Ah, but the difference is the bureaucrats don't pull down multi-million-$$ CEO bonuses for denying coverage, which means they can't leave the country.
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Ah, but the difference is the bureaucrats don't pull down multi-million-$$ CEO bonuses for denying coverage, which means they can't leave the country.
Is Adam Goldstein even a doctor? 
They don't call him one in the article, he is "Adam Goldstein, director of UNC's Nicotine Dependence Program". There's a bureaucrat for ya! 
They don't call him one in the article, he is "Adam Goldstein, director of UNC's Nicotine Dependence Program". There's a bureaucrat for ya! Is Adam Goldstein even a doctor?
Good observation. Outside of his Pfizer marketing gig, he is indeed a "Doctor".
UNC - Find A Doctor
Bureaucrats leave the country all the time! They're called junkets,** paid for by their lobbyist masters...
**Bureaucrats, of course, refer to them as "by-invitation professional conferences to advise attendees on the regulatory environment"... The fact that they occur during the winter months and happen to take place in rum-and-sun-soaked tropical venues is entirely coincidental.
Actually, there was a medium-length thread about this when my paramedic nephew was saying he didn't want to try ecigs if they give off steam because he is trained to rescue people from deadly steam, while wearing protective gear. I caught a lot of flak on that thread, but we all learned some interesting things.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...21-paramedic-nephew-says-steam-bad-smoke.html
The upshot was that steam is invisible and deadly and NOT the same as vapor, so it's probably a good idea to keep saying vapor and DON'T say "steam." Of course, we have no idea if this doctor, who is clearly NOT a physicist, got the idea from vapers saying the s-word or if he just had too much chili for dinner one night and had a bad dream.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...21-paramedic-nephew-says-steam-bad-smoke.html
The upshot was that steam is invisible and deadly and NOT the same as vapor, so it's probably a good idea to keep saying vapor and DON'T say "steam." Of course, we have no idea if this doctor, who is clearly NOT a physicist, got the idea from vapers saying the s-word or if he just had too much chili for dinner one night and had a bad dream.
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I prefer the term used by Dr. Murray Laugesen. To my knowledge he was the first to test the vapor (in 2008) and he referred to it as "mist." Mist sounds much cooler than steam.
Just received this response from the station:
The four attached articles were:
Flouris AD, Chorti MS, Poulianiti K, Jamurtas A, Kostikas K, Tzatzarakis M, Wallave Hayes A, Tsatsakis A, Koutedakis Y: Acute impact of active and passive electronic cigarette smoking on serum cotinine and lung function. Inhal Toxicol. 2013, 25:91-101. An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie
McCauley L, Markin C, Hosmer D. An unexpected consequence of electronic cigarette use. Chest. 2012;141(4):1110 3. An unexpected consequence of electronic cigarette use. [Chest. 2012] - PubMed - NCBI
McAuley TR, Hopke PK, Zhao J, et al. Comparison of the effects of e-cigarette vapor and cigarette smoke on indoor air quality. Inhal Toxicol 2012; 24:850-857. An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie
Varughese S, Teschke K, Brauer M, Chow Y, van Netten C, Kennedy SM. Effects of theatrical smokes and fogs on respiratory health in the entertainment industry. Am J Ind Med. 2005 May;47(5):411-8. Effects of theatrical smokes and fogs on respiratory health in the entertainment industry - Varughese - 2005 - American Journal of Industrial Medicine - Wiley Online Library
i haven't laughed so hard in ages! mr coffey huh? lol - suicidal on Chantix now is he? Give me a break! The problem with steam is that people think of water and kettles and not the particular liquid.
Some liquids 'boil' at room temperature. So because mr coffey reckons they were of no use, we'll take a sample size of one and roll with it. What did he use? a provari a Reo - a bit of crap from a gas station? ofc a 30% success rate is a cause for celebration. Unless you are one of the 70% that spent precisely the same.
i just took 4 hits at 9 million degrees because i mix my own 'liquid sunshine' and now i need a lung transplant - only people with titanium and asbestos lined lungs please!
Mr coffey: 'I was fine when i smoked - i had gorgeous yellow teeth and smelled foul, but i got off it with so many nicotine patches all over my body that i looked like an old toothbrush - it never occurred to me that i could not regulate the dosage'
T
Some liquids 'boil' at room temperature. So because mr coffey reckons they were of no use, we'll take a sample size of one and roll with it. What did he use? a provari a Reo - a bit of crap from a gas station? ofc a 30% success rate is a cause for celebration. Unless you are one of the 70% that spent precisely the same.
i just took 4 hits at 9 million degrees because i mix my own 'liquid sunshine' and now i need a lung transplant - only people with titanium and asbestos lined lungs please!
Mr coffey: 'I was fine when i smoked - i had gorgeous yellow teeth and smelled foul, but i got off it with so many nicotine patches all over my body that i looked like an old toothbrush - it never occurred to me that i could not regulate the dosage'
T
HUH...
"Comparisons of pollutant concentrations were made between e-cigarette vapor and tobacco smoke samples. Pollutants included VOCs, carbonyls, PAHs, nicotine, TSNAs, and glycols. From these results, risk analyses were conducted based on dilution into a 40 m3 room and standard toxicological data. Non-cancer risk analysis revealed “No Significant Risk” of harm to human health for vapor samples from e-liquids (A-D). In contrast, for tobacco smoke most findings markedly exceeded risk limits indicating a condition of “Significant Risk” of harm to human health. With regard to cancer risk analysis, no vapor sample from e-liquids A-D exceeded the risk limit for either children or adults. The tobacco smoke sample approached the risk limits for adult exposure.
Conclusions: For all byproducts measured, electronic cigarettes produce very small exposures relative to tobacco cigarettes. The study indicates no apparent risk to human health from e-cigarette emissions based on the compounds analyzed.
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This seem fairly positive to me ...
"Comparisons of pollutant concentrations were made between e-cigarette vapor and tobacco smoke samples. Pollutants included VOCs, carbonyls, PAHs, nicotine, TSNAs, and glycols. From these results, risk analyses were conducted based on dilution into a 40 m3 room and standard toxicological data. Non-cancer risk analysis revealed “No Significant Risk” of harm to human health for vapor samples from e-liquids (A-D). In contrast, for tobacco smoke most findings markedly exceeded risk limits indicating a condition of “Significant Risk” of harm to human health. With regard to cancer risk analysis, no vapor sample from e-liquids A-D exceeded the risk limit for either children or adults. The tobacco smoke sample approached the risk limits for adult exposure.
Conclusions: For all byproducts measured, electronic cigarettes produce very small exposures relative to tobacco cigarettes. The study indicates no apparent risk to human health from e-cigarette emissions based on the compounds analyzed.
Read More: An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie
This seem fairly positive to me ...
And the Flouris article is likewise positive:
Translation (for dumb doctors who can't figure it out): Using an e-cigarette is less traumatic on the lungs than smoking and the nicotine delivery is adequate for the consumer to find e-cigarettes an acceptable substitute for smoking.
The McCauley article in Chest is a case report on one case of death from lipoid pneumonia, discussed on ECF at the time the article was first published. The author hypothesizes that the oils in e-liquid may have caused the pneumonia. There are a couple of problems with this "evidence." 1. Most e-liquids do not contain any type of oil. 2. Since the man was a decades-long smoker and had several other health conditions, the cause of the pneumonia cannot be definitively linked to use of an e-cigarette.
The article on theatrical fog reports, "Mineral oil- and glycol-based fogs are associated with acute and chronic adverse effects on respiratory health among employees."
It is important to understand that the liquid used in theatrical fog machines is not identical to e-liquid. Commercial fog machine liquid may contain several different glycols (e.g., PG and triethylene glycol). Mineral oils are not used in e-liquid.
The article states:
Most people stop using something if they notice an allergic reaction to the substance. Theatrical workers may not have the luxury of avoiding exposure to the fog, but e-cigarette consumers are not forced to continue exposure to the vapor of a particular e-liquid.
The article on theatrical fog reports, "Mineral oil- and glycol-based fogs are associated with acute and chronic adverse effects on respiratory health among employees."
It is important to understand that the liquid used in theatrical fog machines is not identical to e-liquid. Commercial fog machine liquid may contain several different glycols (e.g., PG and triethylene glycol). Mineral oils are not used in e-liquid.
The article states:
Most people stop using something if they notice an allergic reaction to the substance. Theatrical workers may not have the luxury of avoiding exposure to the fog, but e-cigarette consumers are not forced to continue exposure to the vapor of a particular e-liquid.
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I think Dr. Siegel has a write up on that lipoid pneumonia case study. Yes, here it is.
http://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com/2013/06/german-cancer-research-center-corrects.html
Unfortunately nobody outside of ecig enthusiast circles will read his critique probably.
http://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com/2013/06/german-cancer-research-center-corrects.html
Unfortunately nobody outside of ecig enthusiast circles will read his critique probably.
It sounds as if they're saying: "Don't confuse us with the facts. Our minds are made up and we have an 'expert' to back us."
How maddening. Especially since if he works in a hospital he probably breathes it in every day.
http://www.epa.gov/oppsrrd1/REDs/propylene_glycol_red.pdf
I especially liked the part in their response about us 'not being the norm', having those silly electronic things actually working for us.
I'm in PubMed right now, checking out the assertion that Dr. Goldstein "is a leading researcher in this field."
He co-authored this comment on an article about health risks of using varenicline (Chantix) arguing strenuously in favor of continuing to use it. Sign In
Notice the disclosure: The research received no external funding support. Dr. AOG has received an unrestricted educational grant from Pfizer pharmaceuticals to disseminate inpatient smoking cessation programs. Dr. AOG has also consulted on Advisory Boards for Boerhinger and Pfizer Pharmaceuticals .
I could not find any research on e-cigarettes authored or co-authored by Dr. AOG.
He co-authored this comment on an article about health risks of using varenicline (Chantix) arguing strenuously in favor of continuing to use it. Sign In
Notice the disclosure: The research received no external funding support. Dr. AOG has received an unrestricted educational grant from Pfizer pharmaceuticals to disseminate inpatient smoking cessation programs. Dr. AOG has also consulted on Advisory Boards for Boerhinger and Pfizer Pharmaceuticals .
I could not find any research on e-cigarettes authored or co-authored by Dr. AOG.
I read that one too. It is ridiculous to assume it was the e-cigs. I read the abstract, and then the conclusion and was absolutely baffled. There is no reason to come to the conclusion that e-cigs caused the pneumonia, but they just suddenly come up with it out of nowhere. They even say themselves it is the first case they have seen.
She was on multiple medications (like at least 10 + random supplements) and she was exposed to pesticide 2 weeks prior when an exterminator kill some bed bugs. And none of those are likely causes? She probably smoked for 50 years, which makes you susceptible to pneumonia anyway, plus all the drugs possibly weakening her immune system.
IANAD, so I may be wrong on that last point, but still there's just no valid reason to point to e-cigs as the cause, especially with the pesticide exposure.
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As as exterminator who specializes in the eradication of bed bugs, I can attest to the potency of the insecticides we use. Depending on the type of treatment provided, the homeowner must stay out of their house for SEVERAL hours after the treatment, due to inhalation concerns. Furthermore, any one elderly, asthmatic, pregnant, or ill in any form, must stay out EVEN LONGER! We are required by law to lock their doors and "tag" each door with a warning listing, when the home can be entered and what insecticides were used. I think in the case stated above, one can not conclude on how this person came down with pneumonia.
I think this escaped everyone:
(From the bottom of the article)
Reporter: Allen Mask, M.D.
Producer: Rick Armstrong
Web Editor: Derek Medlin
The culprit that I think deserves even more ridicule is Dr. Allen Mask, M.D.
The 'Reporter'... That makes TWO Medical Doctors who seem to be so far behind the intellectual curve that they would think a human being can inhale vapor that is 'several thousand degrees'. Medicine is supposed to be scientific. And they got advanced college degrees AND passed their medical boards? Seriously?
(From the bottom of the article)
Reporter: Allen Mask, M.D.
Producer: Rick Armstrong
Web Editor: Derek Medlin
The culprit that I think deserves even more ridicule is Dr. Allen Mask, M.D.
The 'Reporter'... That makes TWO Medical Doctors who seem to be so far behind the intellectual curve that they would think a human being can inhale vapor that is 'several thousand degrees'. Medicine is supposed to be scientific. And they got advanced college degrees AND passed their medical boards? Seriously?
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