Temp Control and Low Wattage Vapers.

[edyle]

I mean that if you build a 0.5 ohm coil that is read as a 3.0 ohm coil because the legs aren't secured (causing extra resistance due to a bad connection), that it will conduct electricity like a 3.0 ohm coil, I would think.

Oh; well yes; if there's contact resistance it will not work like it's supposed to.
8 volts, 3 ohms... that gives 21 watts; most of that gets taken up by the contact resistance.

 

[dr g]

Those of us who still use carto tanks know how to vape by now, so don't have issues with dry hits. Not many new vapers are using carto tanks...

Temperature control improves all vaping, and whether you are aware of it or not, it actually potentially benefits cartomizers most of all. It's a common refrain we hear from every naysayer that they don't get dry hits. But that is a very simplistic way of looking at things, as people learn quickly with tc. It fundamentally changes the way vaping works.

 

[stevegmu]

Temperature control improves all vaping, and whether you are aware of it or not, it actually potentially benefits cartomizers most of all. It's a common refrain we hear from every naysayer that they don't get dry hits. But that is a very simplistic way of looking at things, as people learn quickly with tc. It fundamentally changes the way vaping works.

It its purpose is to prevent dry hits and some of us never have that problem, I don't see how it would be a benefit...

 

[Darryl Licht]

...Oh, and Cellucotton does not burn. It Melts.

Fast forward to 20:30 and you'll see it does burn!

 

[crxess]

Fast forward to 20:30 and you'll see it does burn!

Correction to term used - Decomposed, not melted.

Nice video:
Dry Burn test - Plastic can also be ignited it the Flame/temp is right.

Now, In tank(MINE) Orchid .6ohm dual coil - Full, on Stingray. Mistake made. Sat Mod in Stand, not fully locked.
Reached for mod a minute later - Scalding Hot, WET, e-liquid running from air channels Vapor wisp out tip.
Into Refrig to cool, over to sink to tear down and inspect - Tank still 1/4 full, everything a wet mess.

No ignition, No Dried out chamber, NO wicks in sight - at all. i.e. (edited - Decomposed) - Below Flash point. <*no soot in chamber or on base*>

Did you not notice the Coil test. The Rayon was contracting to the coil, even dry, before it finally reached flash point. i.e. xxxxx (Edited - Decomposed).
Most things will Burn under the right conditions.
Vaping creates High levels of Formaldehyde - under the right conditions.

Thermal properties: Viscose rayon loses strength above 149°C; chars and decomposes at 177 to 204°C. It does not melt or stick at elevated temperatures.

http://www.engr.utk.edu/mse/Textiles/Rayon fibers.htm

Anyway, I had to replace the missing wicks to get back to using that tank.

 

[JimmyDB]

Correction to term used - Decomposed, not melted.

Thermal properties: Viscose rayon loses strength above 149°C; chars and decomposes at 177 to 204°C. It does not melt or stick at elevated temperatures.

RAYON FIBERS

Anyway, I had to replace the missing wicks to get back to using that tank.

Ok, and cotton decomposes when exposed to ~148°C.
Source: Cotton - facts and general information from Swicofil

Besides admitting that Rayon doesn't melt... what was your point in all of that? ( I think I missed it )

 

[tchavei]

Rayon is as natural as cotton just more pure. To get it so pure it goes through a more elaborated process than cotton, just that.

Think of chips... You have the kind that is a potato cut in slices and the other is transformed into a potato mash which then is put in molds to produce the same shape over and over again... They are both potato chips and some prefer one over the other.

Rayon is just overworked cellulose in comparison to cotton which is cellulose also... Just not as clean.

For me this is a non issue. They are both natural and both burn to ash.

Next time someone wicks with Ekowool or silica, place the wick against a strong light (back light) and touch it with your fingers. The fiber glass you will see floating in the air is way more scarier than any cotton or rayon.

Regards
Tony

Sent from my phone through a keyboard or something like that

 

[crxess]

Ok, and cotton decomposes when exposed to ~148°C.
Source: Cotton - facts and general information from Swicofil

Besides admitting that Rayon doesn't melt... what was your point in all of that? ( I think I missed it )

Was not an admission, but rather a learned difference. What looked like it had simply melted away - According to the Textile industry - actually Decomposed. I did not know that could happen.
Now I do.

Simply - Rayon does not have to Burn(ignite) or even be Dry to Fail(completely)

* And while I like PB's comparison test - It has little meaning in Vaping terms. I seriously hope no one would Vape on a flaming Wick.

 

[tchavei]

Simply - Rayon does not have to Burn(ignite) or even be Dry to Fail(completely)

What?

I respectfully disagree.

60ml through this setup:

Removed rayon (no cleaning or passing through water):

No charring, no markings, no decomposition. Where is the failure?

Regards
Tony

Sent from my phone through a keyboard or something like that

 

[JimmyDB]

Was not an admission, but rather a learned difference. What looked like it had simply melted away - According to the Textile industry - actually Decomposed. I did not know that could happen.
Now I do.

Simply - Rayon does not have to Burn(ignite) or even be Dry to Fail(completely)

* And while I like PB's comparison test - It has little meaning in Vaping terms. I seriously hope no one would Vape on a flaming Wick.

Are you suggesting that 'decompose' is in any way related to 'dissolve'?

i apologize if I seem dense, but I am trying to figure out what you actually think occurred.

 

[JeremyR]

Was not an admission, but rather a learned difference. What looked like it had simply melted away - According to the Textile industry - actually Decomposed. I did not know that could happen.
Now I do.

Simply - Rayon does not have to Burn(ignite) or even be Dry to Fail(completely)

* And while I like PB's comparison test - It has little meaning in Vaping terms. I seriously hope no one would Vape on a flaming Wick.

Decomposition takes place over a very long time with out the help of a sewage treatment plant. It wouldn't happen in a few minutes. Most of the Info on decomp is related to sewage treatment.

 

[JimmyDB]

Hey all...I recently received a Vaporshark rDNA 40 and have performed a few build with both NI200 and Titanium. On my most recent build with Titanium on a Lemo Drop, I started at 15 watts and found the vape a bit too hot for my liking. I dropped down to 13 watts and I think it's just about right.

^^^ reduced

BoomerFZ1,

Now that we have the confusion about Rayon out of the way, and you have had a few days to try the device, any update on how you are liking temp control?

 

[Technonut]

It seems that many are missing one of the potential benefits of temp-protection... One's health. I see this topic come up here and there, and posted these in other threads:

Speaking as an "experienced" vaper, I made the switch from tobacco smoking to vaping for a reduced-harm alternative. Regarding the probable importance of temp-protection in vaping, I posted this in another thread recently:



As for the topic of what temp-protection can do for you.. It may have more to do with our health and potentially harmful emissions than merely avoiding dry-hits.

As posted before, Dr Konstantinos Farsalinos is conducting a vaping temperature study. The results more than likely will be eye-opening to many vapers. It could very well be that TP will be necessary to avoid potential health risks. We won't know until the study concludes.

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/e...of-evaporation



Continuing our commitment for unbiased research on e-cigarettes, we are now launching a new campaign for what we consider to be THE MOST IMPORTANT aspect in e-cigarette safety and future development: TEMPERATURE OF EVAPORATION.

Temperature evaluation is one of the most crucial factors in determining safety of e-cigarette use, and any improvements in this field will further reduce any small residual risk associated with e-cigarette use.

Temperature evaluation is one of the most important areas of research in e-cigarettes, since it is a major determinant in thermal decomposition of e-liquid ingredients.


•We believe that it is not just the peak temperature that matters but the integral of temperature over time of puff.

•It may be preferable to vape at higher wattage with shorter puff duration rather than take prolonged puffs at lower wattage levels.

I eagerly await Dr. Farsalinos study results.. I don't think it will be years off though. Much has been researched already. He will also be testing the effectiveness of temp-protected devices as they pertain to his study.

Many of you know that some new devices with the ability to control temperature of evaporation have ben developed. Two such devices have been announced. We have already obtained one of these devices, and we expect to get the other device soon.

We are going to test these devices, not only to see that temperature control is indeed a reality, but also (and most importantly) to see the levels of vapor production (which is a measure of satifaction for the vaper) and the effect of temperature control on aldehyde emissions to the vapor. The latter will show the true impact of temperature control on safety...

Folks who are interested should check out Dr. Farsalinos's site.... LOT's of great info there:

ecigarette-research.com

EDIT: Also, some interesting vids on his YouTube channel:

https://www.youtube.com/user/ecigaretteresearch/videos

There's also this important interview between ECF's founder, SmokeyJoe, and Evolv:

http://vaping.com/news/exclusive-in...om-evolv?_ga=1.268169035.458101530.1368610192

John: Sure. We’re controlling heat by controlling power (heat is power x time). Controlling heat with wattage control sets how much vapor you’re getting and that’s all it sets. What we’re doing with the temperature limitation, temperature protection, is we’re controlling what’s in the vapor because, for example, you could have it set at 20 Watts, and if it won’t wick, you get a real burnt taste and it’s terrible.

The watts directly set how much vapor you get. The temperature sets what’s in the vapor, because at certain temperatures you start to get breakdown products. So we’re really trying to control those as two separate variables. With the DNA40, you could have a lot of vapor that’s absolutely pristine and if for some reason you wanted a tiny amount of nasty vapor you could set that. We don’t recommend it, but you could! This is really the breakthrough: we can say, “Here’s a ton of vapor: it’s not overheated, it’s not burning, it’s not funny tasting and it doesn’t have weird chemicals”. All other changes are either a usability improvement, or something which supports that overall goal.

John: Well, I have to keep my mouth shut because we have several ongoing projects, so obviously we’re not just working on this. What I will say is that we look at the e-cigarette as a separable problem. So, we’re attacking the vapor integrity in the DNA40, and really we’re doing this much earlier because we were kind of pushed into it by the FDA. We need to come up with a regulatory framework where we can guarantee that we know what’s in the vapor stream, or we’re never going to see an approvable product. But, we see there’s a finite number of things to solve before the e-cigarette is as good or better than a tobacco cigarette.

 

[classwife]

New Sub !!



Moved to Temperature Control from Variable Voltage APV Discussion