Official DNA 40 introduction

[dr g]

So you are saying that use of SS mesh wick will nullify the temperature control feature. Doesn't this rule out use of all genesis style atomizers unless they are built with non-mesh wicks?

Also, what about people with Nickel allergies? What other choices will they have for wire?

I cannot speak to it personally as I did not try it, perhaps some other beta testers can chime in. But I believe the gist is that mesh can influence the resistance enough to throw off the temperature limiting. Luckily thanks to temperature limiting, you can pick just about any wick and maximize its performance.

Two of the beta testers had nickel sensitivity, one fairly severe. They both had no problem working with the wire (with some handling precautions) and vaping it. This indicates little to no leaching of nickel into the juice or vapor.

 

[McCoys]

Also it's important to know that the most effective way of absorbing (or being exposed to) nickel is through inhalation.

I too hope that the data Evolv has gathered is published, but the fact that it is a potential danger worries me. I just hope it's not a case of one step forward and 1 step back.

I would like to see the published data you are citing in your first sentence.

 

[Limpar]

Double post

 

[Limpar]

I would like to see the published data you are citing in your first sentence.

Can't recall the exact article as I was looking into it a few months ago when I decided to replace smoking with vaping, but here's a link that states some dangers of its inhalation.

http://www.crios.be/Nickel/toxicology.htm

 

[dr g]

Can't recall the exact article as I was looking into it a few months ago when I decided to replace smoking with vaping, but here's a link that states some dangers of its inhalation.

nickel, toxicology

Note that refers to nickel compounds and inhaled particulates. Neither applies to the present innovation, which uses pure metallic nickel wire.

 

[MrPlink]

Ooooh, nothing turns me on like pseudo science speak.

 

[K_Tech]

Note that refers to nickel compounds and inhaled particulates. Neither applies to the present innovation, which uses pure metallic nickel wire.

I am not a metallurgist, but seeing as how nickel melts at 1455C (2651F) and vaporizes at 2730C (4946F) I think that even with its max temperature setting of 600F (IIRC) we should be okay. Unless you start eating the leftover wire clippings from your builds.

 

[Otto Dafe]

Yeah to get that info in this thread, the nickel wire increases in resistance quickly, so even if it starts out very low in a split second it's up to a half ohm or higher. Nickel is one of the safest wires as far as offgassing and degradation, it is commonly used in vacuum applications for that reason. it is certainly safer than kanthal and nichrome.

I promise you guys if you get a temperature controlling device you will probably not want to use anything else and you'll build all your atties to it. During the testing period slowly all my atties became nickel atties and I never even picked up my DNA20 and 30 mods, even though I want to still love them

Have you been dry burning the caramelized juice off of your nickel coils as one would with kanthal? That aspect wasn't discussed in the video.

 

[Krashman Von Stinkputin]

I would like to see the published data you are citing in your first sentence.

Don't know if the term "effective" here is throwing you off...however the FDA references this on their website and there are several scientific papers (you can google them though they aren't the most stunning reading because they are research papers submitted to peer reviewed journals)

The inhalation toxicity levels cited by the FDA are mainly published to protect personnel at the metal processing plant environments where metal dusts or off-gases from the processes are present in high concentrations or can be present for extended periods of time.
There is no doubt that nickel toxicity is highest through inhalation
The highest risk for inhaling nickel at toxic levels is if you work in a plant that makes or process nickel or nickel-based products, where literally clouds of nickel dust exist.

None of this matters with the DNA 40 when used within in specs according to Brandon.

And finally, i simply find it very hard to believe that after several years of touting their product to be first and foremost safe and
Specifically selling the feature of Temp Limiting as a benefit to offset Dr Farsilonos's findings regarding nasty by-products of overheating e-liquid (I.e the DNA can PREVENT overheating of eliquids)

That EVOLV would then give us a product that is filling us with toxic levels of nickel.
Makes no sense to me.

I think EVOLV has the testing data that backs this up (that nickel levels---if present beyond what is naturally occurring---- are well within the FDA limits of exposure) and will be more that willing to share it because THE FDA WILL REQUIRE THIS DOCUMENTATION THEMSELVES. (See the swedish Match SNUS submittals to see what they had to present)

The melting point of nickel is 2651°F and the device won't get that hot.

I think this nickel thing is overblown.
If you're worried about it
Use Kanthal (you won't get the temp limiting feature but the device will work)
Use a DNA30 (which will continue to be available)
Use something else

 

[JohnnyEars]

I was reading this on a modding forum today and it appears that the wiring diagram that evolv have put up for the DNA 40 is incorrect.. This has been confirmed by the beta team.
Pins 11 and 12 appear to be mislabeled. They should be labeled battery - and charger -, instead of fire + and fire -
Pins 3 and 4 are the fire button solder points.
http://www.evolvapor.com/datasheet/dna40.pdf

 

[VBdev]

Note that refers to nickel compounds and inhaled particulates. Neither applies to the present innovation, which uses pure metallic nickel wire.

One spot on the Temco website says 99.6% pure, another says 99.0% pure with the following composition
C 0.15, Cu 0.25, Fe 0.4, Mn 0.35, Si 0.35, S 0.01

You have to actually ingest or inhale nickel for it to affect you and you simply don't with this, as far as we know. Hot legs won't get nearly hot enough for nickel to melt or decompose.

Approximately 10% of the population are sensitive to simple contact with nickel. Women so more then men. Laws prohibiting pure nickel jewellery and limiting the amount of nickel that can be found in jewellery have been passed, its been pulled from coinage as well. No it's not just inhaling or ingesting, although we do inhale and ingest nickel everyday.

A paper I read yesterday said that people can develop a sensitivity to nickel and once developed the person remains sensitive. It can cause a type of skin rash.


I'm not saying I know that there is an increased risk with this wire. I am simply attempting to do the due diligence in finding out the information. PBusardo touched on that yesterday as well, know what's in there, know the risk, make your own decisions. Please allow the discussion to occur, if you have accurate scientific information to add that would be great, but I feel like you dismissed my post and follow on posts with inaccurate information. Are you a medical doctor dr g? In what field is your Ph.D.?

There is nickel around us everyday in the food we eat, the water we drink, and the stinkies we used to smoke. It appears the risk factors are for much higher quantities then the avg Joe is getting. My concern is we are taking a mostly pure form, heating it to 400-500 degrees F, and breathing it in. I'm just trying to find out if it is reasonable to think that is quasi safe (at least as safe as doing the same with Kanthal and about 100 times more safe then smoking). If Evolv has some data, please bring it on. Carcinogen is on the list which I currently claim is not present in ANY of my vaping ingredients, seeing it on the nickel health concerns has lead me to more questions.

 

[olderthandirt]

Was this covered in the video?

Does the DNA40 require a specific atomizer in order to determine temperature?

If not, as appears to be the case watching the video, how is the temperature across the legs of the coil being measured if the only connection between the board and the atomizer is the standard 510?

I'm obviously electronically challenged so be kind (-;

 

[VBdev]

Was this covered in the video?

Does the DNA40 require a specific atomizer in order to determine temperature?

If not, as appears to be the case watching the video, how is the temperature across the legs of the coil being measured if the only connection between the board and the atomizer is the standard 510?

I'm obviously electronically challenged so be kind (-;

Not a specific atomizer, but a specific wire type, specifically nickel wire. The board is deriving the temperature through electrical measurements of the circuit. The board asks you to tell it that it's a new wire (and the board and wire are basically the same temp) then, presumably by tracking the ohms changing through the draw 100+ times per second, it can derive the temp based on the known properties of the nickel. Hence the "is nickel safe" discussion.

You can still use kanthal but you won't get temperature control.

 

[Rossum]

Carcinogen is on the list which I currently claim is not present in ANY of my vaping ingredients

I can find some nickel compounds that are suspected carcinogens, but haven't found anything that indicates elemental, metallic nickel is regarded as such. Kanthal contains ~22% chromium, and hexavalent chromium compounds are known carcinogens, so what metal/alloy are you using for your coils that has no chance of forming any carcinogenic compounds?

 

[olderthandirt]

...The board is deriving the temperature through electrical measurements of the circuit.....

A very shadowy something to that effect crossed me mind after I posted my question.
Thanks for illuminating the shadows (-:

 

[edyle]

Flooding will still be a concern.

It's a great step and it's something I am going to adopt, I'm just thinking about the next "weak points" in vaping. There is only so much power management stuff that you can do before you run out of ideas that give any noticeable benefit. Maybe Evolv will say different though

They are great at power flow management, we need someone great at liquid flow management, and air flow management

For flooding/slow wicking, there is the liquid feed control systems like on the Sophia by Leo; basically its like the carto design or now, the bvc coil design, and you can turn the drip tip to open adjust or close the feed holes on the bvc coil head.

 

[Alto101]

I saw a post earlier stating that the coil manufactures including Aspire were going to introduce products using nickel to take advantage of the DNA40 temperature sensing. Does anyone have any information about when they will release them?
Thanks!

 

[jmarkus]

curious if theres a way to use nr-r-nr type atties like diver, sophia...with the dna40 and still take advantage of temp limit? wondering if using ss or other wire as "nr" would work?

 

[STEAM_P0WERED]

I was reading this on a modding forum today and it appears that the wiring diagram that evolv have put up for the DNA 40 is incorrect.. This has been confirmed by the beta team.
Pins 11 and 12 appear to be mislabeled. They should be labeled battery - and charger -, instead of fire + and fire -
Pins 3 and 4 are the fire button solder points.
http://www.evolvapor.com/datasheet/dna40.pdf

Yep, I saw that as well. On the "PINOUT" page of the PDF it show's the solder points and 9,10,11 & 12 are printed wrong. 10 & 11 are the battery +/-........ 9 & 12 are the charger +/-

 

[Confuzzled1969]

OK, where do we get this wire?

I am sold and as soon as it is available in a end product I like, I'll have one.