FDA Post-hearing reactions?

[DaveP]

There's also an obvious campaign against Aspartame sweetened drinks vs regular soft drinks. Is High Fructose Corn Syrup and its immediate route to the blood stream better than artificial sweeteners?

I don't know about that little argument, but I'm confident that there's a wide gap between tobacco cigarettes and ecigs. Nicotine isn't particularly harmful, although its not a desirable intake unless you are transitioning from cancer sticks, but it's a dang nice alternative to smoking. Yes, there might be some undesirable effect from constant inhalation of PG and VG, but I worry much less about that than I did those 2000+ chemicals in tobacco, including 40 some odd KNOWN carcinogens.

When I'm questioned about how ecigs work and their level of safety I explain the workings and tell people to read the labels on the products they ingest and rub on their bodies. I tell them to look for propylene glycol and glycerin. It's there far more than they know. That only leaves nicotine and flavorings as bad guys and we know they are USP grade products that are approved for use by the FDA.

 

[Stosh]

From what I understand, there are multiple methods for extraction, some more complex than others..

I'm sure the typical results of each are varied, too..


But there are some relatively easier ones that many people could DIY...

Soaking tobacco for nicotine and flavor - A chemists' perspective

NETs Versus WTA

 

[DaveP]

Soaking tobacco for nicotine and flavor - A chemists' perspective

NETs Versus WTA

I've always wondered about what actually comes with the nic and flavor from soaking tobacco to obtain ejuice additives. Do you get some nasty components when you do that or do the carcinogens only materialize when it's burned? It's one reason I've never ordered any WTA. I recently ordered some of what used to be called Dekang Tobacco from my supplier and received the same bottle with a vendor label on it. It tastes really good, but you have to shake it up before you add it to a tank. There's a brownish dark residue that adheres to the top of the bottle when it sits for a while. That stuff obviously isn't emulsifying. It also seems to kill a coil quickly.

 

[Traver]

While I agree that most of us on this forum will be affected in a negative way. The fact remains that the majority of vapers are using cig-likes. how will they be affected?

It may not be ignorance as much as for many long time vapers, the FDA scare is the "boy who cried wolf", having survived the many past "scares and imminent regulations". Many have nic in the freezer from some years old FDA scares, I know I do.

Then you have the new, under a year vapers, and most don't understand how or why the FDA is trying to regulate e-cigs, or the history of what the FDA has tried in the past.

It's the perfect storm, and those who disbelieve the harm the FDA can impose on the industry seem to be in the majority...

 

[Sirius]

While I agree that most of us on this forum will be affected in a negative way. The fact remains that the majority of vapers are using cig-likes. how will they be affected?

BT makes cigalikes -- that is why in no way am I worried about a ban on nicotine juice. If they can get it so can we for DIY.

 

[Traver]

DaveP, I think you should be a bit careful about making blanket statements like nicotine is not desirable intake unless you are transitioning from cancer sticks.

There is evidence that for some people with mental disorders nicotine helps maintain their mental stability. There are many people on this forum who will swear that they need nicotine to function normally.

It may also be that at least a large minority of the smokers that still smoking can't quit because they don't function well without the nicotine.

There's also an obvious campaign against Aspartame sweetened drinks vs regular soft drinks. Is High Fructose Corn Syrup and its immediate route to the blood stream better than artificial sweeteners?

I don't know about that little argument, but I'm confident that there's a wide gap between tobacco cigarettes and ecigs. Nicotine isn't particularly harmful, although its not a desirable intake unless you are transitioning from cancer sticks, but it's a dang nice alternative to smoking. Yes, there might be some undesirable effect from constant inhalation of PG and VG, but I worry much less about that than I did those 2000+ chemicals in tobacco, including 40 some odd KNOWN carcinogens.

When I'm questioned about how ecigs work and their level of safety I explain the workings and tell people to read the labels on the products they ingest and rub on their bodies. I tell them to look for propylene glycol and glycerin. It's there far more than they know. That only leaves nicotine and flavorings as bad guys and we know they are USP grade products that are approved for use by the FDA.

 

[Sirius]

DaveP, I think you should be a bit careful about making blanket statements like nicotine is not desirable intake unless you are transitioning from cancer sticks.

There is evidence that for some people with mental disorders nicotine helps maintain their mental stability. There are many people on this forum who will swear that they need nicotine to function normally.

It may also be that at least a large minority of the smokers that still smoking can't quit because they don't function well without the nicotine.

I know without my daily dose of nicotine it's not too long before I'm like...........

 

[zoiDman]

Brief Intermission:

If you want to see Someone who Did more than Just Talk About Things, and Actualy Took Matters into his Own Hands to Do Something, Check out this Thread...

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...really-easy-people-do-something-positive.html

Maybe People could Pop in to Say "Good Job". Or even Get Active and do Something Similar?

End of Brief Intermission:

 

[Traver]

iF the FDA makes nicotine a controlled substance and illegal to sell except to companies registered with the FDA how will you get it? They have the power and and there is good chance they will ban it's sale for everyone else..

BT makes cigalikes -- that is why in no way am I worried about a ban on nicotine juice. If they can get it so can we for DIY.

 

[Sirius]

iF the FDA makes nicotine a controlled substance and illegal to sell except to companies registered with the FDA how will you get it? They have the power and and there is good chance they will ban it's sale for everyone else..

The FDA doe's NOT make laws..they only regulate the existing ones.

 

[zoiDman]

I like your Post Traver not because I like the Concept. Your Concept is Wrong.

But because it is a Distinct Possibility the FDA will Control Nicotine with a Very Tight Fist. And what I would do if I Really Wanted to Control Nicotine / e-Liquids.

And the FDA Really Wants to Control Nicotine / e-Liquids.

 

[zoiDman]

The FDA doe's NOT make laws..they only regulate the existing ones.

I believe the FDA has Enough Regulatory Power to make the Sale of Liquid Nicotine Procedural and Cost Prohibitive to the Average B&M.

Also, Does your State require Any Special License to sell Tobacco Products? Mine Does. And it is No Slam Dunk that you can get one.

Also, Does your City require Any Special Business License to sell Tobacco Products? Mine Does. And it is No Slam Dunk that you can get one.

 

[Sirius]

I like your Post Traver not because I like the Concept.

But because it is a Distinct Possibility. And what I would do if I Really Wanted to Control Nicotine / e-Liquids.

And the FDA Really Wants to Control Nicotine / e-Liquids.

zoiDman -- If Congress passes another drug law and classifies nicotine a Schedule V Drug they would have to totally re-write the existing drug laws.
Resources - Controlled Substance Schedules
Highly doubtful that will be done.

 

[Sirius]

I believe the FDA has Enough Regulatory Power to make the Sale of Liquid Nicotine Procedural and Cost Prohibitive to the Average B&M.

Also, Does your State require Any Special License to sell Tobacco Products? Mine Does. And it is No Slam Dunk that you can get one.

Also, Does your City require Any Special Business License to sell Tobacco Products? Mine Does. And it is No Slam Dunk that you can get one.

Well you are talking about State Tax Revenue Tobacco Laws now. And yes, that is the case here in Georgia.

 

[Sirius]

Effective January 29, 2014: Additional Requirements for Alcohol, Tobacco, COAM, and Motor Fuel Registrations and Renewals. Click here for more information.https://etax.dor.ga.gov/alcohol/alc_forms.aspx

 

[zoiDman]

Well you are talking about State Tax Revenue Tobacco Laws now. And yes, that is the case here in Georgia.

Effective January 29, 2014: Additional Requirements for Alcohol, Tobacco, COAM, and Motor Fuel Registrations and Renewals. Click here for more information.https://etax.dor.ga.gov/alcohol/alc_forms.aspx

Yeah... California has some Requirements Also for Selling Tobacco Products. This is a Brief Overview.

http://www.boe.ca.gov/pdf/pub78.pdf

And those Requirements have to be Fulfilled BEFORE you can Check the Box on your City Business License Application that you Intend to Sell "Tobacco Products".

BTW - If the Place of Sale is Anywhere that is Zoned as Residential, it is Automatically Rejected. So Bye-Bye Mom and Pops working out of their Home.

 

[zoiDman]

zoiDman -- If Congress passes another drug law and classifies nicotine a Schedule V Drug they would have to totally re-write the existing drug laws.
Resources - Controlled Substance Schedules
Highly doubtful that will be done.

Yeah... I edited my Post because I didn't want it to Appear that the FDA has the Power to Make Law. Or that Nicotine in our case was being considered as a "Drug" and e-Cigarettes were a Medical Device.

That was the Key Point why the FDA Lost in Court way back When. And how we as Vapers came to know the word "Deeming".

Thank You for Pointing it out.

 

[Sirius]

Yeah... I edited my Post because I didn't want it to Appear that the FDA has the Power to Make Law. Or that Nicotine in our case was being considered as a "Drug" and e-Cigarettes were a Medical Device.

That was the Key Point why the FDA Lost in Court way back When. And how we as Vapers came to know the word "Deeming".

Thank You for Pointing it out.

No problemo Zoid -- Hey we are all in this together. Need to stick together so congress knows we mean business imo.

 

[zoiDman]

No problemo Zoid -- Hey we are all in this together. Need to stick together so congress knows we mean business imo.

Yes.

Now is the Time to Get Up and Start Writing e-Mail to Members of Congress, the FDA, the CDC and the News Media.

Talking on the ECF is a Great Past Time. But it Doesn't do Anything to Inform the People who Now are Going to Change Our Lives about how we Feel.

 

[Bobbilly]

zoiDman -- If Congress passes another drug law and classifies nicotine a Schedule V Drug they would have to totally re-write the existing drug laws.
Resources - Controlled Substance Schedules
Highly doubtful that will be done.

Not sure what schedule 5 is? However I guess the question is whether public health is more important than having to make a law. Is caffeine or alcohol under that? I can't recall nicotine being an illegal substance