Saline Warning

[Dunder Mifflin]

I just saw this posted in another group and thought it was important information for us all. Saline in eLiquid – Is This Smart? | Spinfuel eMagazine

I have used saline in some mixes in the past. I never really found it to make a difference, so I stopped adding saline. I feel that e liquid should contain as few additives as possible. I know we are all in search of the holy grail of flavors. To me, if I don't hurl from the taste, I vape it. Because, after all, vaping is my safer alternative to smoking.

 

[Nana Gail]

Hi, saline is a general term for salt water. It depends on how much salt is in it. The safe ratio is 0.9% this is medical grade called Normal Saline. This is the stuff they pump into your veins when you go to the emergency room with low Blood Pressure or dehydration. This is your Blood and organ tissue normal PH. Higher than 0.9% will cause problems intravenous and cause possible toxic shock. I also know that the 0.9% is used to Lavage(wash out) your lungs when they need to clean them out during surgery. So if we are talking about the same stuff, I think it's OK to use it in eliquid.

 

[iamthevoice]

Hi, saline is a general term for salt water. It depends on how much salt is in it. The safe ratio is 0.9% this is medical grade called Normal Saline. This is the stuff they pump into your veins when you go to the emergency room with low Blood Pressure or dehydration. This is your Blood and organ tissue normal PH. Higher than 0.9% will cause problems intravenous and cause possible toxic shock. I also know that the 0.9% is used to Lavage(wash out) your lungs when they need to clean them out during surgery. So if we are talking about the same stuff, I think it's OK to use it in eliquid.

Broncheoalveolar lavage is not used to clean the lungs but rather to collect lung cell samples for laboratory exams. If you could wash lungs like that, the medical establishment would have used the procedure as a treatment for numerous lung disorders (and imagine the benefit to smokers!)

 

[jcmccord235]

The claim in this article is that saline can yield chlorine gas under electolysis. I believe that this situation is not present in a dripper or a tank - if it were we would see solid deposits of sodium, which is highly reactive and we would notice its effects.

 

[Nana Gail]

Hi iamthevoice, Sorry I"m not that into Surgical procedures but if I"m not mistaken it can also be used to dislodge foreign objects from the lungs, ie aspirated contaminates or food particles. But I may be wrong. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Dunder Mifflin]

Everyone can decide for themselves what or what not to use. I do not see any benefit in using saline so I do not add it. I just thought the article brought up a good point about vaporized saline, which is completely different than liquid saline. I think that there are a lot more things we are going to find out about our ingredients since the industry has exploded and there are a lot more studies on what we are doing. Diacetyl for instance.

 

[DenaInWyo]

As a nurse, I headed to that article with the same idea..

"You gotta be kidding..we put saline in people's VEINS for crying out loud"...but then I read the part about heating the saline up to vaporize it, and, I think they might be onto something there. That is what makes the difference between saline nose spray and saline being vaped.

I dunno..I'm not nearly scientific enough to say, but I do see what they're getting at.

At the end of the day, I enjoy vaping and will continue to do it. I enjoyed smoking and would have probably continued to do it, much to my own detriment, had vaping not come along. Do I think it's safer than smoking? You bet. I don't for a minute believe it's risk free though. But, I have never been one to skip all things pleasurable in life because they're going to kill me someday. For better or for worse, there it is.

 

[Steamix]

Salinity also means higher conductivity...
Don't know if it would have any noticeable effect on resistance across the coil with the quantities we're talking about.
In fact a liquid with a 'salty' flavour would definetly be worth a try.
But salts and metals...
Not so much bothered with salt flaking out on the coil or the wick.
But what about the salt reacting with the various metal components?

 

[jcmccord235]

Salinity also means higher conductivity...
Don't know if it would have any noticeable effect on resistance across the coil with the quantities we're talking about.
In fact a liquid with a 'salty' flavour would definetly be worth a try.
But salts and metals...
Not so much bothered with salt flaking out on the coil or the wick.
But what about the salt reacting with the various metal components?

I've been vaping juice with usually 6-7% normal saline for about a year, I haven't seen any reaction with stainless steel attys. Haven't used a copper atty, though. I suspect that it matters how salty it is - but I would worry more about acidity and plastic components.

 

[Dunder Mifflin]

I've been vaping juice with usually 6-7% normal saline for about a year, I haven't seen any reaction with stainless steel attys. Haven't used a copper atty, though. I suspect that it matters how salty it is - but I would worry more about acidity and plastic components.

I'm just wondering why you add so much saline. Do you really think it makes a difference in flavor? Have you thought about bacon flavor at a really low percent for a salt note?
I added saline because some people say that it makes fruit flavors pop. I found no difference, no "pop". The suggested amount to add was 1 or 2 drops per 10ml.

 

[jcmccord235]

I'm just wondering why you add so much saline. Do you really think it makes a difference in flavor? Have you thought about bacon flavor at a really low percent for a salt note?
I added saline because some people say that it makes fruit flavors pop. I found no difference, no "pop". The suggested amount to add was 1 or 2 drops per 10ml.

I experimented and found levels that worked for me. Maybe you didn't notice a difference because it wasn't enough?

 

[AzPlumber]

sodium chloride (salt) melts at 1473.8 F and boils at 2575.5 F don't believe everything you read. Kanthal A1 melting point is 1500 F

 

[LoveVanilla]

And then perhaps the ocean air might cause problems too? I personally add 1% (of .9% saline solution ) and it has resolved an issue with nasal dryness. I don't add salt to food, and much above this level I do detect saltiness. Less is more. Enjoy.

 

[Boletus]

The claim in this article is that saline can yield chlorine gas under electolysis. I believe that this situation is not present in a dripper or a tank - if it were we would see solid deposits of sodium, which is highly reactive and we would notice its effects.

Regarding chlorine gas formation, I believe it would take a lot more energy than a PV can put out for an appreciable amount of chlorine. These are chloride ions in solution, not chlorine molecules. And electricity will follow the easiest path (least resistance), which will be the wire in the coils. You would have to add enormous amounts of salt to to the juice to get anywhere near the conductivity of the wire, if that is even possible.

Also, consider this; when you go to a public swimming pool, you can smell the chlorine just by entering the building, but there are people that work there all day, breathing it with every breath, including lifeguards that must be next to the water. So if you cannot detect chlorine in your vape at all, what are the chances of dangerous amounts being formed by your PV?

Not that I am saying that I know using saline is safe, since other factors may matter, but I don't think there is any risk from chlorine gas using saline in your mix.

 

[Racehorse]

I feel that e liquid should contain as few additives as possible.

I'm with you there. Less is more. I've given up the flavor chase in preference to the safety chase.

 

[Boletus]

I agree with that view, and I vape a lot of homemade unflavored juice for that reason, but I have yet to see anything that comes anywhere near convincing me that a small amount of normal saline in a mix is any more dangerous than VG or PG.

 

[jcmccord235]

Has anyone else attempted to comment below the article?

 

[MotherNatural]

I was using a 0.9% saline at 5% in my mixes and it was corroding the coil by the end of one tankful. It was impossible to vape if I tried to refill so I was replacing coils with each tank. No problems now that I leave out the saline and my coils last for weeks. I'm surprised others aren't experiencing this problem.

 

[2naphish]

Broncheoalveolar lavage is not used to clean the lungs but rather to collect lung cell samples for laboratory exams. If you could wash lungs like that, the medical establishment would have used the procedure as a treatment for numerous lung disorders (and imagine the benefit to smokers!)

i had a lung washed and scrubbed in a pan of antibiotic solution 20 years ago. amazing difference in lung function afterwards. probably not something anyone would want to go through though.

 

[twgbonehead]

The article, factually, is a piece of trash. It claims that when salt water is vaporised, chlorine gas is released.

Try this experiment: Put a pot of water on the stove. Add as much salt as will dissolve. Turn on the burner.

When the water boils, you will obviously be completely overcome by the chlorine vapors, right? Nope.

Someone else mentioned electrolysis. While this is worth considering, it's also a non-issue. In order for electrolysis to occur you need a potential difference of about 1.25 volts between the electrode and the electrolyte. This can only happen in an atomizer with a broken coil (in which case you might get an infinitesimal bit of electrolysis to occur, but you'd get no vape, either).

And as Boletus said above, whether you're at a swimming pool, or doing your whites at the laundromat, there are many instances where people are exposed to nasally-detectable levels of chlorine without harm, even after long-term exposure.