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Mixing By Weight: Basics 101

Discussion in 'DIY E-Liquid' started by Capt.shay, May 13, 2016.

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  1. Capt.shay

    Capt.shay Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 10, 2013
    W. Ma. U.S.A.
    With things being the way they are with the FDA, a whole lot more people are turning to DIY. I have been mixing for a few years now and started out using syringes and measured cylinders. Along the path I came across people who were mixing by weight. The idea appealed to me and I have been a proponent ever since. I find mixing by weight easier, more consistent and quicker than mixing by volume. Bellow I will show you how I mix by weight and I hope it helps some of my fellow vapors out during these bleak deeming times.

    You will need:

    Nicotine From places like Nude Nicotine, Vapors Tech, or Hartland vapes to name a few.
    VG, PG From Places like Bulk Apothecary, or wizard labs to name a couple
    Flavorings From places like Bull City for small amounts or directly from the manufacturer.

    Here, on the right, you can see that the VG, PG and Nic. are in squeeze bottles (available on Amazon among other places). I have the bottles clearly marked and they are also different sizes to avoid any confusion.
    [​IMG]

    On the left are the two flavors I will be using for this recipe (Flavor West Yellow Cake and TFA Marshmallow) and on these bottles I have Yorker caps that I ordered from Flavor West. For flavor bottles that wont accept Yorker caps, I use disposable pipits to transfer the liquid (I purchased 500 on E-bay for very little money, I still have about 400 of them a couple of years later)

    Since I don't have WiFi in my mixing room, I use a program called Liquix (available at the app store) on a pad as my calculator. This and most current calculators offer a weight bassed option built in. Here is a picture of the screen of my pad that shows what we will need to make today's recipe called "Twinki" 60ml, 30PG,70VG 2mg/l. As you can see, we will need 7.49grams of Yellow Cake (12%), 2.50grams (4%) of Marshmallow, 1.25grams of 100mg/l nic., 7.49grams of PG and 52.92grams of VG.
    [​IMG]

    We begin by placing the 60ml bottle on the scale and press "tare" to zero the scale. We will then drop 7.49g. of Yellow Cake in to the bottle:
    [​IMG]

    We then again Tare the scale and add the next ingredient 2.50g. of Marshmallow:
    [​IMG]

    Then 1.25g of Nic.:
    [​IMG]

    And 7.49g. of Pg:
    [​IMG]

    At this point, we can simply top the bottle off with VG to complete our mix as we are using a bottle that is the same size as the batch size or you can measure out the 52.92 grams of VG.
    [​IMG]



    And your done! That's it. Nothing to wash or rinse. It is about as simple and easy as you can get when mixing juice. I highly encourage you to give it a try. It is a rare case indeed where someone who has given this method an honest try and gone back to syringes. I wish I had used this method from the beginning and if your just starting out, I would highly recommend skipping the syringes all together.

    Happy Mixing!
    John
     
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  2. Capt.shay

    Capt.shay Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 10, 2013
    W. Ma. U.S.A.
    NOTES

    I mix for several family members and a couple of friends so I mix at least 10-15 bottles a week and I find this the simplest and fastest way to make juice. Also, remember that a single drop weighs .03-.04g. If you off by a couple of hundredths, don't sweat it. That is less than one drop and that is the smallest we can dispense. I hope the above post is helpful to some of you. Bellow are a few random thoughts and information from my experience. Of course, YMMV

    Scales:
    Pictured above is the Amazon.com: American Weigh Scales LB-501 Digital Kitchen Scale: Kitchen & Dining scale and it works fine but I will not buy it again. I will be spending a few more dollars and go back to this scale 500g x 0.01g High Precision Digital Scale SF-400D2 Counting w/ USB Wall Adapter . It is much faster making it easier to be accurate and it has a larger read out and does not auto shut off in battery mode. Cheaper scales are available but you do get what you pay for to some degree. Make sure it goes to .00 and I would recommend at least a 500g capacity.


    Weights:
    • Weight of PG: 1.038 grams per ml
    • Weight of VG: 1.26 grams per ml
    • Weight of Pure Nicotine: 1.01 grams per ml

    • Weight of 100mg in PG: 1.035 grams per ml

    • Weight of 60mg in PG: 1.03632 grams per ml

    • Weight of 50mg in PG: 1.0366 grams per ml

    • Weight of 48mg in PG: 1.036656 grams per ml

    • Weight of 36mg in PG: 1.036992 grams per ml

    • Weight of 24mg in PG: 1.037328 grams per ml

    • Weight of 100mg in VG: 1.235 grams per ml

    • Weight of 60mg in VG: 1.245 grams per ml

    • Weight of 50mg in VG: 1.2475 grams per ml

    • Weight of 48mg in VG: 1.248 grams per ml

    • Weight of 36mg in VG: 1.251 grams per ml

    • Weight of 24mg in VG: 1.254 grams per ml

    Nicotine:
    I have used Nic. from several different vendors and most are quite adequate but they can vary by taste and throat hit. Currently I am using Nic. from Vapers Tech. A great thread on different nicotine's is Nicotine Comparisons. It is long but read back several pages then jump in to the thread. Nicotine, properly frozen, will last several years.

    Flavor:
    I primarily use flavors from Perfumer's Apprentice, Flavor West and e-aromashop-INAWERA GROUP along with several select flavors from different makers. Each maker has it's strong points and certain stand out flavors. Bull City Vapor - Best Prices on DIY e-liquid Supplies and Wizard Labs are good source for small amounts but you can often save money by buying directly from the manufacturer. In the future (post deemings) we should still be able to buy flavors as they are in food manufacture and it doesn't appear they can ban them (but Wizard and Bull City may not be around)

    Bottles:
    E-bay and Amazon can fill most of your container needs. Glass Bottle Outlet is also an excellent source.

    Labels:
    You can create custom labels using Avery address labels.

    Read Danny45's blogs
    Read BillsMajicVapor's blogs
    Check out the TFA thread


    Happy mixing!
     
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  3. Sugar_and_Spice

    Sugar_and_Spice Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Sep 11, 2010
    between here and there
    Thank you so much for creating this thread. I am sure it will be invaluable to all members, not just the ones starting to DIY.
    Maybe one of the mods will consider it for a sticky up top.

    :)
     
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  4. GaryInTexas

    GaryInTexas Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 20, 2013
    NE Texas, USA
    Well that was just a very useful post. Well done Capt.
     
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  5. Frocket

    Frocket Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2013
    north Carolina
    So, got everything on order, including a scale. Plenty of flavors, plenty of base nic, VG, PG, etc. Waiting not-so-patiently for everything to ship here from the States.

    Typically, I vape high VG liquids, normally 80% plus. For DIY, will I even need PG? Using just PG nic base and PG base flavor, will the liquid be thin enough to be run in tanks? Kinda curious what VG/PG ratio others are working with.

    Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk
     
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  6. mhertz

    mhertz Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 7, 2014
    Denmark
    That is what many do and should be fine for most e.g. subohm tanks etc which are geared for the newer popular ratios(e.g. 30/70 and max-vg). If using the MTL style tanks, then some will maybe have issues though...

    John, great post, thank you! Pictures are worth a thousand words or whatever the saying goes :) We can explain to others a million times how easy it is, but showing it like you did really emphasis the easiness and niceness of this method... :)
     
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  7. Capt.shay

    Capt.shay Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 10, 2013
    W. Ma. U.S.A.
    Your final ratio will be dictated by the percentage of flavor and strength of nicotine so if you have say 22% in flavorings and 3% Nic then the highest VG ratio you can achieve is 75%vg/25%pg. On the other hand, say you are using a strong FA single flavor at only 6% and the same 3% Nic then you could achieve 91%/9% and that could cause wicking problems depending on the atty. and you might want to add a little PG to get it closer to 80/20. It all depends on what you want and since you are making your own, you can make it at what ever you want to optimize what you find works best for you.

    Please report back when your stuff comes in and you get a chance to give this method a try. If you have any questions, post them up!
     
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  8. Frocket

    Frocket Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2013
    north Carolina
    Well, everything except the scale got here. Still kinda figuring out recipes that'll work for me. Oddly enough, I seem to be liking unflavored 85% VG at 3mg. Also trying out TFA's vanilla custard, but 5% seems a little too much for me. I think next batch will be about 1-2% custard and 2% marshmallow or some other blending flavor, possibly Bavarian creme.

    Also want to try hibiscus, but at a low percentage, probably start with just a few drops in 15ml of unflavored and blend from there.

    Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk
     
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  9. Jdurand

    Jdurand Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 16, 2014
    Long Island, NY
    I finally pulled the trigger on this. Thanks cap for the inspiration to finally do this. looking forward to my next mixing session sans syringes!

    By the way, the scale you say you prefer is actually not a few bucks more, now its a few bucks less!
     
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  10. Capt.shay

    Capt.shay Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 10, 2013
    W. Ma. U.S.A.
    I encourage people to try all of their flavors as a stand alone first before trying to use them in a recipe. You need to know their flavor profiles before you can know how to use them. Mix up at least a 7 -10ml sample so you have a good idea and you can tinker with it if you want. Even if you hate it as a stand alone and throw it away, so what, it only cost you a few cents.

    Custards on their own aren't for most people. Try mixing them with a fruit or maybe a caramel? Percentages will change as you blend them with other flavors and you seek to strike a balance.

    Let us know how things go when you get your scale and feel free to post other questions here.

    I think you will find it so much neater and easier. We don't need no stinking syringes!

    It appears they dropped the price a little but it does not come with calibration weights like the AW but weights are inexpensive if you don't have any or you could use coins to check it and even calibrate. I think I will buy one now and put the AW in to back up. Again, report back in when you have given it a try.
     
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  11. Jdurand

    Jdurand Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 16, 2014
    Long Island, NY
    Correct me if I'm wrong, if the scale isn't calibrated, my percentages would still come out the same, it's just my final mix could be up or down a ML or two, right?

    And I will report back after I do some mixing this way.
     
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  12. mhertz

    mhertz Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 7, 2014
    Denmark
    Yes, if the "skew" is consistent, which i'm guessing it is, as if not then calibration wouldn't either help i'm guessing... Note all scales are properly calibrated from the manufacturer, and so most of the time works fine when gotten, but it's a good idea to check at first arrival + at certain times thereafter, if the scale is consistent and accurate, e.g. with the coin method that I and other use. Normally it's big changes in temperature that can throw the calibration off i've read... The scales I have and have had, have never failed the coin test and so never needed calibration, and they where all cheap china scales... One of them have had frequent use for over a year now... I just dump them if they ever get "skewed"(uncalibrated) and buy a new, but if having one of the nicer scales like you and John, then calibration-weights of course are a nice thing to have/use...

    Also, for sure +1 on testing every flavor standalone first... Crazy to me that some don't do that, as they often will not have a clue about the actual true taste of said flavor, but just "slight evidence" about how it reacts with certain other ones...
     
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  13. Jdurand

    Jdurand Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 16, 2014
    Long Island, NY
    Thanks, that was what I thought. I don't see the need to re-calibrate a 25 dollar scale. You're right, if it gets wonky, pitch it and get another.
     
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  14. Frocket

    Frocket Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2013
    north Carolina
    Just got my AWS 500g scale yesterday. Of course, the first thing I did was to check it with the 200g weights that were included, and noticed it was off by about 0.3g.

    So, I happily calibrated it, then started weighing everything around me simply because I could. Sensitive enough to pick up a small scrap of paper at just a few hundredths of a gram.

    Anyway, even though I realize that it would probably work fine uncalibrated, the little OCD devil in me does a happy dance when the 200g weight shows 200.00g on the scale.

    Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk
     
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  15. Heath54

    Heath54 Full Member

    Apr 16, 2016
    Western New York
    I would like to know more about calibrating with a coin. How does one know how much a given coin weighs?
    Thank you
    Heath54
     
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  16. Frocket

    Frocket Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2013
    north Carolina
    A clean, mint-condition US nickel weighs 5g, and a penny in the same condition weighs 2.5g. Corroded or worn coins may weigh slightly more or less.

    The US mint also has published specification for dimes, quarters and other coins, but their weights aren't nice round numbers like the penny or nickel.

    I'm not sure how much the weight of a nickel would vary based on its condition, however. The scale I have (American Weigh Scales 500g model) requires 200g and 400g for calibration. That would add up to a total of 80 nickels. I suppose with that many nickels, any small variations might average out to some degree. However, skin oils and other deposits may add up as well.

    So, it depends on what your scale requires for calibrating. Some need two 200g weights, some need a single 500g weight, or some other combination. Though it may not be quite as accurate as using calibration weights, you could probably substitute with the appropriate number of nickels.

    Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk
     
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  17. Heath54

    Heath54 Full Member

    Apr 16, 2016
    Western New York
    Thank you for the great answer.
     
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  18. Frocket

    Frocket Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2013
    north Carolina
    You're welcome.

    I just mixed up my first liquids using my scale this morning, and I don't think I'll go back to mixing my volume at all. It's much more convenient and accurate, IMO.

    Just gotta get a big squeeze bottle for VG. Using a syringe or pipette is a pain.

    Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk
     
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  19. Frocket

    Frocket Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2013
    north Carolina
    Got bored and google-fu'd some coin weights. For Euro users, you're kinda out of luck. None of the Euro coins weights have nice round numbers.

    For our British friends, a 20-pence piece is 5g.

    Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk
     
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  20. mhertz

    mhertz Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 7, 2014
    Denmark
    You don't calibrate with coins(well, you probably can, but generally speaking)... The coin method imho is for checking IF your scale needs calibration... As I stated mine didn't, and have been within 0.01g precise which is the spec of the scale anyway... To find out your local coin densities then simply look the coin in question up through wikipedia which e.g. lists all my danish kroner coins there, and new or old coins in my experience don't change a thing, and we would need much better precision to pick that up...

    When I get a new scale I check it with a coin, placed 5 or 10 times in a row and checking the numbers for accuracy/consistency, and if it's OK then I know I can use the scale for my DIY... After that, I recheck with the same test about every 2-3 months time... I have/had 4 scales and only one I didn't let through for DIY'ing, not because it was inaccurate, but because it had a stupid idea of only updating the display when more than 0.05g was added at once, so if pouring very slowly, drops at a time, then the display would still state 0.00g instead of e.g. 3.5g! All my scales are from fasttech or dx in china, because as i've often stated, the good AW scales are way to expensive in customs/shipping to my country... My most used scale was like 14 bucks or so and with free shipping, and is 500g/0.01g resolution... It has 1min cutoff, which is fully enough for me, but I also have another scale for about same price without auto-shutoff...
     
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