Protank MicroCoil Discussion!!

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chanelvaps

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I am sorry-I am using 1.78
this TOOL DIAMETER: #50 .0700"1.78MM
Don't listen to me I rarely know what I am talking about

Pretty close there channel, it would actually put me at a 9/8 wrap to get 2.0ohms with a .070 I.D.. But we're on the same page :)

vape On My Friends!

PS- Are you modifying your bases to fit that size .071?
 

crg31953

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So are you saying you are going to make one bigger? as in will not fit in the base?
I am too scared to veer off from what is working for me. 1.7 bit with 6-7 wraps.
Yes the I.D is very small though

Yup, on my original Kanger bases I can't even set a 5/64 tool in the slot to set the coil.
I always use the same size tool to set height so that I don't disturb the wind.
In order to do it properly I would have to grind the sides, but I'm not so sure about brass and e-liquid.

I have some Kanger style units coming from Lightning tomorrow. I want to check the dimensions on an aftermarket head.

I will post here on my findings.

vape On My Friends!


From A Galaxy Far Away
 

MacTechVpr

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MacTechVpr said:
The clearest advantage of a tensioned contact coil is simply that it's geometry can be carefully but rather easily maintained. And you cannot do this with a space wind at all.

There are two ways to localize a coil…its space or separation and direction from the coil (usually perpendicular) and the orientation of the coil's axis (up, down, diagonal, not parallel to posts, etc.). Your method E is time old. You need a mandrel to support the coil's geometry (of the same size or you change it's i.d.) to pull away from the posts and tension the leads. This too by the way can spoil the wind and pull end turns as readeuler described, along with torquing of the screws. That's fine, but to adjust the latter, the coil axis, you can't do a thing but pull on it or push on the leads both of which can result in coil spaghetti. Wonderful. Great wind. /sarc on

With a contact tension wind you have an element that's practically a solid. You can put pressure on it without mangling it provided the force is not greater than used to wind or tension it. So carefully.

The simple answer what simply can't be done with a spaced coil (unless you wan't to go dental specialist for a half hour or more) is to PUSH ON IT!

Yes ladies and gentlemen the space age technology of a plain ol' instrument screwdriver allows one to buttress and apply pressure to one end of the coil. Against which we do what? We PULL! We tension and position, or bend curve, etc. the lead at that end to our hearts content. Yikes, nothing could be simpler Holmes. That means we can pretty much set the coil orientation in spacing from posts and in the axis orientation all using the same instrument.

This tremendous advantage of a uniform coherent coil has been there for Protank t.m.c.'s from the get go. It's a basic of localization…balance the leads. It's not always clear how important it is. Difference in lead length and relative tension are commonly the cause of hot legs either by lead shorts or thermal faults, i.e. differences in resistance.

When this happens it should be observed and fixed at the set. Before final push up for termination and trimming of leads. The indication is an off center coil on the bit. Often we pull the mandrel and just localize it. If it's not too much. No biggie. We nudge it into place. But in doing so we may make the problem worse by putting even more tension on the lead that's pulling the coil sideways and making the other even more relaxed perhaps even bowing it (and creating a contact short or risking one).

What I point to is that buttressing one end say with a narrow flat head screwdriver or micro tweezers let's us simply adjust the lax lead. And we should by pulling it taught whenever we encounter that kind of lateral skew. It's a common problem in our builds as with any other device (uneven lead tension). And fairly easy to fix before the set.

Have at it and good luck.

Enjoy the vape!

:)
 

Mazinny

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I have purchased a couple iStick regulated mods ( 20 watts ). Love them. Tiny, barely larger than a Bic lighter. They work fine with my Kayfuns, Taifuns, Drippers etc...
Not with my aerotank bases though. Only seems to read the resistance on these when the connection is not tight ( i.e. when the pt is slightly wobbly ). As soon as the atomizer is tightened the resistance reads zero. When i loosen a litlle, the resistance jumps all over the place. When i loosen a little more, t reads the correct resistance. So in essence it works only when the connection is unstable ! Really frustrating.
 

chanelvaps

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Thank for that info Maz
I am sorry to hear it though. I was considering getting one but will think twice as the Pro-tank is def a regular in my rotation these days. Does the Taifun look funny on it? How a bout a pic?

I have purchased a couple iStick regulated mods ( 20 watts ). Love them. Tiny, barely larger than a Bic lighter. They work fine with my Kayfuns, Taifuns, Drippers etc...
Not with my aerotank bases though. Only seems to read the resistance on these when the connection is not tight ( i.e. when the pt is slightly wobbly ). As soon as the atomizer is tightened the resistance reads zero. When i loosen a litlle, the resistance jumps all over the place. When i loosen a little more, t reads the correct resistance. So in essence it works only when the connection is unstable ! Really frustrating.
 

cigatron

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I have purchased a couple iStick regulated mods ( 20 watts ). Love them. Tiny, barely larger than a Bic lighter. They work fine with my Kayfuns, Taifuns, Drippers etc...
Not with my aerotank bases though. Only seems to read the resistance on these when the connection is not tight ( i.e. when the pt is slightly wobbly ). As soon as the atomizer is tightened the resistance reads zero. When i loosen a litlle, the resistance jumps all over the place. When i loosen a little more, t reads the correct resistance. So in essence it works only when the connection is unstable ! Really frustrating.

Hey Maz, not surprised to hear you're having issues only with the AT. It's the only atty you listed that uses compressible rubber grommets?
Hanger maybe?

:)cig
 
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Mazinny

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Thank for that info Maz
I am sorry to hear it though. I was considering getting one but will think twice as the Pro-tank is def a regular in my rotation these days. Does the Taifun look funny on it? How a bout a pic?

It might be a specific problem with my aerotank bases or coils even. The grommets i am using are really beat-up and bruised. I keep on procrastinating with that Lightning Vape order !

Pic coming up !
 

Mazinny

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iStick with Evod, Taifun, PT2, and Kay :

2014-10-04 20.15.26.jpg

2014-10-04 20.19.52.jpg
 

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cigatron

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Yeah but they work fine with my other mods !?

What do you mean by hanger ?

A hanger is when the end of the pos or neg lead of the coil protrudes from the grommet after you have cut/broken them off. When the grommet is compressed (tightened onto a battery) a neg lead hanger can short circuit to the pos pin. A pos lead hanger would short to ground. Either way you will see a much lower resistance than expected or a dead short.

In many cases shorts caused by hangers will only show up when the clearo is tightened down on a battery but measure perfect resistance when only lightly tightened or removed from the battery.

Check for tiny wire stubs (hangers). Cut them off and give it another try.

ps. Not all 510 connectors on batteries are created equal. The pos pin on the istick may be stiffer or higher and could be smashing your kanger grommet more than the others. The more that grommet get smashed the smaller hanger it takes to get a short.

:)cig
 

MacTechVpr

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I have purchased a couple iStick regulated mods ( 20 watts ). Love them. Tiny, barely larger than a Bic lighter. They work fine with my Kayfuns, Taifuns, Drippers etc...
Not with my aerotank bases though. Only seems to read the resistance on these when the connection is not tight ( i.e. when the pt is slightly wobbly ). As soon as the atomizer is tightened the resistance reads zero. When i loosen a litlle, the resistance jumps all over the place. When i loosen a little more, t reads the correct resistance. So in essence it works only when the connection is unstable ! Really frustrating.

Hey Maz, not surprised to hear you're having issues only with the AT. It's the only atty you listed that uses compressible rubber grommets?
Hanger maybe?

:)cig

Yeah maz, cigs on the ball and on point. I've been noticing this for quiet some time. On lots of gear. The dreaded No Load. Back off too much and your res goes high, too tight and N/L until you hit the sweet spot and you finally get a good read from the chip. Love those grommets from Kanger. The firm ones are much better. But in reality its characteristic of the problem…the 510 connection.

The aero base as I wrote was long, long overdue in giving us a sealed connector. However, the drip continues unabated with every change of tank viscosity. And you know I've made a big deal about Nextel but its the only wick you can really clear out effectively of undue saturation. What's most deterred me from moving on to more sophisticated tanks is the horrible fear of not being able to clear the flooding caused by viscosity changes. Having to clear tanks by syringe or other means. There are advantages to Kanger clearo's. We now have a proper base.

So no what you and no doubt others are experiencing is absolutely normal even as I haven't written about it much.

To this I'll add that I've completed several long days of testing on the v2 now defunct single large hole aero base. It's a marvelous improvement. While it doesn't have quite the airflow of the original v1 bored out to 1/16" it seems to be better vectored so somewhat smoother. The thread finish is also much improved over v1 tank and base revisions.

The interesting thing in your example is that I've yet to experience any No Load instances on any of my gear since installing these in use with PT2 and Aero tanks. The thread relationship (turn accuracy) seems to be tighter more well measured and uniform between heads and bases. I've yet to try any of the aftermarket PT2/3 universal assemblies yet. I have some just in. But the Kangers are quite good.

Now on to the v3 bases.

Good luck Maz.

:)

p.s. Sharp brass tip on that PT. :D
 
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Mazinny

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A hanger is when the end of the pos or neg lead of the coil protrudes from the grommet after you have cut/broken them off. When the grommet is compressed (tightened onto a battery) a neg lead hanger can short circuit to the pos pin. A pos lead hanger would short to ground. Either way you will see a much lower resistance than expected or a dead short.

In many cases shorts caused by hangers will only show up when the clearo is tightened down on a battery but measure perfect resistance when only lightly tightened or removed from the battery.

Check for tiny wire stubs (hangers). Cut them off and give it another try.

ps. Not all 510 connectors on batteries are created equal. The pos pin on the istick may be stiffer or higher and could be smashing your kanger grommet more than the others. The more that grommet get smashed the smaller hanger it takes to get a short.

:)cig

no obvious hangers, but a few could have been clipped a little closer i suppose. Some improvement ! with a couple of the bases ( not all ), i can now tighten a little more. Still not perfect though. Thanks for the suggestion.
 

Mazinny

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Yeah maz, cigs on the ball and on point. I've been noticing this for quiet some time. On lots of gear. The dreaded No Load. Back off too much and your res goes high, too tight and N/L until you hit the sweet spot and you finally get a good read from the chip. Love those grommets from Kanger. The firm ones are much better. But in reality its characteristic of the problem…the 510 connection.

The aero base as I wrote was long, long overdue in giving us a sealed connector. However, the drip continues unabated with every change of tank viscosity. And you know I've made a big deal about Nextel but its the only wick you can really clear out effectively of undue saturation. What's most deterred me from moving on to more sophisticated tanks is the horrible fear of not being able to clear the flooding caused by viscosity changes. Having to clear tanks by syringe or other means. There are advantages to Kanger clearo's. We now have a proper base.

So no what you and no doubt others are experiencing is absolutely normal even as I haven't written about it much.

To this I'll add that I've completed several long days of testing on the v2 now defunct single large hole aero base. It's a marvelous improvement. While it doesn't have quite the airflow of the original v1 bored out to 1/16" it seems to be better vectored so somewhat smoother. The thread finish is also much improved over v1 tank and base revisions.

The interesting thing in your example is that I've yet to experience any No Load instances on any of my gear since installing these in use with PT2 and Aero tanks. The thread relationship (turn accuracy) seems to be tighter more well measured and uniform between heads and bases. I've yet to try any of the aftermarket PT2/3 universal assemblies yet. I have some just in. But the Kangers are quite good.

Now on to the v3 bases.

Good luck Maz.

:)

p.s. Sharp brass tip on that PT. :D

I think i need to order some of the v2 or v3 bases. And i definitely need to order some grommets. Would you recommend the entire coil assembly unit ? I have at least 20 coil assembly units already ( kanger and after market, some with a 2mm slot with even ).
 

MacTechVpr

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I think i need to order some of the v2 or v3 bases. And i definitely need to order some grommets. Would you recommend the entire coil assembly unit ? I have at least 20 coil assembly units already ( kanger and after market, some with a 2mm slot with even ).

I'd use the one's I have. The Kanger's are fine. You might try the grommet/pin's from LV. They will make a diff if you're experiencing coil skew or compression. Some people's winding style introduces more or irregular tension. I do at times because of hand control. The firmer set helps consistency.

I wish I had had the 2mm slots for some time. But I thin the 3rd party I just received is 2mm and 2.2mm PT3. I will be doing buildouts on these in time and maybe publishing these to the tables.

Then I may look at some interesting changes to the Protank.

What I'd like to see more is a few folks posting their results as I suggested earlier in the thread…with three confirmed builds and photo at a resistance target that's near wire spec. This would be helpful to others and particularly those building with something other than ceramic wick as I have. I've done so because it's easily replaceable. And the resistance results interchangeable.

So guys pick your favorite wind and have a go. Let's make you notably famous! :D

Good luck Maz.

:)
 

crg31953

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2mm slots???? Where did you find 2mm slots?
I just received my 50 units from LA and they are great. They won't handle 2mm though. I can start them but I can't get them to the bottom. A slight touch with a Dremmel and I could, but as I said before I am unsure of some e-liquid reaction to brass.

Vape On My Friends!

From A Galaxy Far Away
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