Kanger subtank TSCs

[squag]

I've been using Kanger Subtank Ni200 heads for about three weeks with no issues at all. However, I finally worked up enough motivation to futz with the rebuildable deck and got an unhappy surprise. The pin part on the rebuildable deck that connects with the 510 pin in the base of the Subtank is way shorter (2.5mm) than the comparable part of the Ni200 heads.

When I screw the rebuildable deck onto the base of the Subtank and open the airflow all the way to provide visibility inside the base of the tank I can see a pretty good-sized gap between the deck pin and 510 connection of the base. Unfortunately, it's too dark to photograph to show the gap.

It is possible to unscrew the pin on the deck a bit to lengthen amount the pin protrudes but it makes the connection to the deck way, way too wobbly to be usable. vapor beast was already very aware of the issue when I called so this would not appear to be a one-off oopsie on Kanger's part.

While what I have experienced is a rebuildable deck issue it has made me wonder if it is possible that some of the pins on some of the prebuilt Kanger Subtank Ni200 heads aren't long enough to be making rock solid 510 connections? That would explain the flaky behavior some people have been seeing.

From the picture, it looks like there is no insulator. That insulator should extend it another couple millimeters or so. Bummer!

 

[ThunderDan]

From the picture, it looks like there is no insulator. That insulator should extend it another couple millimeters or so. Bummer!

That is what I was thinking too. It also looks like it has the smaller juice channels that don't extend through the base.

Bummer indeed.

FWIW peraspera, the OG subtank base I had did was similar. It was visibly not making connection to the 510 pin, I too could see it through the airholes not touching. I just secured the RBA base in, and pressed the 510 pin into the base further with a mandrel until they touched, its only secured with an insulator.

 

[peraspera]

That is what I was thinking too. It also looks like it has the smaller juice channels that don't extend through the base.

Bummer indeed.

FWIW peraspera, the OG subtank base I had did was similar. It was visibly not making connection to the 510 pin, I too could see it through the airholes not touching. I just secured the RBA base in, and pressed the 510 pin into the base further with a mandrel until they touched, its only secured with an insulator.

Vapor Beast has excellent customer service so whatever it is I need for the rebuildable deck to work as it should was mailed to me right away. Since I've had coils from two packages of Ni200 heads working perfectly on two rDNA40s and the 510 connector on the Subtank Mini base appears to be placed where it should be to make a solid connection to a PV I'm not futzing with it.

I don't see how any temperature protected chip would be able to correct the math for dicey builds or 510 connections to produce accurate temperature so at this point I feel as though the ball is in the topper manufacturers' courts. Temperature protection is the most powerful argument we have to make to the FDA to allow open systems rather than tossing us back in the dark ages of closed system cig-alikes so I hope they step up.

 

[BNEAT]

Experience and understanding. Note that I don't dismiss what other people experience, I dismiss the idea that they are problems. Thinking of them as problems creates mental blocks for people that often stop them from achieving what they want to achieve. All busardo had to do was raise the temperature but instead he made this huge issue out of it and in the end he didn't have an enjoyable vape when he easily could have.

So I put a new oven in my kitchen but the temperature was off. The manufacturer told me to raise the temp until my Toll-House cookies burned, then back it off a little on the next batch.

 

[edyle]

From the picture, it looks like there is no insulator. That insulator should extend it another couple millimeters or so. Bummer!

Yes, looks like the centerpin insulator is missing:

 

[a tez]

I had a 30 minute conversation with Brandon Ward from Evolv about these coils. He said the legs are too long. What's happening is the coil is getting heated and so are the legs. The coil is being cooled by the juice and air and the legs with just air. So the DNA 40 is basically averaging the temperatures and the legs are causing the reading to be inaccurate to what the actual coil temperature is. He said he keeps his device at 480F when using these coils (after refinement). I have noticed that on both my Hana Modz V4m and Vapor Flask 2.1 that I need to keep my temp set between 480-540 to get my preferred vape and anything lower produces little to no flavor and vapor production.

He recommended not to take the tank on and off to trick the chip. He said just crank up the temperature. You will know what is too hot or not.

He also told me he was going to China to speak with some of the major manufacturers about specialized products for DNA 40 use. Evolv also has a prototype 510 connection they have been working on that they are going to be giving to these manufacturers to have a more solid and accurate reading for DNA 40 devices.

He also told me the TC Atlantis coils coming out work beautifully. Can't wait to get some.

 

[a tez]

I forgot to mention in last post. He also told me to make sure the coil is screwed into the base as tight as possible. Same with the tank to the 510 on your mod. You want ZERO movement. They ran tests in their lab at Evolv and the slightest movement (unscrewing) of the tank to the 510 can change the ohm reading by up to .03ohms. He even described this as "pocket movement".

The way he put it to me was "You know how they tell you not to over tighten your tanks to the mods? Well, you want to make it so tight that you think you may need a wrench to get it off".

 

[BNEAT]

Great info there! Maybe they'll all get on the same page and start making some attys that'll work right.

 

[dr g]

I had a 30 minute conversation with Brandon Ward from Evolv about these coils. He said the legs are too long. What's happening is the coil is getting heated and so are the legs. The coil is being cooled by the juice and air and the legs with just air. So the DNA 40 is basically averaging the temperatures and the legs are causing the reading to be inaccurate to what the actual coil temperature is. He said he keeps his device at 480F when using these coils (after refinement). I have noticed that on both my Hana Modz V4m and Vapor Flask 2.1 that I need to keep my temp set between 480-540 to get my preferred vape and anything lower produces little to no flavor and vapor production.

He recommended not to take the tank on and off to trick the chip. He said just crank up the temperature. You will know what is too hot or not.

Told y'all.

So I put a new oven in my kitchen but the temperature was off. The manufacturer told me to raise the temp until my Toll-House cookies burned, then back it off a little on the next batch.

What is this nonsense? The analogy is this: Busardo got underdone cookies at 400 degrees and pouted about it rather than turning up the temperature to get properly done cookies.

 

[edyle]

I forgot to mention in last post. He also told me to make sure the coil is screwed into the base as tight as possible. Same with the tank to the 510 on your mod. You want ZERO movement. They ran tests in their lab at Evolv and the slightest movement (unscrewing) of the tank to the 510 can change the ohm reading by up to .3ohms. He even described this as "pocket movement".

The way he put it to me was "You know how they tell you not to over tighten your tanks to the mods? Well, you want to make it so tight that you think you may need a wrench to get it off".

Just want to make sure people scanning through the post take notice of that.

It's something a lot of people don't seem to get when they're talking about 'subohm';

but particularly with the issue of using low ohms such as 0.1 ohm with nickel, it highlights one of the problems currently with the stage of temperature control that we are at at this point; if the technology improves where temperature control can be achieved above 1 ohm, it would be a major milestone.




I suppose evolve hasn't considered making a tc kick module;
seems to me those subohmers who are already used to vaping on devices that do not have extra voltage drop issues would suit the current stage of tc.

 

[BNEAT]

What is this nonsense? The analogy is this: Busardo got underdone cookies at 400 degrees and pouted about it rather than turning up the temperature to get properly done cookies.

Nonsense? My analogy was spot on: Busardos' first batch of cookies turned out perfect. If his oven would've remained at the temperature Nestlès recommended then his second batch would've cooked perfectly, too.

I'm trying to imagine how my Mother would react if my Dad tried to tell her the oven isn't broken, just turn up the temperature....hahahahaha

 

[dr g]

Nonsense? My analogy was spot on: Busardos' first batch of cookies turned out perfect. If his oven would've remained at the temperature Nestlès recommended then his second batch would've cooked perfectly, too.

I'm trying to imagine how my Mother would react if my Dad tried to tell her the oven isn't broken, just turn up the temperature....hahahahaha

Spoken like someone who has spent very little time with an oven. Just about every oven needs to have its temperature checked and compensated for. Ovens can be calibrated, and the temperature setting you use will, obviously, change after calibration. The DNA40 does the equivalent of automatic calibration, and the temperature setting you use will, also obviously, change.

If you get a crappy result, you don't just throw your hands up and pout in the corner.

 

[Confuzzled1969]

Well I've had my Vaporshark for almost three weeks now and I am enjoying it quite a bit.

I have experienced issues, but so far they are the result of the nickel OCC coils or just getting past learning to build with Nickel.

In my experience, these coils need to be re-worked, these coils are the only ones that give me the "refinment issue".

If I build the RBA section of the mini, I don't get it. If I put them in the nano, it is much less of an issue for what ever reason, but does happen on occaision.

So I will stop using these coils in anything except the Nano tank, which is to small for my vaping anyway.

So far I have built nickel builds in the Subtank mini, Veritas RDA, Derringer RDA, and Freakshow RDA, and none of them exprience the "refinement issue".

So I am chocking this one up to Kangertech's coils, guess I will have to continue to rebuild for now, perhaps Aspire can get it right for us with the nickel Atlantis coils...

The DNA 40 has worked rather flawlessly except when I use Kangertech OCC coils. That is the only time I experience the "refinement issue".

 

[a tez]

Just want to make sure people scanning through the post take notice of that.

It's something a lot of people don't seem to get when they're talking about 'subohm';

but particularly with the issue of using low ohms such as 0.1 ohm with nickel, it highlights one of the problems currently with the stage of temperature control that we are at at this point; if the technology improves where temperature control can be achieved above 1 ohm, it would be a major milestone.




I suppose evolve hasn't considered making a tc kick module;
seems to me those subohmers who are already used to vaping on devices that do not have extra voltage drop issues would suit the current stage of tc.

Sorry made a typo. It is suppose to be .03ohms not .3ohms. Still enough to require a ramp up/down in temperature.

Point still stands though, TC is very sensitive and requires high quality builds and materials. A proper connection to the 510 is a must for accurate readings.

 

[retird]

Nonsense? My analogy was spot on: Busardos' first batch of cookies turned out perfect. If his oven would've remained at the temperature Nestlès recommended then his second batch would've cooked perfectly, too.

I'm trying to imagine how my Mother would react if my Dad tried to tell her the oven isn't broken, just turn up the temperature....hahahahaha

Spoken like someone who has spent very little time with an oven. Just about every oven needs to have its temperature checked and compensated for. Ovens can be calibrated, and the temperature setting you use will, obviously, change after calibration. The DNA40 does the equivalent of automatic calibration, and the temperature setting you use will, also obviously, change.

If you get a crappy result, you don't just throw your hands up and pout in the corner.

True story here (not anology)..... remodeled our kitchen.... bought new oven..... temperature not right (cooked cooler than temperature setting)..... contacted manufacturer....manufacturer sent out a service technician (great customer service)..... oven turned on and heated up to cutoff....temperature measured.... temperature regulation was off and technician calibrated the oven.... temperature now correct...no burnt cookies....no guessing....oh and no charge for the service call... under warranty....

 

[retird]

I had a 30 minute conversation with Brandon Ward from Evolv about these coils. He said the legs are too long. What's happening is the coil is getting heated and so are the legs. The coil is being cooled by the juice and air and the legs with just air. So the DNA 40 is basically averaging the temperatures and the legs are causing the reading to be inaccurate to what the actual coil temperature is. He said he keeps his device at 480F when using these coils (after refinement). I have noticed that on both my Hana Modz V4m and Vapor Flask 2.1 that I need to keep my temp set between 480-540 to get my preferred vape and anything lower produces little to no flavor and vapor production.

He recommended not to take the tank on and off to trick the chip. He said just crank up the temperature. You will know what is too hot or not.

He also told me he was going to China to speak with some of the major manufacturers about specialized products for DNA 40 use. Evolv also has a prototype 510 connection they have been working on that they are going to be giving to these manufacturers to have a more solid and accurate reading for DNA 40 devices.

He also told me the TC Atlantis coils coming out work beautifully. Can't wait to get some.

I forgot to mention in last post. He also told me to make sure the coil is screwed into the base as tight as possible. Same with the tank to the 510 on your mod. You want ZERO movement. They ran tests in their lab at Evolv and the slightest movement (unscrewing) of the tank to the 510 can change the ohm reading by up to .03ohms. He even described this as "pocket movement".

The way he put it to me was "You know how they tell you not to over tighten your tanks to the mods? Well, you want to make it so tight that you think you may need a wrench to get it off".

On the Kanger pre-made coils talk here..... maybe why I'm not having issues is because I tighten the coils really good when installing them....and don't have the mini so the RBA issue I can't speak to from personal experience.. I too am awaiting the Atlantis coils.... hopefully soon.,...

 

[a tez]

On the Kanger pre-made coils talk here..... maybe why I'm not having issues is because I tighten the coils really good when installing them....and don't have the mini so the RBA issue I can't speak to from personal experience.. I too am awaiting the Atlantis coils.... hopefully soon.,...

Mine are tightened as much as possible and it happens on both my mods. The RBA section works fine, just the OCC coils have the issue. It may just work better with the nano for whatever reason.

I have went through 2 packs and have seen no difference. Both ordered directly from Vapor Shark. They are also aware of the issue and the QC issue with these coils. 3 out of the 5 of my new pack have coils that are leaking and I am basically drinking juice with each pull. Vapor Shark should be sending me new ones this week. 2 out of the 5 were also not put together properly. The bottom of the coil was almost completely loose and was only able to snap in after tightening to the base.

 

[retird]

Mine are tightened as much as possible and it happens on both my mods. The RBA section works fine, just the OCC coils have the issue. It may just work better with the nano for whatever reason.

I have went through 2 packs and have seen no difference. Both ordered directly from Vapor Shark. They are also aware of the issue and the QC issue with these coils. 3 out of the 5 of my new pack have coils that are leaking and I am basically drinking juice with each pull. Vapor Shark should be sending me new ones this week. 2 out of the 5 were also not put together properly. The bottom of the coil was almost completely loose and was only able to snap in after tightening to the base.

gee.... you are having a bad experience....currently using my 4th package of 5 Kangers without issue in the nano....I've even purchased these coils from more than 1 vendor...no leaking and no drinking of juice here....I would think if you are drinking juice the gasket is leaking allowing juice into the air channel...

 

[dr g]

I have quite a few nickel OCCs in circulation, never heard of them flooding. Usually the opposite.

 

[a tez]

gee.... you are having a bad experience....currently using my 4th package of 5 Kangers without issue in the nano....I've even purchased these coils from more than 1 vendor...no leaking and no drinking of juice here....I would think if you are drinking juice the gasket is leaking allowing juice into the air channel...

Yea it's weird. All of the kanthal OCC coils I have ever bought have been perfect. The TC coils have been a nightmare. Vapor Shark even said they know there is a problem because a lot of people have been calling them about it.