Requiring buyers to be "verified" in the classifieds is over-kill!

[Drewps5co0tt]

I along with many others in the classified section over the past week or so now have noticed a huge reduction in activity, I was just made aware of today that it's because now even buyers have to be verified just to gain access...I think this is a huge mistake! Most buyers are not going to want or take the time to do this, they will go somewhere else to take care of business. It's killing off a lot of the buying all of a sudden, we understand why a seller should be verified but is this really necessary to require the buyers to be as well?

Just giving my feedback, I hope others who have expressed not being happy with this will join me here and put in their two cents.

 

[Killjoy1]

In the event of a dispute where ECF has to step in, having the buyer being verified is a big help to j0ker in mediating. I've seen it happen (mostly elsewhere, but it's possible here, too) where a buyer will claim they never got an item and file a PP dispute, which usually ends in their favor

Not to mention the inability of non-verified members to give or receive feedback

just my I have also noticed that classifieds activity has dropped a bit with the new policy (though it seems to have been slowly picking up over the last couple of weeks), but I honestly see more benefit than aggravation from those policies overall and support these initiatives. They're trying to make things better for us in the long run. Right now it's all still kinda new, so I'm not surprised at the lower activity level and I'm sure it'll pick up again over the coming months

 

[oldsoldier]

The changes in the classifieds we're made with the help of a panel of heavy classifieds users from the general ECF membership.

J0ker has explained the reasons repeatedly in the past and in the end this is the E-cigarette Forum, not the E-cigarette Classifieds. The issues that these changes were meant to prevent have almost ceased to exist since the implementation of the changes -- so in the end the changes have served their purpose and are likely to remain in place.

I'll leave this open in case j0ker wishes to respond.

 

[Drewps5co0tt]

That's true too Kill...about the buyer claiming to never have received item and filing with PP lol...that's a good point!

 

[doots]

I think in the long run it will be better and encourage more members to get verified so they can participate. ECF is looking out for its members and trying to supply the best experience for every one. For those of you trying to sell, hang in there. It will all get better soon!

 

[Drewps5co0tt]

Just giving an opinion man, this is a "feedback" forum afterall.

 

[NC_Fog]

It's not the verification process that's killing activity. Have you seen most of the prices that folks are asking for stuff lately? It's ridiculous most of the time. I can understand it to a point if it's a hard to get mod or such. Sorry but your 1yr old like new(yea right)Silver Bullet is not worth almost what was new plus shipping on top of it. It's cheaper to get a new one at Altsmoke and they have plenty of them with free shipping. I've bought a few tanks and a couple of rebuildable attys in the past few weeks and they were cheaper at the vender than what folks were asking for them in the classifieds. Be realistic folks.

Marty

 

[kookycole]

I know that I was a little daunted by the verification process, but I was surprised how easy it was with NetId, so if you're curious about the classifieds verification is simple. As Marty pointed out, the thing that has prevented me from actually buying is the prices. Even large juice lots are usually at least $.22 per ml, and I realize that is the low end for new juice prices. However, with deals/coupon codes and using low priced vendors I can often find juices that are a similar price, with the added benefit that I can choose juices that are particularly suited to my tastes. For example, by using coupon codes I just bought juice from a well regarded vendor that came to $.23 per ml (including shipping prices). I expect lower prices for used items, especially when large juice lots tend to include juices that are not my flavor profile, are not my preferred nicotine level, or are not my preferred VG/PG ratio. That being said, the classifieds are a great place to find higher end juice for a lower price. I don't want to bash the classifieds or the people that post in them, because I think it's a wonderful concept. I just wanted to share my thoughts as a potential buyer and the reasons that I have not made a purchase. Maybe I'm in the minority of people who feels/thinks this way, or maybe this is something that is really affecting sales. I don't know.

 

[oldsoldier]

It's not the verification process that's killing activity. Have you seen most of the prices that folks are asking for stuff lately? It's ridiculous most of the time. I can understand it to a point if it's a hard to get mod or such. Sorry but your 1yr old like new(yea right)Silver Bullet is not worth almost what was new plus shipping on top of it. It's cheaper to get a new one at Altsmoke and they have plenty of them with free shipping. I've bought a few tanks and a couple of rebuildable attys in the past few weeks and they were cheaper at the vender than what folks were asking for them in the classifieds. Be realistic folks.

Marty

I know that I was a little daunted by the verification process, but I was surprised how easy it was with NetId, so if you're curious about the classifieds verification is simple. As Marty pointed out, the thing that has prevented me from actually buying is the prices. Even large juice lots are usually at least $.22 per ml, and I realize that is the low end for new juice prices. However, with deals/coupon codes and using low priced vendors I can often find juices that are a similar price, with the added benefit that I can choose juices that are particularly suited to my tastes. For example, by using coupon codes I just bought juice from a well regarded vendor that came to $.23 per ml (including shipping prices). I expect lower prices for used items, especially when large juice lots tend to include juices that are not my flavor profile, are not my preferred nicotine level, or are not my preferred VG/PG ratio. That being said, the classifieds are a great place to find higher end juice for a lower price. I don't want to bash the classifieds or the people that post in them, because I think it's a wonderful concept. I just wanted to share my thoughts as a potential buyer and the reasons that I have not made a purchase. Maybe I'm in the minority of people who feels/thinks this way, or maybe this is something that is really affecting sales. I don't know.

I understand your feelings. With that said, it is up to the "market" to "self regulate". If people refuse to pay high prices then stuff won't sell. It has never been the intent of the staff that we should become the "price police".

 

[NC_Fog]

oldsoldier, I completely agree...The "market" will eventually "self regulate". In fact I believe it's already starting to. No "price police" needed.

Marty

 

[j0ker]

I see Killjoy1 answered your reply as I would have Thanks K!

Activity in the Classified isn't as it was before the verification process of course, less people can access it, so naturally less activity but I don't believe it's by much. Two things I'll say, 1. I move as many or more closed threads as I did before the verification process and 2. Wanted and Sale/Trade are now separated, so it might appear to be less activity. With my settings for threads per page at 20 per page, the average pages is around 7 pages and before the verification process pages stayed around 9. So to me things seem back to normal for the most part.

Yes, the pricing issue has always been a gripe but it has been discussed numerous times and it's practically impossible for the staff to be "pricing police". So members have to vote inflated pricing down by not buying and ignoring the thread. I have been inclined to request a member reconsider their requested price when it's more than obvious it's unreasonable but I will not set presidence by policing prices, we don't have the manpower to handle such a process. Personally I agree that some are asking way too much but like I said, ignore their post and move on.

I have on my to-do list to write up a more detailed explanation on the Verified Member process, explaining the purpose and the reasoning behind the procedure. I should have done it long ago, back near the beginning but didn't consider it till recently. So hopefully I'll find the time to put this together soon so all can understand the thoughts behind the process.

 

[Uncle Willie]

Verification both ways is a good thing .. as well, the classified section is not really designed to become your business .. it's a way for regular folks to sell some excess and buyers to maybe get a good deal .. at least that's my understanding ..

Maybe it is a business for some .. ??

 

[kookycole]

I too would never suggest or want the staff to get involved by controlling prices. I just wanted to give my thoughts from a buyer's perspective. I don't really have a gripe with it, I feel that people have the right to set the price at whatever they want. I just wanted to make a point that it could be the pricing that is affecting sales as opposed to the verification process. From what I have seen, the really good deals seem to be sold quickly.

 

[rolygate]

Don (j0ker) and his team have done a fantastic job with the classies. It's everything we hoped for when the project to fix it was first discussed.

If there is a 10% or even 20% drop in activity, that is a small price to pay for the fact it is now better organized and above all safer. It had big problems before with rip-offs, and something had to be done.

The new form-based system means the old chaos has gone, as well. I suppose it could all be made prettier, but there is always another job, and then another...

As everyone has said, this latest trend to offer things at ridiculous prices is a bit strange. But in the end, the market decides - if it sells, well, the price must have been right. The only minor worry is that an inexperienced member who didn't research it might assume that an asking price of retail, or even retail + 25% or whatever, must be correct if something is offered for sale here. It would be nice if we could somehow ensure that newer members did not pay over the odds, but that may not be possible. 'Do your price research' is about as far as we can go, I guess.

The thing is, retail or higher is actually a fair price for items you can't buy - such as some kinds of tanks or rebuildable atties. I'd like one or two of those things myself but I can't get one...

 

[unirevolt]

It would be nice if we could somehow ensure that newer members did not pay over the odds, but that may not be possible. 'Do your price research' is about as far as we can go, I guess.

How about letting members comment on a price, or can we comment DYPR and provide a link or info? Seems to be an easy solution. A few people have found creative ways to comment negatively about a price... i.e. someone was selling a Sturm Mod for 160. I replied that 160 PLN was a good price because he was starting a list for them at 220 PLN. I didn't comment that 220 PLN is about $65, but should have. People should be able to post when a price is inflated, in the instance where demand trumps supply, let the seller justify their asking price. In some cases the item may have already sold without the need.

You see the same people bumping peoples sales with "Great price GLWS" when the price is crap. Why should that be allowed?

 

[progg]

In regards to newer members and prices, maybe j0ker could post a big, fat, bold, seperate sticky advising them to do their due diligence. You know what would happen if you allow price comments.. eeks..

 

[oldsoldier]

How about letting members comment on a price, or can we comment DYPR and provide a link or info? Seems to be an easy solution. A few people have found creative ways to comment negatively about a price... i.e. someone was selling a Sturm Mod for 160. I replied that 160 PLN was a good price because he was starting a list for them at 220 PLN. I didn't comment that 220 PLN is about $65, but should have. People should be able to post when a price is inflated, in the instance where demand trumps supply, let the seller justify their asking price. In some cases the item may have already sold without the need.

You see the same people bumping peoples sales with "Great price GLWS" when the price is crap. Why should that be allowed?

unfortunately we already know from experience that allowing price comments and links only opens the classifieds to flame wars and abuse.

In regards to newer members and prices, maybe j0ker could post a big, fat, bold, seperate sticky advising them to do their due diligence. You know what would happen if you allow price comments.. eeks..

That is a possibility j0ker is always looking for ways to improve the classifieds and protect members. In the end nobody reads the rules let alone the stickies -- but it is worth a try

 

[ogredog]

Ecf can do what they want its their site but I don't like it either.

There should just be a disclaimer and ecf should stay out of it imo.

 

[oldsoldier]

Unfortunately your suggestion is not an acceptable answer to the situation. It was either intervene and stop a lot of the madness or remove the classifieds completely.

 

[ogredog]

Im sure there'd a lot I don't understand to it. Like I said, its ecf site. Just an opinion