I just don't see the Need for BT to do this. And the Risk to Benefit Ratio is Huge.
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I just don't see the Need for BT to do this. And the Risk to Benefit Ratio is Huge.
You got that Right.
If Big Pharma could have gotten e-Cigarettes Classified as a Smoking Secession device, all of these threads would have "BP" in them Instead of "BT".
You can call a Rose by Many Different Names, but it is Still a Rose. But One Thing are Clear.
When the Fed Gov. is 16 Trillion Dollars in the Hole (That's Trillion with a "T") and when Most of the States are Also in the Red, they Don't Need Much Justification for ANY Tax.
We might Not Like the Word "Sin", but there is an Entire Dictionary of Words they can Place in front of the word Tax. I'm sure they will find one that Voters will like if they Don't use the word "Sin".
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I would much rather see a tax on sodas, candy, fattening foods, fast foods, etc.
They would make a lot more money, and they would actually have some justification for doing it.
Only problem is, then you would be taxing everyday people instead of dirty rotten scumbag nicotine addicts.
So while the general public has no problem spitting on us, they won't like it one bit when they start getting spit on.
Well, I'm not ready to concede that fight.
I'll stop fighting on the same day that nicotine users and coffee drinkers are treated the same.
I would prefer that they treat us the same way as coffee drinkers are currently treated.
But if they want to treat coffee drinkers the same way as they treat us I'll be okay with that too.
I'll stop fighting on the same day that nicotine users and coffee drinkers are treated the same.
I would prefer that they treat us the same way as coffee drinkers are currently treated.
But if they want to treat coffee drinkers the same way as they treat us I'll be okay with that too.
I almost can't wait for the day that they treat everyone as they treat us! And It is coming!!
I guarantee you that overweight people are next.
It's just a matter of how long it will take and how fast it will happen.
For instance, if Bloomberg is ever elected President...
Then it can happen VERY fast.
Then people will get it from both ends....go to Whole Foods and the Like and pay a fortune for healthier foods, or pay taxes for buying foods with high sugar, sodium, hydrogenated oil etc...
Well, I'm not ready to concede that fight.
I'll stop fighting on the same day that nicotine users and coffee drinkers are treated the same.
I would prefer that they treat us the same way as coffee drinkers are currently treated.
But if they want to treat coffee drinkers the same way as they treat us I'll be okay with that too.
Gov'ts Rely on this type of thinking. What they don't like is when someone says 'no' and 'no' to other abuses as well, even when it isn't one of yours. It's why Dershowitz (a Jew) defended the right of free speech for the Nazi's in Skokie, Ill (a Jewish community). He lost a lot of Jewish 'friends' when he did it, but he was right. Nothing hurts the Nazis/Aryans more than themselves when they speak. When you restrict their speech, they can play the 'equality' game - Hey, what about the coffee drinkers?!
This is why this form of "equality" is anti-liberty and "equality of misery for all" because governments are more than willing to tax and regulate whomever you want to get "equal treatment".
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Risk to Benefit depends on who and how much they pay off in Gov't. I would never vape any e liquid manufactured by BT.
It is happening, the 'machinations' have been turning for nearly a decade already
Fat people are being farmed-as cash cows. Look at food quality-when science, technology and intelligence advance-things generaly should be better, but they're not.
Yeah, I was kidding though, hence the wink.
I couldn't agree more.
We all know there is no way in hell they would even try that though.
Well, at least not for another 20 or 30 years anyway.
I haven't been around for awhile due to some personal issues and I've forgotten how to multi quote, please bear with me
The choke point is the nic. I believe they will restrict sales to licensed mixers and tax it heavily, at time of purchase by them and at time of sale of the mixed product unless they totally ban e liquid by the bottle and restrict it to prefilled cartridges ala the Blu style and further restrict the amount of nic allowed in those.
If they choose to ban bottled e liquid they can more closely control what they leave available, and torpedo the DIYers among us by only allowing bulk nic to be sold to the makers of prefilled carts. Sounds drastic, doesn't it, but I think it would suit BT and BP if that happened, and they are the ones with all the money the FDA lives for.
Banning bottled e liquid would also get rid of those pesky flavors they hate so much, poor Blu will have to stop their 'other flavors' and stick with tobacco and menthol.
Then there is the possibility that they could just come down and say e cigs are history, the law gives us the right to ban them. If they tried that hopefully major lawsuits would be filed. I don't think we can take anything for granted now, there seems to be a concerted push against e cigs in the media, some cities, some states and they are making inroads.
The same law that gave them the right to regulate also stipulated that they could not ban tobacco cigarettes, nicotine, or set an age limit higher than 18 for purchase. The government was not looking out for e cig users then nor is it now.
states would never turn down a tax(eliquid) unless they have their arm twisted ive said this in the past and i will say it again i would like to propose a politician tax any one wanting to be a politician has to pay a hefty tax to represent "we the people" and thats my story
It doesn't sound like taxation on tobacco works as a cessation tool - and that is a reason for higher prices / taxes. A lot of these states dug themselves in a hole with the tobacco settlement by using tobacco taxes by using it for a wide variety of things, unrelated to 'covering the cost of healthcare' for smokers. They found ways to put it in the general fund and so they are dependent on the revenue. They don't really want smokers to quit. Nobody really want's smokers to quit. No insurance is preparing to charge a fee for smoking and they'll become dependant on the additional revenue.
Yes states would turn down a tax on eliquid if they thought it would cut into taxes on cigarettes. Vapor's tend to quit. Smokers don't. If they don't think they need to compromise, then they won't.
Sooner than that
Junk science works wonders on the products of public education. The point was that many people DO think that way and it plays right into the gov't's hands. Lots of history to prove it.
They're already pushing "studies" that show that isn't the case. And States would and will tax both, regardless.
I suspect it is already here. http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/outside/459869-fat-police-taking-tips-tobacco-control.html
It seems that most of us are on the same page for logically thinking through the possible probable outcomes. Logic doesn't prevail as often as it should though for a myriad of reasons already discussed.
I do take just a wee bit of comfort with the fact that we are already participating in a $1B/yr industry that is growing rapidly. At this point there are enough voices to make a difference. I also take a wee bit of comfort in the fact that vaping has been around for 5+ years now and there hasn't been a single high profile (or low profile that I can find) occurrence of injury or illness related to the ingredients of vaping (other than battery issues. That is simple to correct and avoid but you still can't cure stupid). The same can't be said for many other things that operated without regulation for years. Bath salts are a classic example. It boggles my mind that they went unfettered for as long as they did. And put plenty of people in the hospital during the unregulated days.
The doorman for my sister's condo got hauled away in an ambulance for drinking too many 5hr energy drinks. Kids end up in the hospital for pounding a couple bottles of cough syrup. Heck adults end up doing the same thing. Yes, big difference between use and abuse but still.
I have my ideas as to what may happen but the next 12 months is anybody's guess.
I do take just a wee bit of comfort with the fact that we are already participating in a $1B/yr industry that is growing rapidly. At this point there are enough voices to make a difference. I also take a wee bit of comfort in the fact that vaping has been around for 5+ years now and there hasn't been a single high profile (or low profile that I can find) occurrence of injury or illness related to the ingredients of vaping (other than battery issues. That is simple to correct and avoid but you still can't cure stupid). The same can't be said for many other things that operated without regulation for years. Bath salts are a classic example. It boggles my mind that they went unfettered for as long as they did. And put plenty of people in the hospital during the unregulated days.
The doorman for my sister's condo got hauled away in an ambulance for drinking too many 5hr energy drinks. Kids end up in the hospital for pounding a couple bottles of cough syrup. Heck adults end up doing the same thing. Yes, big difference between use and abuse but still.
I have my ideas as to what may happen but the next 12 months is anybody's guess.
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