Seriously!

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Drozd

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Ok...I'm a jerk...seems part of my reasons that I was so adimant about...well if I would have just PMed a couple of times and then just called (like I just did) I would have found out that the website isn't exactly the best laid out and they do have a kit thats single logo manuals batteries with a 15 sec cutoff instead of a 5..instead of just ppassing them up because they didn't have a kit that fit my needs...
Just wanted to say, I was wrong on that...and a jerk...
On the upside I do have a KR808D-1 kit coming (their ultimate manual kit) and a couple packs of cartos...so we'll see.
 

VapingRulz

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I honestly don't understand why so many people recommend the 510 to newbies who state up front that they don't want to fuss with refilling and mods. What is that all about??!!

Is the 510 really better in the end than the VK, assuming that you're willing to do all of the extra work and put up with a short battery life and atomizer problems? Why are so many people sold on the 510 - and why do so many of them make it a point to try to dissuade newbies from buying the VK? I'm really curious. Anyone theories out there?
 

Drozd

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Hey Drozd- I reread your reply to me from the other day and thought maybe I might not be giving the KR808 its best shot-took the leap and I have ordered myself a small kit. If it means anything-you got me thinking! :)
That's cool..I Personally see PVs as tools for a job (that being to keep us off the analogs) and none of em are 100% perfect all around for everyone's needs I like both and I like the fact that I can get adapters and interchange parts with the 510 if i wanna us a 510 atty on a KR808D-1...still not sure why I'd wanna use a carto on a 510 battery tho..but everything I've read and researched and opinions of others suggests that my tobbaco flavors and coffee flavors will do better on the hotter atty of my 510 and the other flavors on the slightly cooler cartomizer..that and when I'm at work sitting 2-3 hundred feet up in the air on an I beam welding I'm not gonna want to carry a bottle of juice and do a top off...different tools for different jobs.
 

Drozd

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I honestly don't understand why so many people recommend the 510 to newbies who state up front that they don't want to fuss with refilling and mods. What is that all about??!!

Is the 510 really better in the end than the VK, assuming that you're willing to do all of the extra work and put up with a short battery life and atomizer problems? Why are so many people sold on the 510 - and why do so many of them make it a point to try to dissuade newbies from buying the VK? I'm really curious. Anyone theories out there?

Simple answer is people don't really read all of the posts they're just anxious to give their opinion as to their preference and not really what the newbie is asking..and because it is a personal choice based on personal preference it reaches both extremes..(I've seen it go the other way too by the way)...or the newbie says they don't want to bother with refilling or mods but then goes on to present other qualifications that yes the 510 would fill better at the sacrifice of refilling or a simple cart mod.
Me, personally, I love the 510 except for the short battery life..but I've a pocket full of batteries, I haven't had any atty problems, don't consider replaceing the filler in a cart with blue foam that difficult or labor intensive to consider it "extra work"...acctually if you're going to refill your cartos at all instead of throwing them away after each one is done, I'd actually say the 510 is less "extra work" in that department...oh and a big factor for me, cost, first starting out it was an extremely tight budget round here..cost me $49 shipped for a kit of 2 complete 510s and 2 weeks worth of juice..compared to (well I just today ordered) my first KR808D-1 kit (VK-ultimate manual kit and 3 packs of cartos at just short of $100 (and given that assumption of 2 cartos a day and not refilling (or having to buy juice)) wouldn't have lasted me as long at twice the price...

I think they're both good tools and both have their place..and I still think it does a disservice to promote one over the other (on the technical aspects alone, not how you feel about the company) instead of presenting the pros and cons of both and letting the newbie research into it and choose for theirself.
 

Drozd

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Drodz hon, have you even received your 808 yet to be so sure about your comparisons??
I've been able to try someone else's 808 so yeah I've used one..
and which comparisons would those be that you're asking about specifically?
cost breakdown ? yup I'm sure about that one..
the argument about 808 being easier being moot once you start refilling cartos...yep I'm pretty sure about that one too..pulling apart a carto and refilling and spinnin' and topping off some more versus taking the cart off pulling out the blue foam dripping in 16 drops and putting the foam back and dripping 4 more drops on the cart and 1 on the atty...
the part about the 510 running hotter and tobacco tasting better on the 510 and fruit flavors tasting better on the slightly cooler 808...yeah pretty sure about that one too based on hundreds of post round the forums (though I confess i don't know so much about coffee flavors, since I hate coffee..but again seems to be the common concensus..
the one about the 808 probably being better for me when i'm sitting 300 feet in the air on an I beam and not having to worry about battery changes or cart changes ...pretty sure (as long as it aint an auto battery)
(Edit note: this is based entirely on the sole use of batteries, on pt when high voltage comes into the game of course everything changes and I have not used either on PT)
 
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Taryn

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if you're going to refill your cartos at all instead of throwing them away after each one is done, I'd actually say the 510 is less "extra work" in that department....

Ok there is the first assumption

but everything I've read and researched and opinions of others suggests that my tobbaco flavors and coffee flavors will do better on the hotter atty of my 510 and the other flavors on the slightly cooler cartomizer..

There is the second assumption

I really do not have the desire to search every one of your threads for all you have said. This thread was started by a 510 user who switched to an 808 and gave her reasons why she felt it was better and that is why I valued that opinion and it is part of the reason I choose this supplier and this ecig. I never say anything about the 510...why...because I do not have one. I will tell people I love my ecig but they should find out what works best for them.

As much as you say the V4L people are "rabid" you seem bound and determined promote that 510 IN the V4L subforum no less. We've heard your opinion, and soon you will be experiencing both brands. Hopefully after that you can present a balanced argument for your beloved 510.
 

Birdy

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Why are so many people sold on the 510 - and why do so many of them make it a point to try to dissuade newbies from buying the VK? I'm really curious. Anyone theories out there?

Usually because they don't actually have a VK- they are basing their opinions on assumptions and misinformation and a general lack of experience with the product (like our friend Drozd here, no offense).

Of course there are many people who do have both and are basing their preference on valid comparisons. Much of the time it has to do with the fact that they can buy cheap parts from many different vendors (though they run the risk of getting faulty clone parts- search the term "L2 510"). Or it was their first PV... or they need more vapor vs flavor.

I also think that contrary to what I and most other V4L customers prefer, a lot of people really enjoy the tinkering, the hobby aspect of trying to find a way to "fix" their PV. After all, those fixes and cart mods and such make up a vast portion of the conversation on ECF.

Meanwhile, 2 piece users are really left with nothing much to discuss other than how utterly satisfied we are with the product and the company.

Perhaps that's why we seem like a broken record to other users. ;)
 

Drozd

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Ok there is the first assumption
Already answered...see post about people not reading and just jumping to post their opinion instead, but here again:
the argument about 808 being easier being moot once you start refilling cartos...yep I'm pretty sure about that one too..pulling apart a carto and refilling and spinnin' and topping off some more versus taking the cart off pulling out the blue foam dripping in 16 drops and putting the foam back and dripping 4 more drops on the cart and 1 on the atty...
Once you, get into refilling cartos the ease argument goes out the window..it takes me 30 seconds to completely refill a cart how long does it take you for a carto? If you're pitching them when they are empty then YES they are easier.



There is the second assumption
again already answered see post about not reading posts fully but here:
the part about the 510 running hotter and tobacco tasting better on the 510 and fruit flavors tasting better on the slightly cooler 808...yeah pretty sure about that one too based on hundreds of post round the forums (though I confess i don't know so much about coffee flavors, since I hate coffee..but again seems to be the common concensus..
(Edit note: this is based entirely on the sole use of batteries, on pt when high voltage comes into the game of course everything changes and I have not used either on PT)
It may be an assumption but one made on post after post I've seen to support this..it is interesting to note that the vast majority of preffered flavors round here and in V4L's top sellers are non tobacco flavors..don't know if that suggests it's because they do better on an atty thats not as hot as the 510 or not..but the general consus on the rest of the forums is that flavors do better on slightly cooler attys, the heat of the 510 sacrifices flavor to up the throat hit, but then they come alive again at high voltage whatever the atty is.
I really do not have the desire to search every one of your threads for all you have said. This thread was started by a 510 user who switched to an 808 and gave her reasons why she felt it was better And continued to go on and devalue opinions counter to hers, that part we've already gone through..my response this time was to VapingRulz
and that is why I valued that opinion and it is part of the reason I choose this supplier and this ecig. I never say anything about the 510...why...because I do not have one. I will tell people I love my ecig but they should find out what works best for them.And I say that they are both tools and serve different jobs...they function equally well given all things... I suggest that they read up on both the 510 and the KR808D-1 and make an informed choice...Why oh why must we choose just one...can't they all just get along?

As much as you say the V4L people are "rabid" you seem bound and determined promote that 510 IN the V4L subforum no less.I'm not promoting the 510 per se in the V4L subforum no less. This time the question was asked by VapingRulz and I answered it honestly, and I say rabidly because often they do not read, they percieve that something may be counter to V4L and the beloved vapor king (because it is an entirely different model and everything) and they attack half cocked...where nothing I said was anti KR808D-1 nor anti V4L:
Simple answer is people don't really read all of the posts they're just anxious to give their opinion as to their preference and not really what the newbie is asking..and because it is a personal choice based on personal preference it reaches both extremes..

I think they're both good tools and both have their place..and I still think it does a disservice to promote one over the other (on the technical aspects alone, not how you feel about the company) instead of presenting the pros and cons of both and letting the newbie research into it and choose for theirself.[/quote
] We've heard your opinion, and soon you will be experiencing both brands. Hopefully after that you can present a balanced argument for your beloved 510. Indeed I will and I'm sure they will both have their place and use just like a phillips versus a flathead screwdriver...or are you one of those people who insist on stripping out phillips screws because you only want to use this one flathead screwdriver because this really great guy once gave it to you.
(further note: in case it wasn't clear in my response to VapingRulz my stance is that it does a dis service to a newbie to promote one model over another instead of letting them make up their own mind..and I think it's less cool to try to try and change their mind once they've made a choice (from either side cuz both happens)
 

Drozd

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Usually because they don't actually have a VK- they are basing their opinions on assumptions and misinformation and a general lack of experience with the product (like our friend Drozd here, no offense).

no offense taken Birdy..I still say it's because people can't or are unwilling to read the entirety of a post..
And it's uncool to try and change a newbie's mind once they're leaning one way or the other(from either side)

me like I said eairlier I didn't think that V4L had a starter kit to fit my needs...actually no one else did either...took me 3 pms and a phone call to Mark to find out that they did...that was part of my original why I chose a different model reasoning....and once I found out I was wrong on that aspect I do believe I corrected myself here as to that misinformation..(still don't owe myself that pack of cartos since it took several PMs and a call to Mark)...though I did find out that they are planning to clean up and otherwise overhaul the website to be more clear.
 

Taryn

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I have read all of your very long opinionated threads, there you go assuming again. I just did not wish to REREAD them to find every comparison you have made.

I spend ONE minute refilling a carto that lasts me over eight hours an, so about two minutes an evening refilling cartos. One minute more if I wash them out. Yes I could just throw them out and grab another one, but I prefer to refill and keep costs down.

How much time do you spend modding your 510, studying forums to learn all the mods, dripping, cleaning attys (including for first use) and how many refills a day do you need would be a fairer comparison. Mine was fantastic from the first vape out of the box and I come to the forums to help support and socialize with other users not try to figure out how to make my ecig work.

Why should I bother with another ecig when I'm perfectly happy with the one I am using, it is meeting my needs perfectly. I find no need to have a different style at home vs on the road. Or in your words, my screwdriver works on all the screws I have, why buy another kind? Oh wait I'm so stupid that I will use it because a "really great guy" gave it to me, it must be my imagination that it actually works for me.

I spent more than two months reading the forums and other sources before I made my first ecig purchase so I feel my choice was quite informed thank you.

You have made your point over and over and over and over again, perhaps if you keep repeating things they will magically become right. I can see your little digs and how you try to stir up trouble. Enough already.
 

DaShiVa

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I've kept off posting here, as it didn't seem to be beneficial, however, reading this made me think perhaps you were missing a fundamental aspect of what new people are asking for.
my stance is that it does a dis service to a newbie to promote one model over another instead of letting them make up their own mind

I think it's a disservice to answer a request for a recommendation for one with a "both" answer, especially when your personal opinion (which is what is being asked for) is clearly a specific one. It's up the the requester of advice to decide what advice to take.
I know that if anyone ever asks me for a vaping recommendation, not only will I say 2 piece, I'll specify V4L's VK, as I know, first hand, what the entire new vaper experience with them is, and I believe it will be as good for them. (And yes, I also now own a 3 piece, and I've tried a few other 3 pieces also, and have friends who use them - well, I think some of my friends still do, a couple have switched to V4L)

In any event, your current opinion (and it's a fair honest one, from what I have read) is that the 510 is better. I have no problems with you making that recommendation should you wish to, however I take issue when you think people like me and others here on the forum shouldn't give our personal recommendations the way we do.
 

sawlight

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I spent some time with a guy I know, he runs a roofing crew and I do some sub work for him. Heavy smoker like me. In the two hours I spent talking to him, he had to refil hs 510 twice and change the battery once. Finally, out o frustration, he grabbed his pack of analogs and finished his time with me smoking them.
Meanwhile I just sukced happily on my VK the enire time. He asked me what I was using and I explained it and he explained his frustrations with his purchachase. He was excited to get a card for them and amazed how well it worked.
This one experiance solidified to me that I had made the right choice.
Yes, it does take longer to refill the carto's, but from what I have seen, the little time I spend doing that, is much less than what I would with a stock 510. I say "stock" as I have no idea what the mods do.
 

JenJen

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Gosh, I had no idea all this was going on! Sheesh! Glad you like your 510 and your opinion is as valid as mine if you have actually used the two. When I wrote this, I had used a pen style and a 510 was so blown away by the Vaporking! For me, it was head over shoulders over the 510 and I was totally stoked that I had found it. I am still totally stoked and can't imagine going back to the 510 after trying the VK, but hey, different strokes for different folks lol. Personally, I am happy for anyone who has used ANY e-cig and gotten off the smokes. So it's all good! ;)
 

Adrenalynn

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>> it takes me 30 seconds to completely refill a cart how long does it take you for a carto?

19 seconds, including the time it takes to unscrew it from the battery, excluding the time it takes to screw it back on (since I generally switch cartos at fill-time) That 19 seconds was consistent across four samples, I beat it a couple times later, but I was trying to. That's just a typical time.

You can get it down to a few seconds if you really want to and have a good eye. You don't have to "drip" - squirt works fine if you can eyeball it. You don't have to spin, you can just snap your wrist once like you would for a thermometer. With the right tool, the end cap and the plug comes out simultaneously. So it's just yoink, squirt, snap wrist pop the plug and endcap on simultaneously.
 
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