Panasonic NCR18650A, Panasonic CGR18650CH

[Island Vapor]

I have been looking at different batteries for my hybrid.I found the Panasonic Li-ion NCR18650A , Panasonic CGR18650CH 18650.Does any one have any experience with these batts?Thanks for any help and have an awesome weekend

 

[Yelsew Skraps]

I have these CGR18650CH in use in a lavatube, work well. I got them from orbtronic

 

[Island Vapor]

Thanks.Have you compared them with any of your old batts?Do they last longer

 

[Yelsew Skraps]

Seem to last a bit longer that the 1600 mah 18650 AWs that came with the lavatube. They should too as they are 2200 mah I do believe.

 

[misterkai]

I have these CGR18650CH in use in a lavatube, work well. I got them from orbtronic

I am curious as to why you chose those (with 2250 mAh) as opposed to these which are 3100 mAh? I see that the ones you bought are high drain (10 amp discharge rate) but the ones I linked to can handle 6 amps, and if I am not mistaken, the Lavatube has the safety cutoff at 2.5 amps which would make a 10 amp discharge useless...

 

[Yelsew Skraps]

I bought these as someone had a photo or 2 showing them fitting in the lavatube, so I based alot of my decision on that. I saw the 3100 ones a bit later and will likely order some of them in the future. The 10 amp discharge element is a factor just from the failed limiter aspect for me, if the limiter fails, and the device was to get "stuck", then it might offer a little time to react in a worst case scenario of course that is a lot of ifs and not an expected occurrence. All told I would have probably ordered the 3100 batts had I waited to make the purchase, but of course waiting is not a trait I seem to practice very well.

 

[misterkai]

I bought these as someone had a photo or 2 showing them fitting in the lavatube, so I based alot of my decision on that. I saw the 3100 ones a bit later and will likely order some of them in the future. The 10 amp discharge element is a factor just from the failed limiter aspect for me, if the limiter fails, and the device was to get "stuck", then it might offer a little time to react in a worst case scenario of course that is a lot of ifs and not an expected occurrence. All told I would have probably ordered the 3100 batts had I waited to make the purchase, but of course waiting is not a trait I seem to practice very well.

Thanks for the explanation. I am not good at waiting either. I ordered some NCR18650A batteries from Orbtronic yesterday for my father and I who both use Lavatubes, and when I saw your post, I thought maybe I had missed something and made a mistake...

 

[WillyB]

.. I ordered some NCR18650A batteries from Orbtronic yesterday for my father and I who both use Lavatubes, and when I saw your post, I thought maybe I had missed something and made a mistake...

I think you did make a mistake with the protected NCR18650A (over rated batteries anyway). The LT's are made to fit un-protected batteries (~65mm in length) like the CGR18650CH, which is what you should have bought.

Many of the Panasonic 3100, protection circuit added cells are 68+mm long.

 

[misterkai]

I think you did make a mistake with the protected NCR18650A (over rated batteries anyway). The LT's are made to fit un-protected batteries (~65mm in length) like the CGR18650CH, which is what you should have bought.

Many of the Panasonic 3100, protection circuit added cells are 68+mm long.

The NCR18650A's I bought aren't protected (according to the description) and they are also listed as being 65.2 mm, which I think is just fine. The spring in the Lavatube should provide at least that much tolerance. Also, I found a link with some pretty comprehensive tests that show that they are NOT overrated. Please check out this link and tell me what you think. Thanks!

 

[NC_Fog]

I bought 4 CGR18650CH and a XTAR WP2 II charger for my Silver Bullet with a 1.5ohm atty. Couldn't be happier. I was using AW IC 3100mah but the performance was lacking due to the discharge rate(didn't hit near as hard).

 

[Island Vapor]

Thanks for the info everyone.

 

[WillyB]

... Also, I found a link with some pretty comprehensive tests that show that they are NOT overrated. Please check out this link and tell me what you think. Thanks!

My mistake on the un protected.

When exactly does the LT need charging, the voltage? I'm assuming it's in the ~3.5V range when it starts it's warning?

We are vapers, Panasonic's 2900/3100 mAh are based on a 2.5V cut-off. Will anyone be actually dragging them that low?

This is an undemanding 1A drain test.

The top is a 2600mAh Sanyo, the Bottom a Panasonic 2900mAh.

Notice how quickly the Panasonic drops to 3.5V, ~ 1600mAh. While the Sanyo gets to ~~2400mAh. And at 3.25V the Sanyo still beats the so-called 2900 Panasonic.

Let's pound them both at a healthy 3A drain.

Lotsa useless mAh on that AW/Panasonic 2900.

Food for thought.

 

[misterkai]

My mistake on the un protected.

When exactly does the LT need charging, the voltage? I'm assuming it's in the ~3.5V range when it starts it's warning?

We are vapers, Panasonic's 2900/3100 mAh are based on a 2.5V cut-off. Will anyone be actually dragging them that low?

This is an undemanding 1A drain test.

The top is a 2600mAh Sanyo, the Bottom a Panasonic 2900mAh.

Notice how quickly the Panasonic drops to 3.5V, ~ 1600mAh. While the Sanyo gets to ~~2400mAh. And at 3.25V the Sanyo still beats the so-called 2900 Panasonic.

Let's pound them both at a healthy 3A drain.

Lotsa useless mAh on that AW/Panasonic 2900.

Food for thought.

I think the LT stops firing when the batteries reach 3.3 volts, but I'm not exactly sure. I personally never discharge mine below 3.5 volts.

I'm no battery expert by any means, but I think you may be slightly misinterpreting those charts you posted... Regardless, none of the charts you posted are even for the same batteries that I ordered. You can see the correct charts for the batteries I purchased here. Furthermore, I'm not sure what you mean by "AW/Panasonic" as those are two entirely different brands. Also, the batteries I bought are Li-ion NNP, not Li-poly like the batteries shown in the third chart you posted. Li-poly batteries have a much higher risk of exploding if overcharged. Yikes! Finally, the batteries I bought are advertised at 3100mAh and as shown on the page I linked in my earlier post (and again here) they have been tested and verified.

I am quite confident that I have purchased some of the best, most powerful and longest lasting 18650's on the market right now... Thank you for presenting some interesting info though!

 

[WillyB]

Everybody and their brother re-wraps Panasonic cells. Anytime you see 2900 or 3100mAh it's a Panasonic under the wrapper. AW, Redilast, Callie, Xtar I could go on and on.

There is no real significant difference between the 2900 and 3100mAh. Those charts you linked are manufacturer stuff. The ones I posted are by users.

Even by your Panasonic chart you'll note it crosses the 3.5V @3A (I'm assuming the green trace) at about ~1600mAh.

Not worth arguing about, you got a decent battery. If I was going for a non-high drain I'd probably opt for this one.

Sanyo 18650 2600mAh Li-ion Battery(One) [18650 Li-ion battery] - $6.35 : Led Flashlight-International Outdoor Store

 

[misterkai]

I just got my new batts, so I'll see what kind of lifespan I get out of them. I'll probably give the ones you suggested a shot next time I order. Even though they are lower mAh, it looks like there would be a longer usable period for the LT if am understanding correctly. Also, do you really think there is a benefit with using high drain batteries for the LT, even with its 2.5 amp limiter? If so, which would you recommend?

I do apologize if I came across as confrontational about this. It's the Leo in me...

Anyhow, thanks for helping me to learn!

 

[Strontium]

I just got my new batts, so I'll see what kind of lifespan I get out of them. I'll probably give the ones you suggested a shot next time I order. Even though they are lower mAh, it looks like there would be a longer usable period for the LT if am understanding correctly. Also, do you really think there is a benefit with using high drain batteries for the LT, even with its 2.5 amp limiter? If so, which would you recommend?

I do apologize if I came across as confrontational about this. It's the Leo in me...

Anyhow, thanks for helping me to learn!

I would not recommend those Sanyo unprotected batteries for vaping.

Once short circuit happens, you are in very dangerous situation, because those Sanyo cells are regular li-ion chemistry. These cells can be good for some other things, but not for vaping.

As I know your Panasonic 3100mAh are equipped with CID, PTC, and HRL protections. Many abbreviations, and I am not here to confuse you. Long story short: if short happens Panasonic 18650 ncr cell will disconnect itself from circuit (PTC), and HRL will prevent cell from overheating.


If you really want to get every single volt from 18650 cell (4.2V down to 3.3V), then the winner in 3 Amp category is Panasonic high drain cgr18650ch.

 

[matador]

So do the Panasonic CGR18650CH batteries have a protection circuit? and do they need a special charger? I use a TR-001 charger for my ultrafire 18650's...

 

[Freddie]

The Panasonic CGR18650CH-2250 mah IMR High Drains are the BEST 18650 batts on the Vaping market today period! It is a PROVEN FACT through actual TESTS vs. the AW and Sanyo 18650 batts., the Panasonic CGR18650CH IMR's SURPASSED and OUT-PERFORMED the AW and Sanyo! So the ANSWER is YES they are SUPERIOR and the BEST 18650 batts. over the AW and Sanyo and in FACT the SANYO came in SECOND! Also AW's are actually PANASONIC's just with the AW stamp on them! They(the PANASONIC CGR18650CH IMR High Drains) are made with a BETTER QUALITY CELL than the AW and SANYO, that being said, HANDS DOWN THE BEST 18650 batt. for MODS PERIOD!

 

[WillyB]

I just got my new batts, so I'll see what kind of lifespan I get out of them. I'll probably give the ones you suggested a shot next time I order. Even though they are lower mAh, it looks like there would be a longer usable period for the LT if am understanding correctly. Also, do you really think there is a benefit with using high drain batteries for the LT, even with its 2.5 amp limiter? If so, which would you recommend?

No man we are just talking.

the LT, even with its 2.5 amp limiter?

From everything I've seen the limit is actually a bit less and can vary with the cells voltage. Those booster-step down chips are a little odd.

Maybe you'll find this interesting. It's from the datasheet of the chip they use.

Now I don't know if this is exactly how the LT operates but you can see how the AMPs vary quite a bit.

The black trace is a 4.5V output. I've marked in red the voltage range of out batteries.

As far as your question this should give a general ( but not perfect) example of what is needed.

Online Conversion - Ohm's Law Calculator

We will use this. 4.9V / 2Ω atty -> 2.5A /12W. Now if we were using a step-down regulator that would be pretty close. The LT has to boost the voltage to get there though.

So lets take say 4V and shoot for the same 12W. Plunk the 12W and 4V into that calc it now reads 3A. Do it again with 3.5V and we now see the cell needs to provide 3.5A (and that's not figuring in the additional effiency loss, ~15%?). You get the general idea a single boosted cell has to work much harder than than a pair of stacked cells.

Strontium

I would not recommend those Sanyo unprotected batteries for vaping. Once short circuit happens, you are in very dangerous situation, because those Sanyo cells are regular li-ion chemistry. These cells can be good for some other things, but not for vaping.

As I know your Panasonic 3100mAh are equipped with CID, PTC, and HRL protections. Many abbreviations, and I am not here to confuse you. Long story short: if short happens Panasonic 18650 ncr cell will disconnect itself from circuit (PTC), and HRL will prevent cell from overheating.

Well you realize we are discussing unprotected cells, I have no idea where you come up with the fact that somehow the Sanyo is lacking something that is only found in the Panasonic.

Here's a pic from one of Sanyo's Li-Ion tech sheets.

Are these the "Many abbreviations" enough? Have no fear if a Sanyo cell is shorted it's PTC will do exactly what the Panasonic would do as will the Sanyo's CID.

Freddie

The Panasonic CGR18650CH-2250 mah IMR High Drains are the BEST 18650 batts on the Vaping market today period! It is a PROVEN FACT through actual TESTS vs. the AW and Sanyo 18650 batts., the Panasonic CGR18650CH IMR's SURPASSED and OUT-PERFORMED the AW and Sanyo! So the ANSWER is YES they are SUPERIOR and the BEST 18650 batts. over the AW and Sanyo and in FACT the SANYO came in SECOND! Also AW's are actually PANASONIC's just with the AW stamp on them! They(the PANASONIC CGR18650CH IMR High Drains) are made with a BETTER QUALITY CELL than the AW and SANYO, that being said, HANDS DOWN THE BEST 18650 batt. for MODS PERIOD!

First off Panasonic does not make an IMR/LiMn2O4 chemistry cell.

Please post some of tests of which you speak. All this anecdotal BEST crap is getting old as is your caps lock key.

Also AW's are actually PANASONIC's just with the AW stamp on them!

You sure about that? AW has a rather extensive line of batteries. I didn't think Panasonic was into 10440, 14500, 16340, 17670, 18350, 18490s... they aren't actually.

 

[<---cop]

I would not recommend those Sanyo unprotected batteries for vaping.

I run these Sanyos in my eGoT mods which have "apparent" electrical protection and glued in bases that would blow off in case of a vent. They are excellent.

I also run the Panasonic 18650 2250mAh IMRs in my Silver Bullet. Both VERY good in my hands on experience.