Just thought I would share an experiment... parallel 26ga as a tmc
Enjoy
Enjoy
Tensioned Micro Coils. The next step.
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Makes sense to me. But then we'll need to address weakening springs, recalibration and their eventual replacement. I definitely think you might be onto something by wrapping from the inside-out. Let us know if you get a prototype built.
It's a great experiment for a "maker". But I don't see how it can be engineered, manufactured and retailed for $25 or less. Hardcore enthusiasts will suck it up for $75. Any more than $25 and I think it will be a tough sell to the masses. Just my
Those are just the tip of the technical hurdle iceberg, but that's more for the prototyping stage, if it ever makes it that far. My finely honed common sense tells me that I should figure out how it is going to work before I start shopping for parts.
I have been trying to make parallel tensioned coils with 30 gauge. But that darn gauge is so soft the 2 coils keep on sliding out of each other. Can you share how you made this (i know it is 26 ga so probably a lot easier than 30 ga)Just thought I would share an experiment... parallel 26ga as a tmc
Enjoy
there are a few problems with that design from what I see.
#1, a spring will get progressively stiffer as it is compressed so tension will not be uniform, even with 2 arms going.
#2, the arms will not be able to make even one revolution because the crank handle will hit the arm as it comes around.
#3, there's nothing here to control the approach angle which will vary as the coil is wrapped.
#4, the way it is geared the crank handle will have to be rotated many many times before those arms would make one revolution, which it couldn't even make because of #2.
there are other problems with that design too, but these are the main glaringly obvious ones I see to start with...
#1, a spring will get progressively stiffer as it is compressed so tension will not be uniform, even with 2 arms going.
#2, the arms will not be able to make even one revolution because the crank handle will hit the arm as it comes around.
#3, there's nothing here to control the approach angle which will vary as the coil is wrapped.
#4, the way it is geared the crank handle will have to be rotated many many times before those arms would make one revolution, which it couldn't even make because of #2.
there are other problems with that design too, but these are the main glaringly obvious ones I see to start with...
How bad do ya want it?
Well I thought so too alden. Much less pay for a special instrument to do it. Even if 5$. I myself have motor control and coordination issues (micro spasm, sounds funny, it ain't). Tried it. Found it. Than fail, after fail. But even as I knew how successfully a pin vise has been used, or something akin to it, throughout history in the arts, crafts, industry…I found out those preconceptions (my own) about what people might approve of was more of an inhibition to me to make the effort and succeed than the reality that so many had found it to be useful. Too much work, I indulged in thinking. Funny how the mind works.
Being dedicated to the idea of impartiality I kept on working the test alongside screw winds, hand winds, manual and assisted tensioning by other means. It wasn't long, a few weeks, that applying pin vise strain clearly proved to make a neater coil reliably with lots less fiddly. Within a month I'd confirmed that adhesion was indeed repeatable (by others). My own consistency soon followed.
Yes, I am the worst skeptic that I know. And it would've been just as easy to say. Hey, it doesn't work for me now, prolly won't for most. Rather I found what it took to make it work. They made it happen for me. People just like you.
And there is no question that it does to the countless folks I've trained who rely upon it. At such an extraordinary success rate that I can't dismiss the fact that practical exceptions are but a few. Virtually anyone can wind a typical 9-turn, 29 AWG on 2.0mm within a minute and in adhesion. The proposition that it requires more effort or complexity than that is what I failed to prove. And that's what compelled me for a great many reasons to put this out there since Oct 2013. That a simple means exists for us to master a control of our own vape.
I am utterly grateful to those dozens of people who submitted themselves to these early experiments. Who were willing and curious to get to a solution themselves. Without them and their dedicated self-interest I would have failed.
Skype me, I'll show you the 30-second wind. But you'll have to build it.
Good luck alden.
Well I thought so too alden. Much less pay for a special instrument to do it. Even if 5$. I myself have motor control and coordination issues (micro spasm, sounds funny, it ain't). Tried it. Found it. Than fail, after fail. But even as I knew how successfully a pin vise has been used, or something akin to it, throughout history in the arts, crafts, industry…I found out those preconceptions (my own) about what people might approve of was more of an inhibition to me to make the effort and succeed than the reality that so many had found it to be useful. Too much work, I indulged in thinking. Funny how the mind works.
Being dedicated to the idea of impartiality I kept on working the test alongside screw winds, hand winds, manual and assisted tensioning by other means. It wasn't long, a few weeks, that applying pin vise strain clearly proved to make a neater coil reliably with lots less fiddly. Within a month I'd confirmed that adhesion was indeed repeatable (by others). My own consistency soon followed.
Yes, I am the worst skeptic that I know. And it would've been just as easy to say. Hey, it doesn't work for me now, prolly won't for most. Rather I found what it took to make it work. They made it happen for me. People just like you.
And there is no question that it does to the countless folks I've trained who rely upon it. At such an extraordinary success rate that I can't dismiss the fact that practical exceptions are but a few. Virtually anyone can wind a typical 9-turn, 29 AWG on 2.0mm within a minute and in adhesion. The proposition that it requires more effort or complexity than that is what I failed to prove. And that's what compelled me for a great many reasons to put this out there since Oct 2013. That a simple means exists for us to master a control of our own vape.
I am utterly grateful to those dozens of people who submitted themselves to these early experiments. Who were willing and curious to get to a solution themselves. Without them and their dedicated self-interest I would have failed.
Skype me, I'll show you the 30-second wind. But you'll have to build it.
Good luck alden.
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As I've said, this not a mechanical draft, only a concept illustration to show various principles at work. To address your points:
1.) The spring's job is to relieve tension, not create it. It has to give just enough to prevent the wire from snapping before the final wrap.
2.) There is no crank handle in the illustration
A crank handle could clear the arms with a long shaft (no jokes), but we're only concerned with the gearing in this dialogue. The arms could be turned by hand as long as the gear is there.3.) Approach angle will vary, but we are wrapping from the inside out so the variance on each side will be half of the total wraps. Also, both sides will be inclined inward as it wraps, pulling the coil together.
4.) See #2
The thing I'm driving at here is that the symmetry of a centered wrap changes things a bit. When you increase tension on the wire as it is wrapped, some of that force transfers to the coil and it will slip until it binds. Because of binding, you can't transfer that force evenly in a linear wrap. In a centered wrap, however, you are applying force from both ends and so from each side we only have to transfer that force across half the coil. That means less binding, which means a more symmetrical wrap.
Just thought I would share an experiment... parallel 26ga as a tmc
Enjoy
Dude, you nailed it. Love the cross build on the VHO T. What I do on my Helios and Raiju's.
(I assume a 2.38mm Ø. calc'd as a quad to get as tight to the individual wrap count as poss. Surface are and distribution are outstanding).
26AWG D/C Par, 12/11, 2.38mm i.d., LL=12mm, t.m.c. = .3528Ω
What did it clock at? That's equiv to a 20 gauge straight wrap (by Ø) but a whole lotta contact!
Straight pos def helps reign in those end turns. I'd love to see you work that into a TLP (twisted lead par.). Then, as diff as it is to imagine see the thermal response gets even flatter. But another advantage is resistance to warping as there as a lot of power potential there. Love to vape that. Haven't gone that much wire with the TLP's yet and I appreciate your first look with a str8 t.m.c.!
Good luck E. Great pick.
Here's a crazy thought: Instead of using a fixed mechanism to relieve tension, use the wire itself by coiling it at the ends and allowing those coils to stretch.
Thanks Mac, thought I'd prove they are still stable and possible. It runs 0.55Ω at 3mm and 8/7 wraps parallel... running single coil for now as I wanted to make sure I nailed the geometry and wicking before I took it to d/c.
Coil wrapping | Steam Engine | free vaping calculators
Aal, it's a pretty simple process really (I'll try 30ga if I can find any in my build box) but the way I do it, it's a bit wasteful on wire currently. The key is the thumbscrew to center the middle of the wire; double it over and clamp it with vice grips, then lightly tighten the thumbscrew and slip the wire around to the side you wrap to (make half of the first half wrap, basically).
Before you start tensioning the wire and tighten the thumbscrew all the way, center the wire so your ends of wire match up like you would with all other parallels. The biggest key is to let the wire lay next to the previous wrap and not try to force it there with the frame of the gizmo, that means constant and consistent tension... I'm just holding down the vise grips with my left hand tightly.
After that, just wind it slow and steady. The pin vise above is just there to make sure the gizmo doesn't back off when I have to stop for a second lol.
Good luck folks
Coil wrapping | Steam Engine | free vaping calculators
Aal, it's a pretty simple process really (I'll try 30ga if I can find any in my build box) but the way I do it, it's a bit wasteful on wire currently. The key is the thumbscrew to center the middle of the wire; double it over and clamp it with vice grips, then lightly tighten the thumbscrew and slip the wire around to the side you wrap to (make half of the first half wrap, basically).
Before you start tensioning the wire and tighten the thumbscrew all the way, center the wire so your ends of wire match up like you would with all other parallels. The biggest key is to let the wire lay next to the previous wrap and not try to force it there with the frame of the gizmo, that means constant and consistent tension... I'm just holding down the vise grips with my left hand tightly.
After that, just wind it slow and steady. The pin vise above is just there to make sure the gizmo doesn't back off when I have to stop for a second lol.
Good luck folks
Post edited as usual lol.
Mac, I totally understand the spasms. I have major nerve damage in both arms from the shoulders down and some nasty spinal injuries from the military, hence the gizmo making it much easier to make spotless coils than the pin vise.
Agreed on a simple 9 wrap (at least 22ga and below), I can knock them out in about 10 seconds (parallel coils take much more time). The only part that makes it take a longer time is when I'm testing static weight to be sure I hold it consistent from the starting leg to the last leg.
Same here, from the first time I saw kanthal factory wrapped around silica for a 14mm rda, finding this group online has been the best discovery in my life. Without the innovation here, I would still be using a stock Protank lol!
Anyway, thanks for the memories folks, glad I got to play along.
Hey Mac, how are you getting the specs of the build in the steam engine link? Post the bookmark?
Well, I've been doing TMC. I made a home-made coiling jig out of wood, a wire coat hanger, and a screw. Forget about that, it's so ghetto.
Anyway, my point: I cut my wire from the spool and clamp a pair of hand vise grips to the free end. That gives me the tension on the free end I need to assure adhesion. It's an old-style clunky metal vise grip. IDK how much it weighs, but I know the coil stays put when I release that weight. I give the vise grips a strong pull (on the wire) before releasing to "stop down" the coil. (That's "Sailor talk".)
I use my coil jig at an angle to cause each wrap to snuggle next to the previous wrap.
It's working great. Been using this system a week now, and getting much better coils than before. Chucking clouds and tasting great flavor. Built 2 Goblins and an RDA a few times and they are great.
Anyway, my point: I cut my wire from the spool and clamp a pair of hand vise grips to the free end. That gives me the tension on the free end I need to assure adhesion. It's an old-style clunky metal vise grip. IDK how much it weighs, but I know the coil stays put when I release that weight. I give the vise grips a strong pull (on the wire) before releasing to "stop down" the coil. (That's "Sailor talk".)
I use my coil jig at an angle to cause each wrap to snuggle next to the previous wrap.
It's working great. Been using this system a week now, and getting much better coils than before. Chucking clouds and tasting great flavor. Built 2 Goblins and an RDA a few times and they are great.
Hey John, try keeping the tension on the vise grips the whole time and see that works...Well, I've been doing TMC. I made a home-made coiling jig out of wood, a wire coat hanger, and a screw. Forget about that, it's so ghetto.
Anyway, my point: I cut my wire from the spool and clamp a pair of hand vise grips to the free end. That gives me the tension on the free end I need to assure adhesion. It's an old-style clunky metal vise grip. IDK how much it weighs, but I know the coil stays put when I release that weight. I give the vise grips a strong pull (on the wire) before releasing to "stop down" the coil. (That's "Sailor talk".)
I use my coil jig at an angle to cause each wrap to snuggle next to the previous wrap.
It's working great. Been using this system a week now, and getting much better coils than before. Chucking clouds and tasting great flavor. Built 2 Goblins and an RDA a few times and they are great.
My standard build these days for drippers, the quick go to is a straight wire 8/24/2.5mm, about .3Ω for KGD, wrapped a little extra tight to .27 for ceramic. Reason being it runs appreciably cooler with the synthetic's great flow which allows me to put a bit more tabasco on it and diffuse the vape slightly on devices that are favored like the MutX. You see I'm not all hung up on perfect vaporization but targeting the output that we want. Why I feel we need to get new vapers onto this joy ride. Once you can build on a platform like the Protank you can build anything.
Good luck.
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In all seriousness, I've thought of putting a hook in a wall stud and tying the free end to that! Then, using my body weight, coil it up using the jig on the other end.
Now THAT's tension!
Imagine the Monty Python-looking fiasco that would occur if the wire broke! LMBO!
Now THAT's tension!
Imagine the Monty Python-looking fiasco that would occur if the wire broke! LMBO!
Put a light screw cap up in a pin vise and leave it in the corner of a desk drawer stickin' up. Always handy. Desktop and pro lighting, magnification overhead as I need it. On the road gotta resort to the vise grips under the knee. Problem is I'm blind as a bat (nearsighted) so gotta pull that hat trick by feel. Rather someone else hold the other end on fat wire. So find yourself a copacetic partner that vapes. Take turns. Spread the love.
Good luck all.
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You don't know how long I've been planning to contact Jon. Just complicated this end. It would be great if the app just put out some kind of BB code or the like with a summary desc users could just drop in to forum posts. It would go a long way to standardizing things and encouraging folks to pass on their wind data. I just write the abbr. summary and link to the configuration's url.
I have more info in my PM's but can't search conversations. A server side add-on is needed and I don't know if they're going to add that functionality. If there's one thing badly needed it's to be able to search on all data we put here. That's one very important element right there if any of you get around to askin' for anything.
Good luck all.
Ok, I didn't have enough 30ga handy to be useful but I did have a bunch of 28ga so here goes...
Same process.
Good luck folks
Same process.
Good luck folks
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