Should e-cigarettes be banned like smoking? (Philly)

[Bill Godshall]

Should e-cigarettes be banned like smoking?
Einstein Medical Center’s Tracy Kane makes false fear mongering claim about e-cigarettes and propylene glycol, posted comments correct misinformation (PA).
Should E-Cigarettes Be Banned Like Smoking? Health Expert Has Surprising View « CBS Philly

 

[Petrodus]

Most likely they’re safer than regular cigarettes. We just don’t know.

 

[Elnroth]

I didn't see you had already posted this. I'll have to go close the thread.

They are also airing this on the radio
I'm going to call KYW as soon as I get off of work.

 

[e-pipeman]

I'm sorry but not surprised to hear that this sort of misinformation is out there. We just have to screw our courage to the sticking place. It's very sad.

 

[AgentAnia]

Great comments by Bill Godshall, Vocalek, and Carl Phillips.

This one got a chuckle from me:

What a shocker. A "tobacco dependence treatment specialist" endorses the use of pharmaceutical products only. Can a few ecig manufacturers PLEASE start taking these people out for lunch and golf so they can stop with the propaganda?

 

[TomCatt]

Pharma Companies Must End Secret Gifts To Doctors Starting Next Month | Popular Science

 

[Orb Skewer]

Tracy Kane-Quote::"There’s no standard formula for an e-cigarette. But one of the things found in them is propylene glycol. It’s a substance not to be trifled with,"


Its in trifles and lots of other desserts too-you got that bit wrong also -

 

[Petrodus]

Should e-cigarettes be banned like smoking?
NO
Next question ...

 

[Crumpet]

Tracy Kane-Quote::"There’s no standard formula for an e-cigarette. But one of the things found in them is propylene glycol. It’s a substance not to be trifled with,"


Its in trifles and lots of other desserts too-you got that bit wrong also -

I'm ...... I can't view or make comments on this at work. That is one dumb biatch and I intend to tell her so when I get to my home computer.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

I guessed at the nice lady's email address and sent her the ECF Infographic.

 

[TomCatt]

I guessed at the nice lady's email address and sent her the ECF Infographic.

She does appear to have a LinkedIn profile


ETA:
She's no longer the "Patient Education Coordinator, Smoking Cessation Program Facilitator", since May '13, she is the "Interim Breast Health Patient Navigator".


ETAA:
Looking over her profile, I wonder how many bucks got passed until she was selected to talk to the reporter

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

To my amazement, Ms. Kane responded to my email. Here is the text of her response, followed by my reasoned, yet unequivocating reply:

Mr [redacted] - I appreciate your passion. I, too, am passionate but about helping people stop smoking - not transferring their nicotine addiction to a new drug delivery device. Plus, FDA-approved nicotine replacement therapies (which is what I recommended in the radio segment) have undergone rigorous testing and must meet quality control standards. They can be highly effective in helping a smoker achieve total abstinence when combined with a support program. On the other hand, longitudinal analysis found no difference in quit rates between e-cigarette users and nonusers.

E-cigarettes have yet to be proven safe or unsafe. On the other hand, smoking cessation has been proven safe and beneficial in numerous studies for decades.

Out of curiosity, do you sell electronic cigarettes?

Regards,
Tracy Kane

---

Ms. Kane:

No, I do not sell electronic cigarettes. I am a water resource policy analyst and consultant and do sports media and publishing as a side hobby.

I was able to quit a 35-year, two pack/day habit using e-cigs after trying and failing four times using the therapies you mentioned in the story (including support programs). I did so on the advice of my physician, who told me that they were worthy of my consideration and that more studies were showing their relative safety. My experience has been repeated numerous times.

I am not a fanatic. However, when professionals like yourself provide misleading or false information, I feel a duty to respond and that IS what you did in that story. PG is not "anti-freeze." That is its chemical cousin ethylene glycol, which is poisonous.

There is a growing body of clinical research from around the globe showing that e-cigarettes are much, much safer than smoking and are much more effective than the therapies you spoke of in the story. As a medical professional, you have a duty to know this. My family doctor knew it and he spends 12 hours a day seeing patients.

I don't think you provided the misleading information on purpose or as a result of some ulterior motive. I simply think you were misinformed and spoke from what you thought you knew. I will note however, that while I am not in the e-cig business, you do "sell" pharmaceuticals and cessation programs that compete with the method I used, and this may have introduced some bias in your thinking.

I urge you to do some additional research and approach this issue with an open mind.

I am a professional, too. My clients expect a certain level of service and I do them harm when I don't provide it.

Thanks for your response, and have a great weekend.

---

If she responds again, I'll post again.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

I neglected to mention the Soterra decision which said that e-cigarettes weren't drugs or drug delivery devices and therefore could not be regulated using the same standards as the NRT's she touts. I also should have asked for a citation on the "longitudinal analyses" showing that quit rates were no higher for e-cig users than non-users. Does anyone know what she's referring to, or is she blowing smoke up my britches?

 

[AgentAnia]

Oh well done, IBCR! You write a mean letter! (And you clearly are a master of "the art of the elegant insult.") I wonder if she's smart enough to realize she's been zinged?

 

[AgentAnia]

I neglected to mention the Soterra decision which said that e-cigarettes weren't drugs or drug delivery devices and therefore could not be regulated using the same standards as the NRT's she touts. I also should have asked for a citation on the "longitudinal analyses" showing that quit rates were no higher for e-cig users than non-users. Does anyone know what she's referring to, or is she blowing smoke up my britches?

Don't know what a longitudinal analysis is, but judging by her past statements, I'm voting for "blowing smoke"...

(Maybe longitudinal means "we couldn't get the results we were looking for, so we're not gonna tell you."

Edit: Here's the first definition that came up when I googled longitudinal analysis: "Longitudinal data analysis involves examining the progression of data over precisely measured units of time." So I guess she meant "There have been no long-term studies of ecig use yadda yadda..."

 

[Penn]

...I am not a fanatic. However, when professionals like yourself provide misleading or false information, I feel a duty to respond and that IS what you did in that story. PG is not "anti-freeze." That is its chemical cousin ethylene glycol, which is poisonous...

Actually propylene glycol is used as both de-icer and antifreeze. That of course doesn't change the fact that just because it is used as antifreeze doesn't automatically make it toxic, which is the point you may want to lean on in future discussion with antz.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

Don't know what a longitudinal analysis is, but judging by her past statements, I'm voting for "blowing smoke"...

(Maybe longitudinal means "we couldn't get the results we were looking for, so we're not gonna tell you."

Edit: Here's the first definition that came up when I googled longitudinal analysis: "Longitudinal data analysis involves examining the progression of data over precisely measured units of time." So I guess she meant "There have been no long-term studies of ecig use yadda yadda..."

I tend to be a trusting soul and don't suspect ulterior motives until there's no other reasonable conclusion, so I really do think she was mistaken rather than being a purposeful propaganda machine. She's just regurgitating what she's been told and read from the pharmaceutical companies. If she really is a professional, and if she really is as open minded as I (naively?) believe her to be, maybe she'll go back, so some homework and rethink her concept.

 

[Vocalek]

I neglected to mention the Soterra decision which said that e-cigarettes weren't drugs or drug delivery devices and therefore could not be regulated using the same standards as the NRT's she touts. I also should have asked for a citation on the "longitudinal analyses" showing that quit rates were no higher for e-cig users than non-users. Does anyone know what she's referring to, or is she blowing smoke up my britches?

Yes, there are two studies that our dear "friend," Dr. Stanton Glatz, has referred to as longitudinal. Important new evidence that using e-cigarettes reduces successful quitting cigarettes | Center for Tobacco Control Research and Education

CASAA's Scientific Director, Dr. Carl V. Phillips, explains the clever ways in which Glantz manages to evade the truth in this post: Stanton Glantz – liar or innumerate? New evidence says: both! | Anti-THR Lies and related topics

The help line study is not a test of whether e-cigarettes help people stop smoking. That study followed up with people who tried to use e-cigarettes to quit, did not succeed, and had called the help line. Since it tells us nothing about how many people tried to use e-cigarettes to quit and succeeded, it cannot possibly prove what Glantz claims it does.

The other study, a survey of smokers in 4 countries, states in its conclusion, "Awareness of ENDS is high, especially in countries where they are legal (i.e., the U.S. and UK). Because trial was associated with nondaily smoking and a desire to quit smoking, ENDS may have the potential to serve as a cessation aid."

I would bet that Ms. Kane hangs on every word Glantz writes.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

Actually propylene glycol is used as both de-icer and antifreeze. That of course doesn't change the fact that just because it is used as antifreeze doesn't automatically make it toxic, which is the point you may want to lean on in future discussion with antz.

My first email to her included a list of products that contained PG, ranging from salad dressings and sauces to lotions and personal lubricants. I also included a link to SmokeyJoe's Infographic.

ETA:
Technically, anything that lowers the freezing point and raises the boiling point of water could be termed an "anti-freeze." That includes such dangerous substances as table salt, cane sugar and baking soda.

All of which in small quantities are also important electrolytes.

 

[Bill Godshall]

Please post Tracy Kane's e-mail address, as I'd like to send her some of the scientific evidence on e-cigs that she obviously hasn't read or even heard about.

The last person to ask for objective information about smoking cessation is someone who is paid and instructed to promote FDA approved drugs as the only effective way to quit smoking.