to be applicable to my situation, as I've been totally in love with a sweet tobacco juice, both straight and as a base for over flavors I make. I won't mention the vendor, as I think this may be universal for such juices. My attys deaths started shortly after getting this juice, which is my only tobacco flavor. It is as though the bridge wick gets swollen with junk and partially blocks the air holes. So I'm trying non-tobacco flavors now, and I'm not getting any of the warning signs that an atty is getting constipated and over heating.

I may also have been compounding this when I blew out the atty went it flooded. I think I was blowing into the wrong end...I was blowing into the cart end rather than the batt end. This may have been getting more juice out of the barrel of the atty, and allowed higher air pressure from the mouth, but it might have been slowly creating a damming effect on the inside of the air holes, with debris accumulating little by little with each blowout.

So now I'm seeing if some sort of solvent will dissolve the buildup in the wick...I think ether would actually work well, but I haven't tried yet. Ether would do a better job dissolving carbonaceous material than the more polar ethanol.

So I may be on a path now that allows my precious 510 attys to survive, and you and Scottbee were probably correct: it is not the VG, which is a relief.

thanks again for the help, a2d!!

 

[Madame Psychosis]

Sorry, I'm still new to some of the cart mod lingo.
I may also have been compounding this when I blew out the atty went it flooded. I think I was blowing into the wrong end...I was blowing into the cart end rather than the batt end. This may have been getting more juice out of the barrel of the atty, and allowed higher air pressure from the mouth, but it might have been slowly creating a damming effect on the inside of the air holes, with debris accumulating little by little with each blowout.

I doubt it'll hurt you too bad, so long as you do clear it out from the correct end and keep the thread clean. At least, I made that mistake on a 510 atty and was able to correct it quickly by reversing direction and blowing into the battery end. (Wrapping your lips carefully around the barrel of the atty creates a pressure seal. I just clean the outside of the atty and thread w/ isopropyl afterwards.)

I've got to try the Everclear addition. Distilled water in my VG juices is creating disappointing vapor and zero throat hit, and actually seems to be flooding my attys more easily, which means blowouts 3x or more a day.

 

[jj2]

I've used VG pretty much from the get-go. I've always used a bit of vodka or McCormick’s cinnamon extract which has alcohol in with the VG. To date, I’ve had three attys go bad on me.
I don’t really count the first one because it was what I used during the learning process and I was really rough on the poor thing.

 

[Kurt]

I doubt it'll hurt you too bad, so long as you do clear it out from the correct end and keep the thread clean. At least, I made that mistake on a 510 atty and was able to correct it quickly by reversing direction and blowing into the battery end. (Wrapping your lips carefully around the barrel of the atty creates a pressure seal. I just clean the outside of the atty and thread w/ isopropyl afterwards.)

I've got to try the Everclear addition. Distilled water in my VG juices is creating disappointing vapor and zero throat hit, and actually seems to be flooding my attys more easily, which means blowouts 3x or more a day.

even 100 proof vodka gives a decent TH.

jj2, really good idea! Use an extract, like vanilla, to add flavor AND a little ethanol. Brilliant! Will try this with my vanilla extract.

 

[48lowes]

Kurt I was reading on the forum that if you vape so much to make the atty hot just alternate between 2 setups. I vape like crazy and using 2 has helped considerably.

 

[Kurt]

Kurt I was reading on the forum that if you vape so much to make the atty hot just alternate between 2 setups. I vape like crazy and using 2 has helped considerably.

That's a good idea! However, since using Scottyballs' ADM with the silicone plug, and thinning the juices a little, this problem seems to be completely solved. For this week, anyway! Good thing I'm a patient man, and a chemist, so the weeks of trial and error and clogging and different fillers and plugs and slugs finally paid off. If I was less patient I might have thrown in the towel. Getting the 510 system to be optimal is kinda like getting a formula-1 race car to perform optimally: very finicky, but big payoffs to those that don't give up!

Now the attys will clearly live their normal lifetimes, I can vape for hours on a single cart, no flooding, atty doesn't get as hot or clogged, I get mad vapor, and I can still use VG juices. All good! Thanks for the tips everyone!

 

[Synthnadz]

I have a running theory that the coloring of certain flavorings contributes directly to attys loosing their muscle.

It seems that whenever I'm vaping dark, over-colored liquids my attys begin to lose flavor and vapor production starts to fall off. Doing periodic 'dry burns' seems to resurrect their output for a few days, but I also suspect that these dry burns contribute to frying atty coils. So, it's a no-win situation.

Anyone else noticed that dark, highly-colored liquids screw up their attys?

 

[Kurt]

I have a running theory that the coloring of certain flavorings contributes directly to attys loosing their muscle.

It seems that whenever I'm vaping dark, over-colored liquids my attys begin to lose flavor and vapor production starts to fall off. Doing periodic 'dry burns' seems to resurrect their output for a few days, but I also suspect that these dry burns contribute to frying atty coils. So, it's a no-win situation.

Anyone else noticed that dark, highly-colored liquids screw up their attys?

I found if the color is from tobacco flavor this seems to be true. But I have a dark colored capella double chocolate that I don't have this issue with at all. I am leaning more towards the particle theory (sounds like something from quantum mechanics!! 8-o) Perhaps dark means more particles are likely. Dark also means larger molecules which often have a higher boiling point, so perhaps some of them get left behind. I guess the residue test would give a better indication of that for a particular flavor.