Pre-vet workshop thread

[jj2]

Morning CES.

The rules (from jj's link) say this:


Are there any other rules posted elsewhere, and do they say the same thing?

I haven't been to jOker's contest page but that is it on the FAQs page. Let me go look.

 

[AttyPops]

As long as j0ker understands that we're not changing the rules (although we'd like to..that's another issue and it's been said "no"). We want to make sure everyone understands how the forum software "turns" people since that concept..."when you turn"... is part of the rules.

 

[jj2]

Basically it defers to FAQs

"All 2012 PreVets who wish to enter need to go PreVet FAQs and complete Question 3. "What steps do I take to participate?" to become eligible."

So Atty, I will work with you in every way that I can. I will keep an eye out on what you all decide or just let me know.

 

[AttyPops]

Thanks for looking that up jj. We just need to make sure we're doing the proper thing. So j0ker can help us figure it out. It's not a matter of cooperation really, it's a matter of everyone being on the same page... the page is "written" by j0ker. We're not changing the rules, we're trying to follow then properly.

 

[whiskey]

As soon as (if) J0ker gives his input here, and depending on the outcome of his input, I think its best to find a place for the list within about a week...sorry to put a time limit on it but I can see where this seems to be going.

 

[tiburonfirst]

important! don't lose this!

pre-bookings for august

paislia - 8-21 (leap year adjusted)
DoubleHelix 8-28 (leap year adjusted) - Theme>>Cartoon Characters from your childhood

pm it to yourself or whatever else you can think of to keep it safe ......

 

[markfm]

As an impartial observer, it looks like the killer rule has been the Grand Prize/online party thing. It sounds like it's been impacting a bunch of really good, friendly, gung-ho people, turning a fun thing into a task, with the volunteers buying into stress that they "have to" be there if a pre-vet shows. Getting generally happy, high post, helpful types burnt-out/fighting certainly has to be 180 degrees off of a valid ECF goal.

Frankly, I would suggest that yes, rules can (and should) change, when it is clear that the result of the rule is harming good people and causing visible fights between vets.

Make the gotta-be-online-yada-yada, a wonderful concept but clearly not doing good things, into a pure random.org draw at the end of year (or Jan 2013). A rule change that is more-inclusive is generally viable.

Just a thought, but after all the contest rules weren't some divine revelation.

 

[tiburonfirst]

thank you, mark, and with your permission i'm quoting part of your pm

It needs to be made blazingly clear that the regulars will feel zero, zilch, obligation going forward, and that if they wish the rule to remain it is totally on their shoulders to scrounge people up, else make a rule change

please, note - the bold is not from mark but from me. i have always felt the ones imposing the rules should be responsible for seeing them through. only my love for prevets and the team have kept me accepting the pressures for as long as i have.
i no longer want to feel obligated but enjoy pvt if and when i can.

 

[whiskey]

thank you, mark, and with your permission i'm quoting part of your pm



please, note - the bold is not from mark but from me. i have always felt the ones imposing the rules should be responsible for seeing them through. only my love for prevets and the team have kept me accepting the pressures for as long as i have.
i no longer want to feel obligated but enjoy pvt if and when i can.

And I will quote you both saying I agree 100%

 

[AttyPops]

Power failures here... on and off after storms. On now, obviously. May stay on. Just an FYI. I'll stay on and monitor the discussion if I can.

 

[tiburonfirst]

atty, not much more to discuss. you might want to try a pm to joker explaining the pressures of the contest rules exerted on prevets and the team alike.
the rules are written very ambiguously and could be interpreted differently with his consent.

 

[whiskey]

important! don't lose this!

pre-bookings for august

paislia - 8-21 (leap year adjusted)
DoubleHelix 8-28 (leap year adjusted) - Theme>>Cartoon Characters from your childhood

pm it to yourself or whatever else you can think of to keep it safe ......

Done............

 

[whiskey]

atty, not much more to discuss. you might want to try a pm to joker explaining the pressures of the contest rules exerted on prevets and the team alike.
the rules are written very ambiguously and could be interpreted differently with his consent.

I have also sent him a request to read the last 3 pages of this thread to better understand whats going on.

 

[Katya]

Thanks for looking that up jj. We just need to make sure we're doing the proper thing. So j0ker can help us figure it out. It's not a matter of cooperation really, it's a matter of everyone being on the same page... the page is "written" by j0ker. We're not changing the rules, we're trying to follow then properly.

Sorry, Atty, but who's we?

I can only speak for myself, and I would like that rule about avatar parties changed, because it is not only a hardship on all participants, but also ufairly targets those prevets who hold steady jobs, have kids, take care of elderly family members, travel, or serve in the military--no, jj, not everybody can take a day off to celebrate their turning vet on ECF. I have felt this way from day one but went along with the group, albeit grudgingly, because I was always told that, "We, you, can discuss this to death But it isn't going to change."

Well, I think this is our best chance to change it. And I wish to be heard.

I offered a possible solution here:

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-pre-vet-workshop-thread-113.html#post6417814

And an example of how unfair this rule is to some prevets here:

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-pre-vet-workshop-thread-113.html#post6417889

As for your plans to circumvent/twist/bend the rule by having prevets not log on at their designated time, it's opening another can of worms. Many of them can't even get their regular turning time right, what with different time zones and such. You have no idea how many times we sat there late at night sending PMs to people who got that time wrong. We're going to have to spend hours explaining to every single one of them what exactly needs to be done, and what if they make a mistake? I really don't want to go there.

As an impartial observer, it looks like the killer rule has been the Grand Prize/online party thing. It sounds like it's been impacting a bunch of really good, friendly, gung-ho people, turning a fun thing into a task, with the volunteers buying into stress that they "have to" be there if a pre-vet shows. Getting generally happy, high post, helpful types burnt-out/fighting certainly has to be 180 degrees off of a valid ECF goal.

Frankly, I would suggest that yes, rules can (and should) change, when it is clear that the result of the rule is harming good people and causing visible fights between vets.

Make the gotta-be-online-yada-yada, a wonderful concept but clearly not doing good things, into a pure random.org draw at the end of year (or Jan 2013). A rule change that is more-inclusive is generally viable.

Just a thought, but after all the contest rules weren't some divine revelation.

Thank you, markfm.

[Emphasis mine.]

 

[Meggers]

I'll put something in. I like simple. If...IF...it were up to me, I would have everyone turn on their day, pick their time and slap an on off switch(Someone going in and giving them "rights")on that Welcome thread. But...I like things simple. Probably cause...I am.

 

[tiburonfirst]

simple it can't be, meggers! but atty's suggestion of postponing the turning if there is a time conflict on the vet's or team's side would help; we've done it before.
and it would be much easier to send a pm explaining how it can be done than telling a vet he/she forfeits a chance for the grand prize.
and we have to face it - most people participate because of the contest. the old days are gone, tweety, when our company and good wishes were enough for the prevets.
which leaves the one caveat in jj's rules

To get into the Big Grand Prize drawing, you must have an Avatar Party and you have to participate and you have to be on the PreVet thread when you turn and when the fireworks go off!!!
If by chance the forum is down (not your internet) when you were suppose to turn during an Avatar Party, you will be Eligible for the Big Grand Prize.

to me, there seems to be a little leeway but not much. not signing on is closely related to the internet being down. this really needs joker's input.

 

[tiburonfirst]

tweety, i believe one of your links above is the wrong one. not that it matters, we all have come across examples .....

 

[Katya]

My links go to the right posts--for me. Anyway, posts #1127 and 1128.

Thanks, Tibs, for always looking out for me.

As for other things, I have said my piece and now I shall (forever ) hold my peace.

 

[tiburonfirst]

yup - for you! your links always take me to the last page of the thread your aiming for!

and i agree, krazy deserves better. but so does the pvt team .......

 

[tiburonfirst]

PMs notifying PreVets that they are approaching veteran status will not be sent out. Members must make it to the PreVet thread on their own, or with the help of a friend.

Please read the First Post in the PreVet thread for additional information.

Welcome to the ECF Pre-Vet thread!

And, as an added bonus, celebrating your special day with us entitles you to an entry in the Veteran 2012 Contest!

You can find further information here:http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/contests/256629-veteran-2012-contest.html

Times for our turnings are all Eastern and looked up by an ECF Moderator.
Dates are checked by at least two people but, when dealing with different time zones and the forum software not recognizing leap year, mistakes can happen.

If you don't see yourself listed, or don't see a theme listed for your day and you want one, let us know.
Your presence on the PreVet thread is required if you requested an Avatar Party. Please, join us in advance of your turning time and enjoy the celebration


June


June 19 - Loveridden - (23:47 - 12:25 AM) Avatar Party: ''House'' & Characters {Fran}
Attn West Coast Crew - this turning will happen 9:25pm your time on the 18th
June 20 - Xaiver - (2:03 = 2:25 AM) Welcome thread: new version of Dr. Who pictures {Lost}
June 20 - Ever1ast - (11:48 - 12:25 PM) Welcome thread {CES}
June 21 - MrsCasey - (0:57 - 1:25 AM) Avatar Party: Crows and Butterflies {Katya}
Attn West Coast Crew - this turning will happen 10:25pm your time on the 20th
June 25 - VapingTurtle - (12:23 = 12:25 PM) Avatar Party: Turtles and Cowgirls {tib}


July

July 08 - carpedebass - (19:08 = 7:25 PM) *Avatar Party: Fishing and Pretty Women {Catt}
July 09 - rkayw - (23:28 = 12 25 AM ) Avatar Party: Blue Butterflies (Thyroid Awareness)
Attn West Coast Crew - this turning will happen 9:25 pm your time on the 8th
July 09 - LauraBolyard - (18:05 = 6:25 PM) Avatar Party: Her PhotoBucket pictures here in conjunction with baby polar animals{Whiskey}
July 11 - Jefferson62 - (14:04 = 2:25 PM) Avatar Party: Chihuahuas, Exotic Cars & Women {Whiskey}
July 13 - Shannon65 - (4:51 = 5:25 AM) Avatar Party : Chris Rene & his music
July 15 - bully mom - (20:31 = 9:25 PM) Avatar Party: Anything Bulldog {CES}
July 15 - milo hobo - (9:20 = 9:25 AM) Avatar Party: Meditation gardens/groves {Fran}
July 17 - JustaGuy - (21:30 = 10:25 PM) Avatar Party: Star-crossed lovers {Katya}
July 20 - Allazar - (6:22 = 6:25 AM) Avatar Party: Alphonse Mucha {Katya}
July 20 - Airborn3 - (18:57 = 7:25 PM) Avatar Party: Muscle cars {CES}
July 24 - Woody55 - (10:01 = 10:25 AM) Avatar Party: Sheriff Woody or ''anything Texan" {tib}
July 28 - Sundrinkr - (16:39 = 5:25 PM) Avatar Party: Funny,Jokes, and Quotes {JAG}
July 29 - krazynavybiker - (12:48 = 1:25 PM) Avatar Party: Girls on bikes {Meggers}

Please note Anniversaries & Birthdays are now kept separate from Pre-vet list