Natural Tobaccos - Part Deux

[Mr.Mann]

I hate to belabor this, but as I'm stocking up to start DIYing again, I need to buy more unflavored nic juice and I'm told my prior source is no longer carried. As I have TH issues, I want to understand TH control. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you are saying.



So even if the nic liquid of two different vendors is identical, they can still have a different TH? What is the cause for this difference in TH between vendor nic liquids, if not nicotine content, is it a difference in the nic extraction process? If so, do you (or anyone else here) know which processes(es) result in a greater, or for my interests a lower TH?

Thanks.

Not to answer on behalf of Jerms, but the point of it all is that for the most part, high(ish) nic and high(ish) PG, if not just those two ingredients in general (but in tandem), are behind a lot of why we have TH or not. However, this is not always the case and many examples can be given about high VG/lower nic liquids that have more TH than their higher nic/higher PG counterparts. Some nic of equal strength can have differernt TH too -- but that could be due to what it's suspended in having the higher TH. It's all speculation and we have no idea as to why some things hit harder, when on paper it should be the same as something else, or even less of a hard hitter. Flavorings matter, but since we will never know exactly what flavorings in fact do it for any one retail liquid, again, we speculate. The DIY forum likely will be able to hone in on TH a bit further with regard to nic and flavorings, but even then it could still play out differently for different devices -- back to square one.

 

[Dusty_D]

I remember when I dropped Nic completely around 6 months after taking up vaping, there was a period of close to 2 months where I tried everything to introduce TH into my 0 nic juices. 100% PG, add PGA (pure grain alcohol), add menthol, add cinnamon. Nothing.. nothing came close to resembling the TH provided by Nic, so I went back to 9 - 12mg which is where I've stayed since.

With the advent of higher wattage, adjustable air-flow vaping, I can now drop down to 6mg and still retain the same element of TH by hitting harder either by doing lung hits or longer/larger mouth-to-lung hits. These were not options 3.5 years ago.

I also vaguely remember a vendor having a product that could be added to juices that would raise the TH. There was some speculation that it had a peppery base that simulated the effect of Nic in a regular juice.

What bearing this has on the current conversation, I'm not sure, but hopefully some of it makes sense.

 

[MikeNice81]

This is when you reach for the strongest English blend in your arsenal.

Gargle with Devil Dog! Rinse and repeat as necessary.

Boomer's Obsidian did the trick. Now my wife is threatening to throw me out of the house. She says it smells like, "rubber or maybe a burnt tire."

 

[Mr.Mann]

I remember when I dropped Nic completely around 6 months after taking up vaping, there was a period of close to 2 months where I tried everything to introduce TH into my 0 nic juices. 100% PG, add PGA (pure grain alcohol), add menthol, add cinnamon. Nothing.. nothing came close to resembling the TH provided by Nic, so I went back to 9 - 12mg which is where I've stayed since.

With the advent of higher wattage, adjustable air-flow vaping, I can now drop down to 6mg and still retain the same element of TH by hitting harder either by doing lung hits or longer/larger mouth-to-lung hits. These were not options 3.5 years ago.

I also vaguely remember a vendor having a product that could be added to juices that would raise the TH. There was some speculation that it had a peppery base that simulated the effect of Nic in a regular juice.

What bearing this has on the current conversation, I'm not sure, but hopefully some of it makes sense.

Oddly, for me, I can vape straight VG (no nic/no flavoring) and experience, maybe not a TH, but a fullness to the vape (related to TH). For a short time last year I think, I vaped straight VG for a few days and thought about how strange it was that I could actually "feel" it going down (like a gentle TH), but with straight PG it was just nothingness. Pure nothingness.

Anyway, it's all a mystery like why two equal-ratio and equal-nic liquids form the same vendor can pack a wallop of a TH and a dud -- flavoring plays a part, but not the whole story.

 

[Jerms]

I hate to belabor this, but as I'm stocking up to start DIYing again, I need to buy more unflavored nic juice and I'm told my prior source is no longer carried. As I have TH issues, I want to understand TH control. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you are saying.



So even if the nic liquid of two different vendors is identical, they can still have a different TH? What is the cause for this difference in TH between vendor nic liquids, if not nicotine content, is it a difference in the nic extraction process? If so, do you (or anyone else here) know which processes(es) result in a greater, or for my interests a lower TH?

Thanks.

I don't know why some nic is smoother than others. I remember when looking at WizardLabs they had a version called Ice, and it said something about it's further processed for a smoother TH. I checked the site and I don't see it listed, so maybe it's not sold any more. I'm guessing the purity and how the nic is processed has to do with the harshness, but I'm just guessing.

You would be able to learn a lot about nic in the eliquid DIY section. Either do some searches or start a thread asking for opinions on the smoothest nic. I'm guessing the answer will be more subjective than concrete though. If your getting into DIY you're probably going to want to do some research on the different brands and vendors of nic.

 

[Jerms]

Not to answer on behalf of Jerms, but the point of it all is that for the most part, high(ish) nic and high(ish) PG, if not just those two ingredients in general (but in tandem), are behind a lot of why we have TH or not. However, this is not always the case and many examples can be given about high VG/lower nic liquids that have more TH than their higher nic/higher PG counterparts. Some nic of equal strength can have differernt TH too -- but that could be due to what it's suspended in having the higher TH. It's all speculation and we have no idea as to why some things hit harder, when on paper it should be the same as something else, or even less of a hard hitter. Flavorings matter, but since we will never know exactly what flavorings in fact do it for any one retail liquid, again, we speculate. The DIY forum likely will be able to hone in on TH a bit further with regard to nic and flavorings, but even then it could still play out differently for different devices -- back to square one.

Yep.. what he said.

 

[Jerms]

I remember when I dropped Nic completely around 6 months after taking up vaping, there was a period of close to 2 months where I tried everything to introduce TH into my 0 nic juices. 100% PG, add PGA (pure grain alcohol), add menthol, add cinnamon. Nothing.. nothing came close to resembling the TH provided by Nic, so I went back to 9 - 12mg which is where I've stayed since.

With the advent of higher wattage, adjustable air-flow vaping, I can now drop down to 6mg and still retain the same element of TH by hitting harder either by doing lung hits or longer/larger mouth-to-lung hits. These were not options 3.5 years ago.

I also vaguely remember a vendor having a product that could be added to juices that would raise the TH. There was some speculation that it had a peppery base that simulated the effect of Nic in a regular juice.

What bearing this has on the current conversation, I'm not sure, but hopefully some of it makes sense.

I don't have any desire to go nic free anytime soon. If I ever do though, I think I'd just quit vaping. Losing that kick just wouldn't feel right!

 

[Jerms]

Not a NET, but a NETea.. Cranberry Autumn from Ahl is pretty good. I need to get some more teas from them soon, their NETeas are as enjoyable as NETobaccos to me.

 

[Dusty_D]

I don't have any desire to go nic free anytime soon. If I ever do though, I think I'd just quit vaping. Losing that kick just wouldn't feel right!

It did not feel right at all. Kinda like sipping an open can of coke the morning after a party.

 

[papabogart]

Thanks for the input MM and Dusty.

I don't know why some nic is smoother than others. I remember when looking at WizardLabs they had a version called Ice, and it said something about it's further processed for a smoother TH. I checked the site and I don't see it listed, so maybe it's not sold any more. I'm guessing the purity and how the nic is processed has to do with the harshness, but I'm just guessing.

You would be able to learn a lot about nic in the eliquid DIY section. Either do some searches or start a thread asking for opinions on the smoothest nic. I'm guessing the answer will be more subjective than concrete though. If your getting into DIY you're probably going to want to do some research on the different brands and vendors of nic.

I did a search of DIY and it reflects pretty much what Mr.Mann said, it's all over the place and/or not especially definitive. I was hoping you were on to some inside info that was more concrete in narrowing down the TH issue for me.

Anyway, I posted on the DIY for vendor suggestions and just skipped the nic discussion thing.

BTW, Wizard Labs is much cheaper on nic than others.

Thx Jerms

 

[johni]

You done with rayon or are you using both CC and KGD?

Tried the Cellucotton twice for a few days each time and developed a very dry sore throat and some taste bud issues. Don't know that the CC caused it for sure but it went away both times when I went back to KGD. I'll give CC another shot eventually but I'm leery.

I agree with about all of your CC observations and like its performance in RDAs.

 

[Jerms]

It did not feel right at all. Kinda like sipping an open can of coke the morning after a party.

After a party. Is coke slang for beer in Canana?

 

[Dusty_D]

After a party. Is coke slang for beer in Canana?

You don't sip beer the next morning, you gargle your mouth with it!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

 

[billherbst]

I did a search of DIY and it reflects pretty much what Mr.Mann said, it's all over the place and/or not especially definitive. I was hoping you were on to some inside info that was more concrete in narrowing down the TH issue for me.

Anyway, I posted on the DIY for vendor suggestions and just skipped the nic discussion thing. BTW, Wizard Labs is much cheaper on nic than others.

papa,

Here's a link to the (long) thread that discusses all the various characteristics of different vendors' liquid nics:

Nicotine Comparisons

The current "darling" of the Nic Comparisons thread is VapersTek liquid nic, which is sourced from the UK and touted as being the purest available. $125 plus shipping for a liter of 100mg/ml.

HeartlandVapes sells the least expensive good-quality liquid nic---$65 for a liter of 100mg/ml nic with free shipping. (Use promo code "25Off100" in the shopping cart to get the 25% discount and free shipping.) That's about half what WizardLabs or VapersTek liquid nic costs, and one-third what some vendors charge. Heck, it's one-quarter of what XtremeVaping charges for a liter of 100mg nic.

I have 2 1/2 liters of 100mg nic in the freezer---a liter each from HeartlandVapes and RTSVapes, plus 500ml from MyFreedomSmokes. A second liter of HeartlandVapes 100mg that's half gone is kept in my refrigerator as my day-to-day nic. Although it has oxidized (yellowed) some over the year that I've had it, it's still very good nic. I've used WizardLabs 100mg nic in the past, and HeartlandVapes nic is very similar.

 

[Jerms]

Tried the Cellucotton twice for a few days each time and developed a very dry sore throat and some taste bud issues. Don't know that the CC caused it for sure but it went away both times when I went back to KGD. I'll give CC another shot eventually but I'm leery.

I agree with about all of your CC observations and like its performance in RDAs.

That sucks. I read a couple people reporting a sore throat in the rayon thread.

A guy offered to send me some of the Delasco rayon balls that he has coming so I can try it. I can send you some if you want to find out if a different rayon source doesn't have any side effects for ya.

 

[johni]

That sucks. I read a couple people reporting a sore throat in the rayon thread.

A guy offered to send me some of the Delasco rayon balls that he has coming so I can try it. I can send you some if you want to find out if a different rayon source doesn't have any side effects for ya.

I am actually very content with KGD cotton. It does about everything I want a wick to do but the improved durability of the Rayon is appealing. Since starting with KGD, Ive used just a little over one pad so it will basically last me forever. Thanks for the offer and let us know what the Rayon balls have to offer.

 

[papabogart]

Here's a link to the (long) thread that discusses all the various characteristics of different vendors' liquid nics:

Nicotine Comparisons

Thanks Bill,

That's the nic thread I was referring to. My eyes glazed after a couple of pages, so I gave up.

I'll check that vendor out. I like to use 60mg because the math is easy for my wee mind, so that should even be much less than the 100.

 

[Dustmight]

Sorry if I'm behind the bus on this, but apparently we got all bent out of shape for nothing. At the time of this posting it appears most of the aromatics are back on the Ahlusion site for sale. #theskyaintfalling

 

[Jerms]

Sorry if I'm behind the bus on this, but apparently we got all bent out of shape for nothing. At the time of this posting it appears most of the aromatics are back on the Ahlusion site for sale. #theskyaintfalling

I don't see that as getting all bent out of shape for nothing, I see that as a productive bent out of shape!

I can't access the site on my phone, but if Maple Burley is available you better stock up, BJ, just in case!

 

[Dusty_D]

Sorry if I'm behind the bus on this, but apparently we got all bent out of shape for nothing. At the time of this posting it appears most of the aromatics are back on the Ahlusion site for sale. #theskyaintfalling

Non-US orders are automatically declined. Read our Shipping Policy


Sigh! still no hope for me..