Taste the rainbow
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What brands and flavors do this? Most mixes other than fruits aren't nearly at their peak until a few days have passed. Tobaccos and dessert flavors can take weeks to peak out in flavor. Steeping is a must for most flavors to develop properly.
What's your mix? How are you measuring the ingredients? Are you shaking the mix thoroughly after mixing and once or twice a day afterwards?
What's your mix? How are you measuring the ingredients? Are you shaking the mix thoroughly after mixing and once or twice a day afterwards?
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It's not unusual to "taste" the flavor when tried immediately but to have the flavor "fall off" for a while as it steeps. I'm not saying that is necessarily the case here, but it could be. A good rule of thumb is to not really change anything (even if you taste it) for at least a week, unless it's a one shot or other "shake and vape" flavor.
I would recommend steeping for a bit, then seeing how the mix tastes to you. I'm not entirely sure why the flavor does this I'd hazard a guess it's busy "melding" with the other ingredients. It's just a guess, I actually have no idea why this happens.
But, I'd steep (shaking intermittently) and see how it is then. It may well have improved significantly, and if not, then you may find that you need a higher percentage of flavoring, at that point, with at least some steeping under your flavor's belt, so to speak.
Best of luck, and I hope you get it figured out.
Anna
I would recommend steeping for a bit, then seeing how the mix tastes to you. I'm not entirely sure why the flavor does this I'd hazard a guess it's busy "melding" with the other ingredients. It's just a guess, I actually have no idea why this happens.
But, I'd steep (shaking intermittently) and see how it is then. It may well have improved significantly, and if not, then you may find that you need a higher percentage of flavoring, at that point, with at least some steeping under your flavor's belt, so to speak.
Best of luck, and I hope you get it figured out.
Anna
Sounds like it's you or the mix. Mix has been mentioned so it could be you. Suggest having someone else verify your findings, might narrow down the cause.
I do mostly fruits and some desserts. I use mostly strawberry I found in almost every mix. Strawberry, melons, blueberry, and lately I like the Graham crust/cheesecake too. First day I can taste them but the next mute! I add some menthol so I can see if I can taste for like a day and clean my tank and sometimes I rewick and maybe for 1 tank I can taste the flavora bit.. then back to nada. For measuring I count by drops because I purchased the wrong scale and I find it to hard to get the caps off the flavors to use syringe. I did use the scale to measure the vg/pg and then hand mixer to mix or decent shaking. The flavors I have are a mix from two different places.
Does the flavor return after waiting a week or so of daily shaking or hand mixing?
Fruits and most simple candy flavors are usually good the next day. Desserts can take weeks to mature.
I use the dropper bottles that the flavors come in whether I'm doing a syringe mix or a scale mix. It is nearly impossible to just snap the caps off and that's probably a good thing. Loosely secured dropper bottle tips might pop off under pressure during DIY and we certainly don't want that!
Can you disclose the brands and flavors you are having trouble with? Others who use them might provide better insight as to their mixing regime with specifics. The more info you give the better the advice you'll hear.
Did you use the recommended percentage listed on the vendor's site? That's always a good place to start with a new mix.
Posting a couple of specific recipes, as you mixed them, would be immensely informative.
Fruits alone, generally are pretty much good to go, within 24 hours or so. But, when you start adding other flavors (like cheesecake; or ???), that can alter aging requirements significantly. Certain flavors can overwhelm others until they have had a chance to homogenize. So can the simple act of using too muchKnowing what specific concentrates (complete name and brand), and what amounts were used, can tell us quite a lot.
Would you please add some detail to what is and isn't being tasted (it can make a difference)?
Are these single-flavor (using only one flavor concentrate), or are these flavor blends (using two, or more, concentrates? Is it just part of the flavor profile that disappears (e.g. if you had made a blueberry cheesecake, and the blueberry disappears, but the cheesecake still remains); or is there literally no flavor (as in "water has no flavor")?
I understand what you are trying to do here; but I would caution about trying to adjust a recipe too quickly. This is a common mistake of many novice mixers. The desire to "hurry along," or "fix" an imperfect mix, can be overwhelming.
The problem(s) arise, when a fresh mix is still maturing, and instead of waiting for it to stabilize; we add more variables to the mix. Often, the result is worse, instead of better.
This could well be part/all of the problem. I understand, and respect, why you are having to count drops. But, that does not negate the problems commonly found, from counting drops.
The first problem (and the biggest in my opinion) is how big is a drop. The most common equivalency I see (for drops to mL) is 1milliliter ≈ 20 drops. But I have never come across a concentrate that actually measured even close to this.
When I was still DIYing with syringes, and many of my concentrates were coming in dropper bottles; I had a similar frustration, and checked to see if I could simply count those concentrates by drops. I measured 40 concentrates, from 4 manufacturers, and they all required anywhere from 30-47 drops to fill a 1mL syringe.
Which leads to all the variables that can influence droplet size. The fluid's viscosity is not only influenced by the components that make up the concentrate, but also temperature, and atmospheric pressure. The dropper length, inner diameter, and tip shape will all influence droplet size too.
If you are going to need to count drops for a while yet; I might suggest doing one of two things.
Either:
1.) Take a 1mL syringe; remove the plunger; and then, holding your finger under the tip to seal it; count the number of drops to fill it to the bottom of the 1mL mark. (this will be slightly high {by two or three drops} because of the extra fluid in the tip. If you want more precision; count the drops it takes to fill just the tip, and deduct that number from the total it took to reach the 1mL mark.)
Or:
2.)Forget about counting drops, and gently ream out the dropper tip on the concentrate bottles. Then you can use a syringe to measure more precisely. I found using a large needle, such as found on a large safety pin, will enlarge the dropper enough that I could get a syringe needle (up to 16 gauge) to easily insert. That way you are not having to fight removing the dropper tops each time you want to measure. Small brad nails will work too; though I found I needed to use pliers to hold them securely enough.
You can also use wire snips, or even nail clippers, and snip the tip off the bottles. Syringes will easily fit without effort. CAUTION: this method will ruin the bottle for future dripping(dropping?) (such as when you get your new scale).
Mixing can be another problem area. Excessive open top mixing can cause unwanted flavor loss. By "open top" I am speaking of any mixing (stirring) method that is used that requires the e-liquid to remain exposed to open air (no drip tip; no cap).
Much of what we taste, beyond the basic sweet, sour, bitter, salty, and savory/umami flavors, are aromatic. Some of these aromatic flavor notes are volatile (meaning they readily vaporize at/near room temperatures). The more stirring while exposed to fresh air; the more those aromatic flavors can dissipate.
Closed/sealed bottles are less susceptible to this. The limited amount of air left in the bottle can only absorb so much additional vapor. So, there will be a limited amount of flavor loss, but once that finite amount of air is saturated, there can be no further loss. Theoretically, one should be able to shake a sealed bottle forever, and only have minimal flavor loss.
PLEASE note that I am not saying "do not mix/stir an open bottle." I myself use a small handheld battery-powered mixer for my initial mixing. I am middle-aged, lazy, and I find hand shaking tedious, and monotonous.
(However; all successive mixing is shaking by hand.)Instead; I am suggesting to do what you can to minimize this exposure. Try to mix (open top) only as long as needed to get a thorough blending of ingredients. I mix only long enough to get a uniform appearance from top to bottom. For a 15mL batch size; that might only be 15-30 seconds tops. Even my larger 170mL ADV gets mixed for less than a minute total.
Also, try to refrain from using heat, as heat accelerates even faster loss of those aromatics.
I use a small pair of needle nose pliers to get the tip off. Pull to the side, not straight up. Pops right off and doesn’t destroy the tip.
Haven't really seen a flavor return but they haven't been mixed for a full week yet. Honestly I haven't really tried shaking them daily but will try that going forward. I found a recipe I found online and tweaked a bit. First day I tried it I saw stars. Loved it. Vaped it mostly for that day. By the next day the flavor changed/muted. Tried adding my flavor to bring it back unsuccessfully. It's odd because it's not like I taste one and not the other. I taste.. vg/pg. I'm starting o wonder because I was testing out a pg sensitivity I think I had and mixed them at 60/40. I felt slight throat irritation and noticed odd swelling in my checks. Going to remix them and try the asking daily to see if maybe is an allerg issue.
Posting a couple of specific recipes, as you mixed them, would be immensely informative.
Fruits alone, generally are pretty much good to go, within 24 hours or so. But, when you start adding other flavors (like cheesecake; or ???), that can alter aging requirements significantly. Certain flavors can overwhelm others until they have had a chance to homogenize. So can the simple act of using too muchKnowing what specific concentrates (complete name and brand), and what amounts were used, can tell us quite a lot.
Would you please add some detail to what is and isn't being tasted (it can make a difference)?
Are these single-flavor (using only one flavor concentrate), or are these flavor blends (using two, or more, concentrates? Is it just part of the flavor profile that disappears (e.g. if you had made a blueberry cheesecake, and the blueberry disappears, but the cheesecake still remains); or is there literally no flavor (as in "water has no flavor")?
I understand what you are trying to do here; but I would caution about trying to adjust a recipe too quickly. This is a common mistake of many novice mixers. The desire to "hurry along," or "fix" an imperfect mix, can be overwhelming.
The problem(s) arise, when a fresh mix is still maturing, and instead of waiting for it to stabilize; we add more variables to the mix. Often, the result is worse, instead of better.
This could well be part/all of the problem. I understand, and respect, why you are having to count drops. But, that does not negate the problems commonly found, from counting drops.
The first problem (and the biggest in my opinion) is how big is a drop. The most common equivalency I see (for drops to mL) is 1milliliter ≈ 20 drops. But I have never come across a concentrate that actually measured even close to this.
When I was still DIYing with syringes, and many of my concentrates were coming in dropper bottles; I had a similar frustration, and checked to see if I could simply count those concentrates by drops. I measured 40 concentrates, from 4 manufacturers, and they all required anywhere from 30-47 drops to fill a 1mL syringe.
Which leads to all the variables that can influence droplet size. The fluid's viscosity is not only influenced by the components that make up the concentrate, but also temperature, and atmospheric pressure. The dropper length, inner diameter, and tip shape will all influence droplet size too.
If you are going to need to count drops for a while yet; I might suggest doing one of two things.
Either:
1.) Take a 1mL syringe; remove the plunger; and then, holding your finger under the tip to seal it; count the number of drops to fill it to the bottom of the 1mL mark. (this will be slightly high {by two or three drops} because of the extra fluid in the tip. If you want more precision; count the drops it takes to fill just the tip, and deduct that number from the total it took to reach the 1mL mark.)
Or:
2.)Forget about counting drops, and gently ream out the dropper tip on the concentrate bottles. Then you can use a syringe to measure more precisely. I found using a large needle, such as found on a large safety pin, will enlarge the dropper enough that I could get a syringe needle (up to 16 gauge) to easily insert. That way you are not having to fight removing the dropper tops each time you want to measure. Small brad nails will work too; though I found I needed to use pliers to hold them securely enough.
You can also use wire snips, or even nail clippers, and snip the tip off the bottles. Syringes will easily fit without effort. CAUTION: this method will ruin the bottle for future dripping(dropping?) (such as when you get your new scale).
Mixing can be another problem area. Excessive open top mixing can cause unwanted flavor loss. By "open top" I am speaking of any mixing (stirring) method that is used that requires the e-liquid to remain exposed to open air (no drip tip; no cap).
Much of what we taste, beyond the basic sweet, sour, bitter, salty, and savory/umami flavors, are aromatic. Some of these aromatic flavor notes are volatile (meaning they readily vaporize at/near room temperatures). The more stirring while exposed to fresh air; the more those aromatic flavors can dissipate.
Closed/sealed bottles are less susceptible to this. The limited amount of air left in the bottle can only absorb so much additional vapor. So, there will be a limited amount of flavor loss, but once that finite amount of air is saturated, there can be no further loss. Theoretically, one should be able to shake a sealed bottle forever, and only have minimal flavor loss.
PLEASE note that I am not saying "do not mix/stir an open bottle." I myself use a small handheld battery-powered mixer for my initial mixing. I am middle-aged, lazy, and I find hand shaking tedious, and monotonous.
Instead; I am suggesting to do what you can to minimize this exposure. Try to mix (open top) only as long as needed to get a thorough blending of ingredients. I mix only long enough to get a uniform appearance from top to bottom. For a 15mL batch size; that might only be 15-30 seconds tops. Even my larger 170mL ADV gets mixed for less than a minute total.
Also, try to refrain from using heat, as heat accelerates even faster loss of those aromatics.
Other changes are... changed from cotton bacon to organic cotton sheets and I'm using different SS wire too. Think I have indeed made the ultimate rookie mistake of changing way to many things at once. Before I was building at about .15 now I built the coils to .30 but usually vape at 40-50watts. To make this all the more complicated I ordered clapton wire too.wanted to see if it improves the flavor.
.
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Another question/ related question. Has anyone experienced a sensitivity to let's say one brand of pg but not another brand? Trying to think of some alternative options. I think my next step might be to try mixing a batch with 70vg/30 water. Tried vg alone and the cotton didn't seem to like that very much.
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It's generally recommended to not go above 10% DW. I forget the exact reasons, but I'd imagine the vape could get a bit anemic and watery and yuck.
I'm all VG except for flavorings (waiting on my next batch with PEG400) but I was surprised how helpful 10% DW was. Maybe you can go higher, but I'm not sure you'd want to? If you experiment with 70/30 well make it a small batch, possibly.
Anna
I'm all VG except for flavorings (waiting on my next batch with PEG400) but I was surprised how helpful 10% DW was. Maybe you can go higher, but I'm not sure you'd want to? If you experiment with 70/30 well make it a small batch, possibly.
Anna
Than you Anna. Thinking it over. 30% I think would be a watery mess. I've tried 70/30 and the flavor is good but what I am experiencing is dry hits because I chain vape. Stressful life right now. Upping the pg level helped with dry hits but I confirmed the allergy to pg. I am wondering if this added to the taste issue I'm having. But I do have awful seasonal allergies too top not blame it all on pg. I'm going to try 10% dw and report back.
Steeping, among other things, removes odd flavor notes. It seems like maybe all you can taste is the "odd" notes. The only other thing I can think of is you don't mix it well so most of the flavor gets used up front. Plus the normal issues of vape hardware and its flavor capabilities. At any rate, you are not the first person to come here with this one-day taste complaint.
While long steeping is often recommended, I find the first day (if that) to be more than sufficient for most flavors. Inversely, that would give you only a day to vape if steeping ruins it for you.
While long steeping is often recommended, I find the first day (if that) to be more than sufficient for most flavors. Inversely, that would give you only a day to vape if steeping ruins it for you.
Update. This is pure speculation on my part but I believe it was my rookie mistake. I tried the recipe with banana cream and strawberry and the cream flavor is now over whelming. I added extra banana cream because I liked the flavor and couldn't taste it initially.. 2 days stepping and I felt like I was vaping syrup. I still wonder about the allergy part. My gum/cheek irritation is just about gone using 10%dw. Thank Anna f for the suggestion Of 10% I am going top play around with this on recipes.
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Update. I remixed the cream let or sit shaking and within 2 days I can see positive results on my blueberry mix. Ty Dave.
Thank you. So many pointers and I see the difference already. Shaking and giving time without changing anything I am noticing changes in flavor profiles. No new scale just yet so for now I am still counting drops but next order will update. One question I was hoping for info. With the grapefruit mix I remixed i noticed a frothy sort of outcome with hand mixer. Idk if my tastebuds were dead but the first tastke I I loved it on first ever batch. Now it is chemical smell but Each day I check and it gets better. Could using hand mixer mix in to much air? Killing the flavor?Posting a couple of specific recipes, as you mixed them, would be immensely informative.
Fruits alone, generally are pretty much good to go, within 24 hours or so. But, when you start adding other flavors (like cheesecake; or ???), that can alter aging requirements significantly. Certain flavors can overwhelm others until they have had a chance to homogenize. So can the simple act of using too muchKnowing what specific concentrates (complete name and brand), and what amounts were used, can tell us quite a lot.
Would you please add some detail to what is and isn't being tasted (it can make a difference)?
Are these single-flavor (using only one flavor concentrate), or are these flavor blends (using two, or more, concentrates? Is it just part of the flavor profile that disappears (e.g. if you had made a blueberry cheesecake, and the blueberry disappears, but the cheesecake still remains); or is there literally no flavor (as in "water has no flavor")?
I understand what you are trying to do here; but I would caution about trying to adjust a recipe too quickly. This is a common mistake of many novice mixers. The desire to "hurry along," or "fix" an imperfect mix, can be overwhelming.
The problem(s) arise, when a fresh mix is still maturing, and instead of waiting for it to stabilize; we add more variables to the mix. Often, the result is worse, instead of better.
This could well be part/all of the problem. I understand, and respect, why you are having to count drops. But, that does not negate the problems commonly found, from counting drops.
The first problem (and the biggest in my opinion) is how big is a drop. The most common equivalency I see (for drops to mL) is 1milliliter ≈ 20 drops. But I have never come across a concentrate that actually measured even close to this.
When I was still DIYing with syringes, and many of my concentrates were coming in dropper bottles; I had a similar frustration, and checked to see if I could simply count those concentrates by drops. I measured 40 concentrates, from 4 manufacturers, and they all required anywhere from 30-47 drops to fill a 1mL syringe.
Which leads to all the variables that can influence droplet size. The fluid's viscosity is not only influenced by the components that make up the concentrate, but also temperature, and atmospheric pressure. The dropper length, inner diameter, and tip shape will all influence droplet size too.
If you are going to need to count drops for a while yet; I might suggest doing one of two things.
Either:
1.) Take a 1mL syringe; remove the plunger; and then, holding your finger under the tip to seal it; count the number of drops to fill it to the bottom of the 1mL mark. (this will be slightly high {by two or three drops} because of the extra fluid in the tip. If you want more precision; count the drops it takes to fill just the tip, and deduct that number from the total it took to reach the 1mL mark.)
Or:
2.)Forget about counting drops, and gently ream out the dropper tip on the concentrate bottles. Then you can use a syringe to measure more precisely. I found using a large needle, such as found on a large safety pin, will enlarge the dropper enough that I could get a syringe needle (up to 16 gauge) to easily insert. That way you are not having to fight removing the dropper tops each time you want to measure. Small brad nails will work too; though I found I needed to use pliers to hold them securely enough.
You can also use wire snips, or even nail clippers, and snip the tip off the bottles. Syringes will easily fit without effort. CAUTION: this method will ruin the bottle for future dripping(dropping?) (such as when you get your new scale).
Mixing can be another problem area. Excessive open top mixing can cause unwanted flavor loss. By "open top" I am speaking of any mixing (stirring) method that is used that requires the e-liquid to remain exposed to open air (no drip tip; no cap).
Much of what we taste, beyond the basic sweet, sour, bitter, salty, and savory/umami flavors, are aromatic. Some of these aromatic flavor notes are volatile (meaning they readily vaporize at/near room temperatures). The more stirring while exposed to fresh air; the more those aromatic flavors can dissipate.
Closed/sealed bottles are less susceptible to this. The limited amount of air left in the bottle can only absorb so much additional vapor. So, there will be a limited amount of flavor loss, but once that finite amount of air is saturated, there can be no further loss. Theoretically, one should be able to shake a sealed bottle forever, and only have minimal flavor loss.
PLEASE note that I am not saying "do not mix/stir an open bottle." I myself use a small handheld battery-powered mixer for my initial mixing. I am middle-aged, lazy, and I find hand shaking tedious, and monotonous.
Instead; I am suggesting to do what you can to minimize this exposure. Try to mix (open top) only as long as needed to get a thorough blending of ingredients. I mix only long enough to get a uniform appearance from top to bottom. For a 15mL batch size; that might only be 15-30 seconds tops. Even my larger 170mL ADV gets mixed for less than a minute total.
Also, try to refrain from using heat, as heat accelerates even faster loss of those aromatics.
Ty Noel
It's not unusual for flavors (even if well mixed) to taste good for a day or two, then seem to sort of "fall off" a bit as they steep. I doubt you have muted all the flavor doing that if you are reporting it "improves" as you wait. Even the best "decrease speed of steeping option," may still require some steeping, depending on the flavors involved. You may have just hit a mix that is going to improve as it steeps. Etc. It's good to have everything well mixed, but some flavors seem to sort of need to "meld" and etc.
Anna
Anna
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