Republicans take over all of Congress - is this good for vaping?

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DrMA

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Looks like the GOP has secured a majority in the Senate and strengthened their position in the House.
GOP seizes Senate - CNN.com

Some posters have speculated here that this might actually be a good prospect for vapers, in particular as a GOP-led Congress may be less inclined than progressives to pass sweeping new regulations for PVs. Let's use this thread to discuss potential implications.
 

Penn

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The only way to really know is someone to make a list of all the candidates that supported vaping openly and look at how many won.

I only know of 3 that openly supported and only one won. Conrad James did defeat Liz Thompson but that doesn't say much since democrats lost a lot of state house seats throughout the state. John Wood lost to Maxine Waters and Adam King lost to Karen Bass in California which isn't surprising since both losers are republicans that ran in Los Angeles vicinity.

Speculation would be to say republicans are supposed to be against raising taxes and more for personal freedoms (okay, really conservatives are supposed to have those views but R's try to run on conservative platforms even if they aren't really conservative) . That would be good for vaping.

I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't mean anything good for vaping. I know around the time I joined this board the pro-vaping politician list was proposed but never happened. I believe it wan't until the decision to publicly support Conrad James that this board was willing to allow such a thing.
 

Myrany

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Yes, this is very important. While the Republicans are not perfect by any stretch, they will likely be more resistant to new regulations and taxes. It might actually be great timing that the FDA deeming regulations are now going to be in play after the balance in power changes in Congress.
I remember seeing a video somewhere after the proposed deeming regulations were released where the gentleman (Bill Godshall I think?) had said something along the lines of a change in power in the senate could effectively put the final regulations on the back burner for a very long time. Pres. Obama is going to have to pick and choose his battles with a republican controlled congress and it is likely these regulations just are not going to be that high on the priority list.

Bill if it wasn't you I apologize. I know you were on the program and part of the discussion I just can't for the life of me remember if you were the person that said this.
 

wv2win

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I spoke personally with Senator Isakson's Legislative Aid for the HELP committee (oversees the FDA) on the Deeming Regulations. He was direct and to the point. If the leadership of this committee changes hands (as it now will), they have no intention of supporting the Deeming Regulations. The Senator's concern was two fold: the fact that the FDA is not effective in performing their basic responsibility and should not be wasting time and money on vaping and second, the loss of jobs/business due to these regulations.
 

Jman8

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It's an either-or scenario. Either Dems control and feel free to wield ANTZ logic at a national level, with a president that signed FSPTCA into law, or Pubs control and are less likely to wield ANTZ logic and more prone to challenge the Dem president that wishes to move swiftly on FDA proposed regulations. Part of the process going forward with deeming regulations is Congress has to approve those regulations. I would think our national advocates will be all over the new Congress to drastically change the scope of those proposals, while possibly giving off appearance that 'some regulation is an acceptable thing.' As many vapers welcome 'some regulation' I think that will occur. But with the change that occurred yesterday, I would think FDA is riding rough waters for at least 2 years if they think ANTZ approach to eCigs has any chance of working in the US, at the federal level (where FDA resides).

States and local jurisdictions are another matter....
 

Jman8

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Wish to add here (and came very close to starting a new thread just for this) that I think it is vapers interests to use Pub controlled Congress to amend FSPTCA. How much it gets amended and all that gets changed is not something I wish to cover in one post. But the part where FDA is getting clear indication that eCigs clearly fall under that Act, ought to be changed explicitly to tell FDA, you can no longer pursue a regulatory framework for eCigs under this Act as we (the newly elected Congress) do not authorize that interpretation. And thus make it clear that FSPTCA has nothing to with eCigs/vaping, as vapor is not smoke, and may not even contain nicotine (a tobacco derived product).

IMO, this is where our advocacy ought to be. It still leaves room for some federal entity to regulate eCigs, but to do so without grouping it together with smoking/smokers and other clearly derived tobacco products.

I think what is more likely to occur, unless we (and CASAA) pushes for what I was just stating, is that we hope for next 2 years that the new Congress doesn't take up FDA proposed regulations. That will work (well) in the short term, but still leaves possibility down the road that a dem controlled Congress can pick things up and run with it as if FSPTCA is good policy for eCigs.

If (new) Congress sets precedent that vaping is not smoking, then local jurisdictions would be challenged to pass vaping bans via smoking bans.

IMO, a bad, but seemingly realistic scenario of 'doing nothing' going forward is Pub led Congress indicates they will never allow it on their watch, but some big issue comes up (i.e. immigration reform) and Dems concede to Pubs on that issue while adding in the 'current proposed regulations for eCigs' on that sort of bill, thus throwing all vapers under the bus, while getting far more significant issue to go the Pubs way. Whereas, if our advocacy goes on offensive right now, then Dems would have to seek another issue to sneak in on concessions they seek to appease the Pub controlled Congress.
 

stauglocal

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I remember seeing a video somewhere after the proposed deeming regulations were released where the gentleman (Bill Godshall I think?) had said something along the lines of a change in power in the senate could effectively put the final regulations on the back burner for a very long time. Pres. Obama is going to have to pick and choose his battles with a republican controlled congress and it is likely these regulations just are not going to be that high on the priority list.

Bill if it wasn't you I apologize. I know you were on the program and part of the discussion I just can't for the life of me remember if you were the person that said this.

Yes, it was Bill Godshall that said this. If you are out there Bill, please chime in.
 

NorthOfAtlanta

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If I'm remembering right Congressional oversight is what Bill was talking about, all regulations must be sent over to them before they go into effect and if they do nothing the regulation is at that point the same as a law. If Congress doesn't like them they are sent back with a try again note, this is not what we meant when we wrote the law and cannot go into effect.

Note that this requires no action from the President as is needed with a new law or an amendment, he can lobby for them but until Congress is satisfied they cannot be used.
 

DrMA

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Wish to add here (and came very close to starting a new thread just for this) that I think it is vapers interests to use Pub controlled Congress to amend FSPTCA. How much it gets amended and all that gets changed is not something I wish to cover in one post. But the part where FDA is getting clear indication that eCigs clearly fall under that Act, ought to be changed explicitly to tell FDA, you can no longer pursue a regulatory framework for eCigs under this Act as we (the newly elected Congress) do not authorize that interpretation. And thus make it clear that FSPTCA has nothing to with eCigs/vaping, as vapor is not smoke, and may not even contain nicotine (a tobacco derived product).

IMO, this is where our advocacy ought to be. It still leaves room for some federal entity to regulate eCigs, but to do so without grouping it together with smoking/smokers and other clearly derived tobacco products.

I think what is more likely to occur, unless we (and CASAA) pushes for what I was just stating, is that we hope for next 2 years that the new Congress doesn't take up FDA proposed regulations. That will work (well) in the short term, but still leaves possibility down the road that a dem controlled Congress can pick things up and run with it as if FSPTCA is good policy for eCigs.

If (new) Congress sets precedent that vaping is not smoking, then local jurisdictions would be challenged to pass vaping bans via smoking bans.

IMO, a bad, but seemingly realistic scenario of 'doing nothing' going forward is Pub led Congress indicates they will never allow it on their watch, but some big issue comes up (i.e. immigration reform) and Dems concede to Pubs on that issue while adding in the 'current proposed regulations for eCigs' on that sort of bill, thus throwing all vapers under the bus, while getting far more significant issue to go the Pubs way. Whereas, if our advocacy goes on offensive right now, then Dems would have to seek another issue to sneak in on concessions they seek to appease the Pub controlled Congress.

I think that's a great idea for a new thread. I am also of the opinion that now is the time to go on the offensive. A similar strategy seems to have worked well for {OTHER STUFF} legalization movement and could serve as a model for vapers as well.
 
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wv2win

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Good news for vaping, bad news for women, secularists, non-heterosexuals, and the bottom 99% of income earners.

If I'm not mistaken, two of the 7 new Senators that turned the tide are women. And if I remember correctly, the most significant economic improvement for the bottom 99% has mostly occurred during times when Dem's were not in power. It is never as "cut & dry" as your statement portends.
 

bigdancehawk

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If I'm not mistaken, two of the 7 new Senators that turned the tide are women. And if I remember correctly, the most significant economic improvement for the bottom 99% has mostly occurred during times when Dem's were not in power. It is never as "cut & dry" as your statement portends.

Prediction: this thread will quickly unravel and degenerate to a political slugfest.
 
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Nate760

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If I'm not mistaken, two of the 7 new Senators that turned the tide are women. And if I remember correctly, the most significant economic improvement for the bottom 99% has mostly occurred during times when Dem's were not in power. It is never as "cut & dry" as your statement portends.

I have no inclination to defend either of the equally corrupt, equally incompetent, equally hypocritical parties we've allowed to wield power for the last 150 years. The only practical difference between the two is that they seek to oppress different groups of people.
 

pamdis

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We need a champion on both House and Senate committees that oversee CTP. CTP needs to be told that Congress is prepared to vote down their deeming regulations. This champion needs to be willing to not only threaten it, but to whip up support for it in Congress. Sadly, I don't see that this is an important or big enough issue to any politician to take it on.

Here's an interesting report on the Congressional Review Act that shows many rules are not being submitted to Congress, so no Disapproval Resolution was able to be passed, and yet the agencies still behave as if the rules are in effect anyway:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/r/201...Politics/Advance/Graphics/CRA Report 0725.pdf
 

Nate760

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We need a champion on both House and Senate committees that oversee CTP. CTP needs to be told that Congress is prepared to vote down their deeming regulations. This champion needs to be willing to not only threaten it, but to whip up support for it in Congress. Sadly, I don't see that this is an important or big enough issue to any politician to take it on.

It isn't, and it won't be at any point in the near future, because the potential loss of political capital far outweighs the potential gain. If a legislator speaks in opposition to any aspect of "tobacco control," they are portrayed as wanting little kids to start smoking. Control of the tobacco/smoking narrative must be wrested away from the ANTZ and "public health" blowhards before we can look forward to any sort of meaningful legislative remedy at the federal level.
 

sixstring

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I think that the FDAs green light, yellow light, red light, STOP is going to be determined by how much money is thrown at the "powers that be" by BT or BP regardless of party. It's always about follow the money, and the same stupid "ban/regulate logic" can by used by either side of the aisle to line their own pockets.
 
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