OMG!!!! My battery justn now EXPLODED

[cags]

You got a white one?

Good thinking, I should look for a white one!

I also mark my chargers. my marker is silver

 

[Nikkel]

The myth that "NiMH is no good for vaping" deserves a place along side "scientists prove bumble bees can't fly".
https://www.sciencenews.org/article/flight-bumblebee

 

[Nikkel]

"You're actually the only person I know who still uses them."
Have you never heard-tell of the Puck mods and those inspired by them?
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-variable-voltage-4aa-box-mod-easy-cheap.html

A single AA:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJxoLm8xitU

 

[Baditude]

"You're actually the only person I know who still uses them."
Have you never heard-tell of the Puck mods and those inspired by them?
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-variable-voltage-4aa-box-mod-easy-cheap.html

A single AA:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJxoLm8xitU

I agree with the second poster, "It looks like a bomb."

I'll be awaiting the information you claimed you had about the NiMH batteries. What you've provided so far is irrelevant to prove your contention.

I looked at the video on YouTube. It takes 4 batteries?! This sounds like an inefficient and expensive way to vape.

 

[Ryedan]

"You're actually the only person I know who still uses them."
Have you never heard-tell of the Puck mods and those inspired by them?
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-variable-voltage-4aa-box-mod-easy-cheap.html

A single AA:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJxoLm8xitU

I've seen that video before, but I don't know anything about these batteries. Explain some things here please.

He is using a 0.1 ohm coil at 1.2V, correct? So drawing around 12 amps and making 14 watts. What is the voltage drop like with these cells at this load with one or four batteries? How many mAh are the batteries and what is their maximum current output? What happens when they are pushed past that?

Really curious how these puppies perform but never really researched them.

 

[duroSIG556R]

Open the windows and get some air rolling through...The fumes are toxic.

 

[Baditude]

Really curious how these puppies perform but never really researched them.

The NiMH batteries that I used about 16 months ago were 18650 4.8 volt NiMH. I tried to find them on RTD Vapor to link them, but they no longer sell them. They required a special battery charger.

From what I recall, battery life was pretty dismal and got progressively worse over a very short time. I only used these batteries for about 3 weeks in a mechanical Silver Bullet and they couldn't compare to the battery capacity of my 3.7v 18650 AW IMR's. I tried these batteries out to experience higher voltage prior to getting my first Provari. I look back at that experience as a failed experiment. Three 18650 NiMH 4.8v batteries used back to back couldn't last a entire day. In comparison, an AW 18650 IMR lasts me an entire day.

Edit: I found some of these batteries here. 18650 4.8v NiMH 600mAh. I now see why they didn't last long...only 600 mAh. Toward the end of the three weeks they were only lasting about 3 hours on a charge.

 

[Nikkel]

"I'll be awaiting the information you claimed you had about the NiMH batteries. What you've provided so far is irrelevant to prove your contention."
The links I posted show I am not the Lone Ranger. If I am the only person you "know" who uses NiMH, you must not get out and about much. The video shows NiMH mishaps are considerably less exciting than Li-ion mishaps.

"He is using a 0.1 ohm coil at 1.2V, correct? So drawing around 12 amps and making 14 watts. What is the voltage drop like with these cells at this load with one or four batteries? How many mAh are the batteries and what is their maximum current output? What happens when they are pushed past that?"
I'm not a battery guru and not a sub-ohm cloud chaser. I'm new at vaping and have a lot to learn. Email to the video maker and googling for the data sheets would help you more that I could. Off the top of my head, AAs run about 2,000 mAh to 2700 mAh. His box with 4 in parallel would run about 8,000 to 10,800 mAh.
Link to an ECF thread:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/battery-mods/438832-lets-talk-about-nimh-stop-all-hating.html

 

[Ryedan]

The NiMH batteries that I used about 16 months ago were 18650 4.8 volt NiMH. I tried to find them on RTD Vapor to link them, but they no longer sell them. They required a special battery charger.

From what I recall, battery life was pretty dismal and got progressively worse over a very short time. I only used these batteries for about 3 weeks in a mechanical Silver Bullet and they couldn't compare to the battery capacity of my 3.7v 18650 AW IMR's. I tried these batteries out to experience higher voltage prior to getting my first Provari. I look back at that experience as a failed experiment.

I just Googled very quickly to make sure. NiMH cells are 1.2V each, so what you had was a battery of four cells. Apparently big cells are expensive and rare. Seems like charging should also be slow, around 8 hours minimum and if they are overcharged they can be dangerous too.

Your experience with these does not sound good Baditude. I was actually hoping Nikkel might be able to shed some light on the intricacies of NiMH batteries since he's obviously vaping them.

 

[Nikkel]

"Three 18650 NiMH 4.8v batteries used back to back couldn't last a entire day. In comparison, an AW 18650 IMR lasts me an entire day."
Most reports I've seen claim 4AAA last a day, and 4AA last several days. The discharge curve for NiMH is flatter than Li-ion.

 

[edyle]

Half of humanity, through no fault of their own, has an IQ at or below 100. There are plenty grandpa and grandma vapers who, although sharp in their youth, are now experiencing cognitive decline. Multimeters, Lipo charging bags, the algebra associated with Ohm's Law, battery chemistry, and other such onerous baggage is too much for some to bear. Even battery gurus who know it all have mishaps.
The notion that Li-ion batteries are the best for vaping began as a myth and has become a lie, since there is now much info and experience to the contrary.

"Lithium batteries are the best batteries we have to perform for our needs and expectations."
That statement is demonstrably false. Plenty peeps vape happily with NiMH.

Which came first -- the chicken or the egg? Is there so little mention of NiMH batteries on this forum and on others because they are used by such a small minority? Or, do forums discourage the use of NiMH and ensure only a minority will consider them by [perpetuating] the lie that Li-ion batteries are the best and safest?

Doesn't matter is Li ion batteries are the best for vaping; right now, there is not an alternative for us vapers; what we need to figure out is HOW to make use of the consumer available NiMH batteries in our existing investment. There do not seem to be any 18650 4volt NiMH battery stacks available. Perhaps there is a workaround with some standard NiMH disk battery?

Once vapers start modding their own batteries, the industry will follow; that's how it's been.

Forget theory, let's get PRACTICAL

 

[AndriaD]

Ha! My BF's mom was telling us about these HUGE rats that dug around in the dumpster at her apartment. We finally saw one - it was an opossum! LOL

ROFLMAO!!! I once ran in the house hollering about this "awful, hairy rat"... my husband told me it was an opossum... I felt so dumb... but hey, I never saw one that wasn't flattened on the road before...

Andria

 

[edyle]

"You're actually the only person I know who still uses them."
Have you never heard-tell of the Puck mods and those inspired by them?
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-variable-voltage-4aa-box-mod-easy-cheap.html

A single AA:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJxoLm8xitU

If I get an itaste VV3, maybe I can mod it to use a puck type power source. Or maybe put them side by side with wires connected and wrap with duct tape for starters, and end up with a box shaped mod resembling an mvp.

 

[MorpheusPA]

"charges a bit" as in when the battery is pretty much dead anyway and CAN ONLY "charge a bit".

1: Eventually, battery life on a non-passthrough is so short you just toss the battery: how short would that be?

For me, in Really Cheap SOB land, I'd probably devote it to home use only. Its travel locales would be office and couch, so for me, call it 200 mA (you just carry two with you around the house, which for me is trivial).

2: Eventually, battery life on a passthrough is so short that you overstep the battery capacity faster than it can charge back up.
A whole lot shorter than 1 above.

Arguable. I'm a chain vaper, so I can suck down mAh like nobody's business. 1,300 mAh new lasts me 5 to 6 hours.

I should probably use my VAMO around the house, but I never get around to it.

If you're really an " incredibly cheap SOB" you'll at least TRY working it as a passthrough when it is otherwise dead.
All you really need for 1 vape is 2 amps for 5 seconds; that's 0.17 ampminutes = 170 mAminutes = 3 mAh.
seems to me you could take 1 vape a minute when your passthrough is all the way down to about 10 mAh.
A regular non-passthrough battery you'd probably toss long before that - maybe when it's down to 100 mAh.

I have. Right now, my battery in Position #3 (desk/house use only) has perhaps 300 mAh left, or it's lost 75% of its capacity. As a passthrough, I can drain it in 3 hours. As a stand-alone, I'm down to an hour and a half or so.

 

[Ryedan]

"He is using a 0.1 ohm coil at 1.2V, correct? So drawing around 12 amps and making 14 watts. What is the voltage drop like with these cells at this load with one or four batteries? How many mAh are the batteries and what is their maximum current output? What happens when they are pushed past that?"
I'm not a battery guru and not a sub-ohm cloud chaser. I'm new at vaping and have a lot to learn. Email to the video maker and googling for the data sheets would help you more that I could. Off the top of my head, AAs run about 2,000 mAh to 2700 mAh. His box with 4 in parallel would run about 8,000 to 10,800 mAh.

I hear ya Nikkel. I was hoping you could shed some light on NiMH battery technology that I did not know and I could learn something new.

Li-ion technology is improving all the time. Most of us already use batteries that will not burn (or explode) when they are shorted. Those are what I use in my mods and those are what we all suggest people buy for their PVs. I suspect in a little while most battery venting issues will be a thing of the past because of the new technology that is being developed for the automotive industry and is already showing up in our batteries. That is all li-ion technology.

 

[Coldrake]

Is there so little mention of NiMH batteries on this forum and on others because they are used by such a small minority? Or, do forums discourage the use of NiMH and ensure only a minority will consider them by [perpetuating] the lie that Li-ion batteries are the best and safest?

Neither. It's a secret. The secret of NiMH is here.

 

[ainews]

I mean that sucker sounded like someone fired a gun in my house! Scared the hell out of me. Have no ides why this happened. I'll try to get some pictures. It was on fire and everything. Just a simple kgo battery on the charger. Thank goodness it was in my bedroom. I had thought about charging from my computer while checking out the ecf. Sure am glad I didn't. I don't think I'd have a face left if I had. Please be careful everyone! Dang it now I only have two batteries. Did I mention this scared the hell out of me?

nice cheap asian batterys do that sometimes. it's called a runaway.
the chemical reaction just goes nuts randomly
and the cheap ones dont have any much protection from this.
a good battery will have a circut that prevents this.
wait until you get one that goes nuts in your backpack.

 

[Baditude]

Link to an ECF thread:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/battery-mods/438832-lets-talk-about-nimh-stop-all-hating.html

Ok, I read the first couple of pages from that link and get a jist of the issues. My thoughts are in agreement with Thrasher's:

What I see a lot of on ECF is "NiMH batteries aren't high drain capable" which is absolutely false. I can buy a cheap pack of 1400mAh Energizer NiMH AA cells from Walmart and get 2C out of them all day long. There's a completely legitimate place for NiMH batteries in vaping, one that is underutilized, IMO.

and 2 amps is considered high drain?

Mah doesn't mean a lot if it is over the huge voltage range like lithium ions are...

this is why VV mods have voltage regulation so Mah will ultimately matter. not so much in a mech

The significant disadvantage of NiMH batteries is the high rate of self-discharge; NiMH batteries lose up to 20% of their charge on the first day and up to 4% per day of storage after that. In 2005, a low self-discharge (...) variant was developed. ... NiMH batteries significantly lower self-discharge, but at the cost of lowering capacity by about 20%.

There is an inherent risk with NiMH chemistry that overcharging will cause a buildup of hydrogen, causing the cell to rupture. Therefore, cells have a vent. Hydrogen will be emitted from the vent in the event of serious overcharging
A complete discharge of a battery can result in one or more cells going into polarity reversal, which can cause permanent damage to those cells. This situation can occur in the common arrangement of four AA cells in series in a digital camera, where one will be completely discharged before the others due to small differences in capacity among the cells. When this happens, the good cells will start to drive the discharged cell in reverse, which can cause permanent damage to that cell

while they may have a place and i welcome any and all advances in vaping, now we are talking about a whole new set of rules and electronics. in most cases a drop from 1.4 to 1v is not enough to interest people into using these whereas 4.2 to 3.2 is much more time.

unless they can come up with a single cell with superior Mah i do not see adoption by the masses, noone in this day and age (outside of the few modders and such) are ready to start carrying packs of batteries again and have a tube mode the width of a 4d maglight.

then you get into the newer subohm vapors well into the 20+ watt range and they arent going to want a battery that runs 2 hours.

while Li-Mn may not be perfect it is more stable and suitable and chemistry developments are now seeing batteries with 18 amp peaks and now one with a 30amp discharge. with all the scares going on no one will want to hear that a cell in a pack, no matter how small the actual risk, may go into a venting situation from simply being overdischarged.

 

[Ryedan]

"Three 18650 NiMH 4.8v batteries used back to back couldn't last a entire day. In comparison, an AW 18650 IMR lasts me an entire day."
Most reports I've seen claim 4AAA last a day, and 4AA last several days. The discharge curve for NiMH is flatter than Li-ion.

I thought you were using them Nikkel. 4 AAA batteries last a day of vaping ... try it. I really doubt it will work for you.

 

[MorpheusPA]

I've seen that video before, but I don't know anything about these batteries. Explain some things here please.

He is using a 0.1 ohm coil at 1.2V, correct? So drawing around 12 amps and making 14 watts. What is the voltage drop like with these cells at this load with one or four batteries? How many mAh are the batteries and what is their maximum current output? What happens when they are pushed past that?

Really curious how these puppies perform but never really researched them.

5 to 10 amps is the effective natural limit of NiMH batteries for the most part--the chemical reactions can't go much faster, unless the battery is hot. Which is a bad idea in and of itself. At that point, voltage is dipping severely, I'd guess (without running a test) it's around 0.9 per cell at that point. The range depends on battery quality, build, and size.

Cells could be built with higher amp limits, but for the most part, they aren't. You'd trade capacity and stability for output.

For AA batteries, mAh varies widely; I have a dozen or so here that I use for very light-duty purposes in electronics projects that are rated at 200 mAh. My better batteries are in the 2,500 mAh range. Like any battery, NiMH suffers from capacity degradation due to age and number of recharges, but NiMH isn't quite so touchy about storage.

One thing NiMH does suffer from is poor charge retention when stored for any length of time. Battery University has a great run-down on this, but unless you have low self discharge batteries they're not the sort of thing you want to sit on a shelf for a period before use.