New member with much confusion

[Jim bigam]

Hi everyone I'm relatively new to vaping and there are a few questions I have that don't make much sense to me. So I was really hoping you guys can help me out.

First of all I vape because i want to smoke a cigarette without actually smoking a cigarette so naturally I've been using cig-a-likes off and on since they closely resemble cigarettes. Is there any reason I should invest in one of those bigger vape pens or mods? I tried a buddies box mod and it seemed as though in order to smoke this thing i had to basically do a (b)ong hit for it to work, I couldn't just do a cigarette style inhale. Maybe I did something wrong but I'm not sure.

The thing that puzzles me the most is supposedly e-cigs are last gen tech and the new vaporizers are new tech but in order for them to work good I have to change coils every few days? Currently I've been smoking on the same Mark 10 e cig for about 2-3 weeks with refilling the same cartomizer. It seems that e-cigs are way more cost effective? I've seen some coils in my local store sell for about $2-$3 so it would seem kind of expensive to be changing those out all the time, or having to wait for shipping if ordered online.

 

[djsvapour]

Welcome @Jim bigam

First generation e-cigarettes are not *usually* cost effective compared to more modern second generation models. Actually, products similar to what you are using are a total, unforgiving rip-off.

BUT, the difference is the fact that you are refilling. If you refill a cig-a-like (as we call them) then you have reduced the normal running costs by up to 90%, whereas most users do not do this.

Sure, we tried (back in the day) but the cartomizers (the refills) were about the same price as a replaceable atomizer head, therefore meaning there was no loss or gain in either direction.

However, once you get used to the vapor created by a basic e-cig, it soon loses much appeal and satisfaction.
.. which means you need more vapor for full satisfaction...

I pay about $1.50 per atomizer coil. That is similar in price to a cartomizer. Most cartomizers do not last longer than an atomizer replacement. The difference (if you can get longer life from a cartomizer) is the newer stuff makes much more vapor, which makes a lot of difference in satisfaction, but means more often replacing.

However, many 3rd generation users are prepared to take the cost of having a far superior product which is 5-10 times more effective at delivering the nicotine.

So - yes, you have a point. I did the same as you for a long time, but one day I upgraded because I actually needed more to fully quit smoking.

I'm fairly sure that the running costs of something like an Innokin T18. Kanger evod or Joyetech AIO is going to be very similar to a Mark 10 or something along those lines if you are refilling the Mark 10.
The trouble is
1. Most people don't refill. Some system don't make this even possible/allow the cartomizer to be easily refilled.
2. Not many brands offer 2-3 weeks of vaping from their cartomizers
3. Using a system like this and not refilling is a most overpriced and truly unsatisfying system of vaping. Not to mention that a large proportion of users cannot actually get enough Nicotine from these systems.

Please ask away.

 

[Jim bigam]

Thanks for the reply, very helpful! I should mention I actually did purchase an Ego ce4 from eBay for around 5 bucks. I figured ill try out a vape pen but if I don't like it I'm really not out much money. And if I like it I saw some Chinese coils for about a buck a piece, so if I can have one last even a week with puffing all day that would be real nice.

 

[djsvapour]

To add,

A really up-to-date powerful box mod with a subohm tank requires a certain type of inhale. We call it 'direct to lung'. Not all people can use these. I would have failed, as they are wayyy too strong for me. I vaped at under 10w even by the end of year one.

The inhale on a cig-a-like is mouth to lung*, like a cigarette (usually).

There are lots of MTL* set-ups out there to buy. Off the top of my head, if I was to compare the price of running a cig-a-like system (refilling) to something like an 'old school' Kanger Evod, I would say the cig-a-like will be a little cheaper, but the Kanger makes three times as much vapor.

Also, there is the question of recharging.... having a small army of 180mAh batteries is not as user-freindly as 2 x 650mAh eGo batteries.
Also, most of the cig-a-likes sell you a $0.80 (real cost) battery for $9.99
There is even one brand that sells a $1.47 (real cost) battery for $29.99

$29.99 buys you some serious hardware these days.

I use a box mod that has 6,000mAh at my disposal. That is like having 33 cig-a-like batteries.
I could (if I chose) run a cartomizer on that and not have to charge for two weeks or something.

 

[djsvapour]

Thanks for the reply, very helpful! I should mention I actually did purchase an Ego ce4 from eBay for around 5 bucks. I figured ill try out a vape pen but if I don't like it I'm really not out much money. And if I like it I saw some Chinese coils for about a buck a piece, so if I can have one last even a week with puffing all day that would be real nice.

Good call!

The vape community usually acknowledges that what works for you is the best e-cig.

All coils (atomizer replacements) come from China. You can pay $6 from China for five. Or, you can pay $10 to buy domestically or even $19.99 to buy those exact same $6 coils from one of the very nasty and extremely greedy brands that like to rule the internet.
I know a shop that sells coils for $4.90 each (equivalent GBP £)
These people are not usually very happy to discover I could be ordering 5 of them for $6...

 

[Jim bigam]

I very much agree with you about the battery issues of the e cig I have. It's constantly dying on me and I have to recharge about 2-3 times a day. That is one of the main reasons I also want to try that ego I mentioned. If that doesn't work out I saw Halo has a G6 cig a like with a better battery too. I definitely prefer a mouth to lung hit so anything I decide at this point I'll keep in mind to ask what system will work that way.

 

[Jim bigam]

I forgot to ask.... When should I change the cartomizer of my Mark Ten? It's still producing the same amount of vapor after a few weeks. Will the vapor noticeably die down when it needs replaced or should these cartridges be replaced after a certain amount of time no matter how they perform?

 

[djsvapour]

I very much agree with you about the battery issues of the e cig I have. It's constantly dying on me and I have to recharge about 2-3 times a day. That is one of the main reasons I also want to try that ego I mentioned. If that doesn't work out I saw Halo has a G6 cig a like with a better battery too.

So - here is the central issue. Halo sell old and not particularly great hardware for mucho mondedas.

The G6 battery that people are currently paying $9.99 for is a $0.80 battery from China. You can buy one tomorrow for 80c if you know who to phone.
At first, they seem marginally higher quality (hell, you can buy a $0.36 battery if you want!) but don't be fooled. These batteries rarely last more than a few months at best and get extremely weak very quickly.

How much is the kit? $35?
So - that's basically less than $10-worth of hardware...and then, before you know it, you have bought more batteries, more e-liquid at 250% more expensive.

The e-cig industry is a dog-eat-dog capitalist dream. This is how the self-proclaimed #1 brand in e-cigs (self proclaimed by themselves, backed up with fake reviews, fake reviewers and fake websites) were able to charge $119.99 for a $29 e-cig. The product is identical to another one on the market. It comes from a certain factory in the Bao'an district of China (or maybe Shenzhen).... but between leaving the factory for under $10, and arriving on the shores of the UK or America, it has become a $119 ticket item.

.. just so you know..

and if you are wondering why I am quite so keen on all this - it's because I spent $800 on not being able to give up smoking with some of these 'old' products.

 

[MyMagicMist]

Well, ...

Let me start out with the Standard Disclaimers in place. One that pops up right off hand is that vaping is subjective. That means me drawing on a chuff cap in a manner similar to (b)ong hits works for me. You like sucking the vape through a straw & it works for you. Neither one of us is wrong or right. This is just our own individual likes, dislikes.

That aside you can get drip tip adapters for some RDAs (re-buildable dripping atomizers), these let you use the skinnier drip tips to simulate the cigarette experience better. You are not stuck to sucking on the atty like a (b)ong if you want the cigarette style. The reason some like the wider drip tips is due to getting more air mixed in with the vapor, this has a lot to do with it, as well it helps in doing harder draws into the lungs. It smooths the vape out, or so it is for me.

Currently, I am switching out coils roughly on a monthly or every two month basis barring physical damage to the coil/s. Of course, I build my own coils using a jig and some information dealing with ohms, resistance, battery head space. It might sound complicated at first but it becomes more so second nature after a bit. You can get good wire at an affordable cost and shipped swiftly to you. Here is where. I suggest Temco because they are reputable and offer good quality wire.

Let me show you what I use though.

Coppervape Mod
Velocity RDA

The mod I use is a mechanical. These are a little more advanced than the regulated kind of mods, cig-a-likes you're using. There is a bit of a learning curve. You're on one of the better forums to learn about vaping. There are a lot of nice folks here to help you with any questions. Some even will tell you they don't know, but might be able to guide you means of finding an answer for yourself.

I am not saying you need to emulate the way I vape. Not at all, I am saying you have a lot of options to try out if you desire, and a lot of help if you need.

Here is some now.

Building can't be that easy?

RDA building help for newbie

Index | E-Cigarette Forum

I also switch around a bit at times. I also use the Reo Grand clone mods, and I've some different RDA coming in the mail. Everyone finds what suits themselves & there's no reason to do what you don't want, except maybe to give something a try to see if you do like it or not. As for costs, well those are subjective too. You can spend a lot or a little and still get a nice (for yourself) set up or kit.

Enjoy what suits you and stay off big tobacco. Welcome aboard.

 

[djsvapour]

I forgot to ask.... When should I change the cartomizer of my Mark Ten? It's still producing the same amount of vapor after a few weeks. Will the vapor noticeably die down when it needs replaced or should these cartridges be replaced after a certain amount of time no matter how they perform?

A cartomizer (even a good one) will lose taste and vapor eventually. The more you vape it, the faster that will happen. If you are dropping in 1ml a day, you could go on for weeks...
If you get up to 2-3ml a day.... I don't think much more than a week is likely.
Some of us put them into a tank (a 'carto-tank') and I can't remember getting more than a week. That system sent my consumption up to about 3ml a day. They get very dirty and clogged up.

 

[Jim bigam]

Very good info. I'll definitely avoid that Halo e cig and probably that brand altogether.

So basically if I'm going to buy that wire do I have to make sure the atomizer is rebuildable? Or can I rebuild any atomizer?

 

[Gramdogg]

Yeah like djsvspour mentioned the kanger evod is still in my daily rotation. I enjoy the cigarette like puffs between using my bigger stuff and for going shopping etc. Like the kit your getting you can get knock off's called MT32 Evod kit I believe, around $5. The coils are very cost efficient because you can buy a 10 pack of cotton for like $1.29 and just dry burn them and replace the cotton. They use so little a 10 pack will last you years lol. Coils last for ages too it's just the wick that goes bad in them usually.

 

[Jim bigam]

That Kanger evod looks bad (a)ss. Is that a pretty big upgrade from the ego ce4 knock off?

 

[Gramdogg]

That Kanger evod looks bad (a)ss. Is that a pretty big upgrade from the ego ce4 knock off?

They are nothing like your friends, never used a CE4 but probably close. The tank will fit on your ego battery too so if you get the knock off kit you'll have 2 batteries. You'll need one while other charges and probably want my tanks for flavour changes. Other then changing tanks the only way to really change flavours without getting a mixed flavour is to clean them and change the wick each time.
$4.44 EVOD-MT3 650mAh Rechargeable E-Cigarette Starter Kit - 1.5ml / 2.4ohm / USB charger / black at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping
$2.42 EVOD E-Cigarette 650mAh Rechargeable Battery - aluminum + chromed brass / black at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping
$1.88 EVOD Electronic Cigarettes Round Mouth Atomizer (1.5mL) - black / 2.6Ω at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

 

[Jim bigam]

They are nothing like your friends, never used a CE4 but probably close. The tank will fit on your ego battery too so if you get the knock off kit you'll have 2 batteries. You'll need one while other charges and probably want my tanks for flavour changes. Other then changing tanks the only way to really change flavours without getting a mixed flavour is to clean them and change the wick each time.
$4.44 EVOD-MT3 650mAh Rechargeable E-Cigarette Starter Kit - 1.5ml / 2.4ohm / USB charger / black at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping
$2.42 EVOD E-Cigarette 650mAh Rechargeable Battery - aluminum + chromed brass / black at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping
$1.88 EVOD Electronic Cigarettes Round Mouth Atomizer (1.5mL) - black / 2.6Ω at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

How is that so cheap? Is that because it's a knock off?

 

[Gramdogg]

For the price I was paying for just 2 batteries locally I got 4 here. Oh yeah AND 20 sheets of cotton, ceramic tweezers and 10m of wire lol. Only downfall is I ordered it on Nov 2nd and don't expect to see it for another couple weeks lol.
Here's a link to the cotton and you can youtube rewicking/dry burning evod. It's very easy the top pops right off, they are easy to rebuild too if you want to try that sometime.
$1.29 Authentic Delivape Japanese Organic Cotton for RBA Atomizer (10-Pack) 10-pack - 50*60mm at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

 

[Gramdogg]

How is that so cheap? Is that because it's a knock off?

Yeah, don't say kangertech on it.

 

[Gramdogg]

I had 3 authentics, one broke very fast and other had horrible battery life brand new. The 3rd seems ok, so if 2 of the 4 knock offs work well they are better then brand name in my experiences lol.

 

[Psofos]

You could invest in a box mod with internal battery which would give you some headroom in terms of wattage and in a rebuildable atomizer that is capable of smoking like puffs (mouth to lung) and also direct to lung hits. The Merlin RTA is one which is easy to use and build.
That would actually save you money in a 2 months period instead of buying coils.
Building basic coils and wicking is really easy,can be learned in a day.
Lung hits seem awkward when you come from smoking but it makes total sense when you vape for a period and try them.

 

[daviedog]

Dear Jim, what was the name of your friends mod/atomizer that you Didn't like? Sometimes all it takes are some adjustments to make it really work for you.
Pens & such are good for backups but don't offer the options of a modern APV..