SS 32+ gauge

[Imfallen_Angel]

Idk why people keep saying this, but SS doesn't ramp up faster then Kanthal.

Because it does: at the same gauge, SS has a lower resistance, more current per volt and a higher heat capacity.

When you apply the same wattage, the SS will get hotter a bit faster, which with a smaller coil can mean you could have a dry hit easier.

Don't believe me.. check it for yourself:
Wire wizard

 

[Zakillah]

Because it does: at the same gauge, SS has a lower resistance, more current per volt and a higher heat capacity.
When you apply the same wattage, the SS will get hotter a bit faster, which with a smaller coil can mean you could have a dry hit easier.
Don't believe me.. check it for yourself:
Wire wizard

Funny that the site you link actually proves my point. You just have to look at the right unit (yes, heat capacity) and interpret it correctly.
Higher heat capacity doesn't mean it heats faster. The higher it is, the more energy the material needs to heat up.
SS also has a slightly higher density then Kanthal as well, so a SS coil is slightly heavier then a Kanthal coil of the same size. More mass needs more energy to heat up.

In a nutshell...Kanthal has the benefit of having both, a lower heat capacity and a lower density then SS.
Resitance doesn't matter here. For a direct comparison the only thing that makes sense is using the same Wattage on the same size coils and only change the material.
Of course if you put it on a Mech with a constant 4 Volt output the SS heats faster, as you fire with double the power. Not a good comparison.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

Funny that the site you link actually proves my point. You just have to look at the right unit (yes, heat capacity) and interpret it correctly.
Higher heat capacity doesn't mean it heats faster. The higher it is, the more energy the material needs to heat up.
SS also has a slightly higher density then Kanthal as well, so a SS coil is slightly heavier then a Kanthal coil of the same size. More mass needs more energy to heat up.

In a nutshell...Kanthal has the benefit of having both, a lower heat capacity and a lower density then SS.
Resitance doesn't matter here. For a direct comparison the only thing that makes sense is using the same Wattage on the same size coils and only change the material.
Of course if you put it on a Mech with a constant 4 Volt output the SS heats faster, as you fire with double the power. Not a good comparison.

Ah ok, you don't understand how that works... no problem. I ain't gonna argue.

 

[Zakillah]

Because it does: at the same gauge, SS has a lower resistance, more current per volt and a higher heat capacity.

Throwing the same Voltage on different resistances to compare heat up time of different materials is dumb.

When you apply the same wattage, the SS will get hotter a bit faster

...and what exactly makes you say that?

There is nothing you said that actually explains your point, much less proves it; but fine, have it your way.

 

[Yvan]

Ok thanks guys.


I got the answer I need for the Gauge tht's nice, but what about a cooler vape ?
In this case the ohms matter, no ? I read somewhere that higher ohms mean cooler vape is this right ?

so why most of the mtl prebuild coil are on higer ohms ?

Thanks

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

Ok thanks guys.
I got the answer I need for the Gauge tht's nice, but what about a cooler vape ?
In this case the ohms matter, no ? I read somewhere that higher ohms mean cooler vape is this right ?
so why most of the mtl prebuild coil are on higer ohms ?

Thanks

Higher ohms mean less power needed, and yes, it's "cooler" in the sense that it produces less vapor. (But note that the gauge size will play a lot with this)

The reason is that with MTL, you only take a small "drag", so the airflow is much more restricted, so the cooling effect from a high airflow isn't there, so you'd end up with a dry hit if the coil would ramp up the same way as with a DL.

It's all about the balance between the coil you have and the power you give it, as one can do MTL or DL with any sort of coil really, but they have to be done with the right approach. But note that the way the tank is built will impact this (airflow, etc.).

 

[Yvan]

Thank you very much for all your help guys.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

Thank you very much for all your help guys.

If you'd like a visual/interactive view how the ohms and the Amps and Wattage changes due to level of the omhs, check this out: Ohm's law

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

Throwing the same Voltage on different resistances to compare heat up time of different materials is dumb.

...and what exactly makes you say that?

There is nothing you said that actually explains your point, much less proves it; but fine, have it your way.

I'll explain it simply: It has to do with the metal mass and the metal's resistance and wattage required, you'll end up with.

For the same gauge, same number of wraps: (For example: 28gauge, 5.15 wraps @ 2.5mm)
KH = 1.0 ohm
SS = 0.517 ohm

Which means that the resistance of the SS much lower.. which equals faster ramp up.

The point isn't about how much wattage, but how fast two identical coils made from the two metals would go from cold to hot (ramp up), and the SS is half of KH.

You said it yourself that on a mech, the SS would heat up faster... that's pretty much the point of this. It's not about what's hotter, but which heats up faster and once you balance things, SS does heat up faster due to lower resistance.

 

[Oomee]

Anyone else look at these loads and ponder power transfer theory?

 

[Zakillah]

This is not a question you answer by using weird Vape "logic". You answer it by using basic Physics.
The physical property you use to determine how fast a certain material heats up is specific heat capacity. Its unit is Joule/Kilogramm x Kelvin. Joule is Watt x second. Do you see the resistance here? No, and that makes it irrelevant.
Your "Vapers Physics" and reverse "Mech logic" do not apply here.

 

[Imfallen_Angel]

This is not a question you answer by using weird Vape "logic". You answer it by using basic Physics.
The physical property you use to determine how fast a certain material heats up is specific heat capacity. Its unit is Joule/Kilogramm x Kelvin. Joule is Watt x second. Do you see the resistance here? No, and that makes it irrelevant.
Your "Vapers Physics" and reverse "Mech logic" do not apply here.

And there it is, the tantrum because I proved the fact that a similar coil made from S will ramp up faster. Remember my comment about not going to argue this..

This is why, I could see that you'd be this sort of person.

This isn't magical physics and mech etc. this is about the simple fact that if you build two coils the same way (gauge and number of wraps), one in KH and the other is SS, the SS will ramp up faster.

Decks will only have so much space for certain maximum coil sizes so the number of wraps against the resistance, is normally how people tend to build, so if someone is used to having a 10 wrap KH coil, he probably will not build a 20 wrap SS coil to compensate, as he might not even have the space to have such a larger coil, so he would have to change the gauge or size to balance things out. And regardless of the approach he takes, the odds are very high that the SS will be lower in omhs and will ramp up faster.

This was what you questioned as per "Idk why people keep saying this, but SS doesn't ramp up faster then Kanthal."

I knew that you would not believe any explanation and would have to try and save face and be "right". Sadly, I was correct as here you are trying to move the goal posts.

I've explained it so that you might have a better understanding, and answered your question, but it appears that you do not have such maturity to handle it, so I am done, and I hope you have a good day regardless.

 

[Zakillah]

By "this sort of person" you mean someone with at least a basic grip of how science (you know, thats quite the opposite of magic) works? You have proven that you have no idea (or even interest) about the real science of all this and keep arguing that Physics is wrong?
Whats the next topic, flat earth thats 4000 years old?

(Changing to somewhat on topic again)
You know, I dont really mind that so many people in vaping Forums still dont get that resistance on a regulated device doesnt really matter. Or that resistance alone actually tells you next to nothing about a build. Resistance also isnt a magic property that somehow directly correlates to other properties, like vapor production, working power range or heat up time.
What I do mind, and I see it in every forum I visit, is that people just getting into building getting misinformed and confused. And the root of this is the false info that they must build to a certain resistance to get a certain vape.
No, just because you build higher doesnt mean it will take less Watts for the build to work properly. If you only have one wire, its actually the opposite, funny how that works, no.
The important info for a starter is that the more wire (wraps) you use and the thicker the wire is, the more power your build will need to work.
So if your build isnt heating up fast enough, use a thinner wire (this will usually up your resistance) or use a smaller diameter coil and/or less wraps (that will lower the resistance).
The main point that needs to be stressed is coil dimensions, not resistance.

I appologise to OP for hijacking the thread and hope I could give you at least some usable advice; and to you, Imfallen Angel, no hard feelings.

 

[Kickingthesticks]

I think we've given the op enough information to build a simple ss coil....

 

[Zakillah]

Idk, have we discussed heat flux already?

 

[vapdivrr]

Ok thanks guys.


I got the answer I need for the Gauge tht's nice, but what about a cooler vape ?
In this case the ohms matter, no ? I read somewhere that higher ohms mean cooler vape is this right ?

so why most of the mtl prebuild coil are on higer ohms ?

Thanks

Prebuilts for mtl are usually higher ohms because most mtl'ers vape at lower wattages and if you were to use a thicker wire (lower ohms) it would take longer to heat up and there just might not be enough power to heat a thicker coil properly. A lower resistance doesn't necessarily mean a warmer vape, in fact my thicker coil set ups seem cooler then my thinner gauge coils. If you had 2 exact lenghts of wire, one with let's say 30g (higher resistance ) one with 26g (lower resistance) and pushed both with the same wattage, the 30g would heat faster and be warmer. The reason lower ohms is equated with a warmer vape is that it can handle more power within the confines of a tank. Yes a thinner wire can handle the same power, it's just that because of its higher resistance and thinner gauge, you would need more wraps to handle that heat and the coil would need to be many many wraps and just wouldn't fit in the tank. So yes lower resistance kind of goes hand and hand with more heat because people are vaping that lower ohm builds at major wattages

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