Storing pg/vg long term
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Personally I'd say overthinking, they continually store the nic base, including 100%, in those giant blue barrels. But, I'm also one of those that figures I inhaled God knows what in cigarettes for 30 years, anything's gotta be better. lol For your peace of mind however, oplholik's suggestion to ask the chemist is a good one.
avpx1, Sorry I don't know specifically, but i've previously PM'ed our resident chemist here Kurt, with if polycones where mandatory for long term storage(or euro-droppers - his preferred personal cap preference), or if regular caps would be OK(as shops in my country rarely had polycone-caps), and he stated that polycone(and euro-droppers) caps would be a good cap because of the good gasket it makes, but that he still himself preferred the euro-droppers for the additional easy-syringe-dispensing and spill-protection. He previously has recommended against standard bulps for the leaching rubber issue, so if there should be any issue I believe he would know and advice it when I asked. However, I just stated standard polycone caps and not specifically P/E lined ones, and I don't know if the material varies in polycones normally?
Btw, from memory I seem to remember there being some dropper-bulps made for being resistant to chemicals, instead of the rubber ones, and I believe they where made with P/E too, but not 100% sure... Don't know anything about plastic myself...
Edit: I just looked up the older PM and quoted some of it(I hope Kurt doesn't mind, but can't think he has any issue with it...
) :
Btw, from memory I seem to remember there being some dropper-bulps made for being resistant to chemicals, instead of the rubber ones, and I believe they where made with P/E too, but not 100% sure... Don't know anything about plastic myself...
Edit: I just looked up the older PM and quoted some of it(I hope Kurt doesn't mind, but can't think he has any issue with it...
) :
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A large liquor store here in the Chicagoland area called Binny's sells "spray cans" or some other form factor, of Argon gas. The guy on the phone today told me you spray the argon gas in the container and it is heavier than air, so it settles on the surface of the liquid, thus inhibiting oxidation.
I'll be going to Binny's this month or next and be buying some of this argon gas. Nude Nicotine Armor V2 also uses argon gas for a longer storage life of nicotine.
Works for me.
Just remember, we are all in this together.
When I heard all of this going on...since September, 2015, I've purchased abt a gallon of Nude Nicotine Armor v2 and stored in my freezer. They send syringes with the order.
I'm going to be buying mixing bottles, flavors, a scale, pg/vg, etc.
I'm just getting started myself. WE are all in this together. Stay here on ECF and get the help you need to get up and rolling. It is not that hard. I already use one of the 125ml bottles of nic to add nic to premade eliquid that I have that does not have enough nic in it. I was a bit freaked the first time three to four months back, but it is no big deal now and I am ready to start producing my own juices.
As suggested... I posted my question about using metal caps with a Poly Vinyl Liner in the "Ask the Chemist thread". Josh's reply was, "That solution would be fine. The other down side to the PE cone caps is that they break pretty easily when dropped."
As a note... I've cracked a number of plastic caps from over tightening them. I think I'll go with the metal caps... hopefully I can crank down on them and get them really tight. Also, I read in another thread an excellent suggestion of using silicone to seal the cap. I would think they meant applying a bead of silicone on the outside of the cap, on the lip where it meets the glass bottle and cannot come in contact with any nic base.
The polycone caps I believe makes a proper seal by normal preasure without any need of cranking anything... Without a cone-liner, I would crank it, yes... During the screw-down process the liner molds itself into the opening and over-tightening i've read can break this bond(or making it not work as good for next screw-down)...
Non-scientific, but a short article about polycone caps and there merits for chemicals from a big bottle/cap supplier:
Polycone Liners: An Extra Tight Seal - CPS Blog
Non-scientific, but a short article about polycone caps and there merits for chemicals from a big bottle/cap supplier:
Polycone Liners: An Extra Tight Seal - CPS Blog
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mhertz, that's a good blog... thanks for posting it. I decided to go with the Polycone Liners after reading it. I'm a little skeptical of the vinyl lined metal caps because the vinyl liner is adhered to a pulp insert. I'm thinking the vinyl might detach over time. The P/E Polycone Liners look to be highly resistant so I'm placing my bet on them.
I can always go the extra mile and put a bead of silicone around the cap, but as mentioned in the blog it is probably not needed.
Quick followup...I called Nicotine River, retailers of NicSelect and spoke with Grant the owner. He was very helpful and took the time to answer my questions and went on to say that ECF customers are welcome to call and ask for Sam their head chemist who would be happy to answer any questions.
His said nicotine stores best as 100% PG. He, like other nic retailers have stated that the shelf life is 2 years (I'm planning to store it for 10 maybe 20 years-fingers crossed) and also said that transferring to glass bottles wasn't needed because their nicotine ships in foil lined plastic bottles that are pumped with argon gas.
I had already purchased the glass bottles, caps, and gas so I'm committed to bottle transfer at this point.
He volunteered his opinion about where they stand with the deeming regulations and basically said that they will be servicing consumers for many years to come and don't foresee significant price increases due to the FDA deeming.
I don't see Nicotine River mentioned a lot on ECF but in my quest for affordable yet highly recommended nic I stumbled across numerous posts about them in other forums. I checked their prices and they compare with MSF, ECX, ect if purchasing in quantity and using a coupon.
The quality comparisons I read were that NicSelect is on par with VT nic so I've decided to take the plunge with them. Hope this is helpful.
His said nicotine stores best as 100% PG. He, like other nic retailers have stated that the shelf life is 2 years (I'm planning to store it for 10 maybe 20 years-fingers crossed) and also said that transferring to glass bottles wasn't needed because their nicotine ships in foil lined plastic bottles that are pumped with argon gas.
I had already purchased the glass bottles, caps, and gas so I'm committed to bottle transfer at this point.
He volunteered his opinion about where they stand with the deeming regulations and basically said that they will be servicing consumers for many years to come and don't foresee significant price increases due to the FDA deeming.
I don't see Nicotine River mentioned a lot on ECF but in my quest for affordable yet highly recommended nic I stumbled across numerous posts about them in other forums. I checked their prices and they compare with MSF, ECX, ect if purchasing in quantity and using a coupon.
The quality comparisons I read were that NicSelect is on par with VT nic so I've decided to take the plunge with them. Hope this is helpful.
As a note, I still made a rather large purchase. I figure even if the regs turn out to be not nearly a restrictive as I think they may, or for some reason the nic turns bad and I have to throw it out after a number of years. I at lease purchased piece of mind right now and can finally think about something else other than doom and gloom.
Most vendors state PG nic is best because as said it has twice the "life-time" and is better anti-bacterial and the issue of possible hotspots also makes vendors recommend PG nic.
However, the "life-time" when frozen doesn't really apply, and it actually also doesn't even apply unfrozen as vendors can extend the dates after spec-checking again... This is why some vendors state "re-test date" instead of "best-before"...
When frozen, bacteria shouldn't grow in VG with nic in it and the reason VG is recommended by Kurt is because undoubtedly it will slow down molecular movement, hence slowing down oxidation...
PG nic though, is also fine of course, but stating that PG nic somehow is better I don't believe...
However, the "life-time" when frozen doesn't really apply, and it actually also doesn't even apply unfrozen as vendors can extend the dates after spec-checking again... This is why some vendors state "re-test date" instead of "best-before"...
When frozen, bacteria shouldn't grow in VG with nic in it and the reason VG is recommended by Kurt is because undoubtedly it will slow down molecular movement, hence slowing down oxidation...
PG nic though, is also fine of course, but stating that PG nic somehow is better I don't believe...
I used "RECIPESHOTS". Got me around 12% off. "ELR" is another code for 10%.
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