Right now FlarvorArt RY4 (DIY flavoring mixed at 10%) and Volcanoecig (ejuice) RY4 are my favorite RY4 vapes. The Volcanoecig RY4 is not what I would call a classic RY4 but I found I like it a lot anyhow and it is among my top half dozen vapes right now. I also only use BOGE 2.0 ohm carts on VV twist batteries, usually at their lowest-low end volt settings which produce a nice warm-hot vape which I prefer. If you like the caramel flavor of an RY4, you might also like LiquidXpress Caramel Mach.
The Really Big RY4 Roundup (long)
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I was editing my latest video review and realized that Bill's Pretty Good Classic RY4 is on my desk. I'm going to let this one hang out for a bit as I devoured the first bottle in like five days.
Well, there's another RY4 I haven't vaped, from Volcano. OK, so it's not a Classic RY4. That doesn't mean that it's lacking in some way, just that it lives on the Custom side of RY4 Land. You already know that, of course. Having many RY4s of different flavor profiles is wonderful. RY4---the versatile, adaptable, evolving eliquid.
I received my first bottle of MOV Virginia Flake RY4. I've promised myself that I'm going to let it steep for at least two weeks before trying it. My first impressions when I opened the bottle top- WOW! It smells exactly how I want RY4 to smell!
MOV Full Virginia Flake RY4 earns the high grade of A- on The RY4 Report Card for a very good reason: It's a superb NET-based Custom RY4.
Randy, I am vaping some MOV Virginia Flake now! To me, this juice was excellent right out of the mail box. Just a thought - - -
Specs: The 10ml bottle of Are You 4 Real? I purchased from HopE-Liquids contains a pale gold-colored eliquid, mixed at 24mg nic strength in a 50/50 PG/VG base. The nose is very slight and pleasing. Testing was done by dripping into a 2.5 ohm standard 510 atty powered by a VAMO set to 9 watts RMS.
Here’s the description of Are You 4 Real? from the product page of the HopE-Liquids site: “We're for real! RY4 in all of it's sweet caramel with a hint of tobacco goodness.”
When I take my initial hit of an RY4 I’ve never vaped before, the first information my brain tells me is whether it’s Classic or Custom. The ready-state of my brain with RY4s is the Classic Profile. If I get that on inhale, my brain confirms: “Yes, Classic RY4.” If I get anything else, my brain says: “Ah, Custom.” With HopE-Liquids Are You 4 Real?, my brain did a double-take: “Classic, maybe? No, Custom.”
Some of the Classic profile is immediately evident. A slight sparkle of high-end treble. A single overall flavor, with no individual flavoring ingredient standing out or identifying itself obviously. But then, as the vapor reached my lungs, the actual flavor seemed different than what I expect from a Classic RY4. Not radically different, and not in the way that Custom RY4s usually differ from Classic---by being deeper, richer, or emphasizing one flavor element. No, the difference was in the overall flavor, implying that the flavoring elements (tobacco, caramel, vanilla) were either slightly unusual as individual components, or that the way they were mixed produced a somewhat modified end result. The juice isn't particularly sweet and definitely not nutty, but it’s still hard to pin down.
The distinction here isn’t night and day. It’s subtle, but sufficiently apparent that my brain had to shift to Custom designation rather than Classic.
That puts Are You 4 Real at a disadvantage, to my way of thinking. People who love the deeper, richer flavors of Custom RY4s probably won’t think that it’s great, but, on the other hand, those who love the brightness and melded flavor of Classic RY4s may not either, at least not if they’re attached to the particular overall flavor they’ve come to associate with RY4.
Sometimes getting a flavor that challenges our expectations produces a three-letter reaction (W, T, and another letter---ECF won't let me post them together). This reaction is softer, less negative. More of a W (What?)---not an expletive, but a simple question. My brain isn’t rejecting the flavor, but it’s having a hard time identifying what that flavor is. My reaction is one of being slightly puzzled rather than put off: “Maybe I know what this is, but I’m not sure.”
The solution for that is to vape it until you’re sure whether you like it or not. If the juice’s flavor can succeed as an acquired taste, then eventually you’ll like it. If not, then at some point you’ll stop vaping it.
After 20 minutes with Are You 4 Real?, I haven’t reached either conclusion. It’s still a mystery. Not good, not bad. Just different. In fairness, this is a hand-mixed, made-to-order juice, so 10 days may not be enough steeping time for the flavors to mature. I'll revisit the juice in two weeks to see if it's changed. If it changes, I'll let you know.
Going out on a limb, I might speculate that the caramel element could be unusual, but that’s entirely a wild guess. The synthetic tobacco, maybe? I really don’t know what shifts the flavor away from a typical Classic RY4. All I know for sure is that it’s not quite the same. It’s unusual.
My conclusion is that if you like an RY4 that’s a little different, Are You 4 Real? may be worth a try. We could call it an RY4 palate refresher, or maybe a brain teaser.
HopE-Liquids Are You 4 Real? grade: B-
Category Groups: Balanced/Blended, Distinctive/Atypical
Link to purchase: HopE-Liquids Are You 4 Real
Here’s the description of Are You 4 Real? from the product page of the HopE-Liquids site: “We're for real! RY4 in all of it's sweet caramel with a hint of tobacco goodness.”
When I take my initial hit of an RY4 I’ve never vaped before, the first information my brain tells me is whether it’s Classic or Custom. The ready-state of my brain with RY4s is the Classic Profile. If I get that on inhale, my brain confirms: “Yes, Classic RY4.” If I get anything else, my brain says: “Ah, Custom.” With HopE-Liquids Are You 4 Real?, my brain did a double-take: “Classic, maybe? No, Custom.”
Some of the Classic profile is immediately evident. A slight sparkle of high-end treble. A single overall flavor, with no individual flavoring ingredient standing out or identifying itself obviously. But then, as the vapor reached my lungs, the actual flavor seemed different than what I expect from a Classic RY4. Not radically different, and not in the way that Custom RY4s usually differ from Classic---by being deeper, richer, or emphasizing one flavor element. No, the difference was in the overall flavor, implying that the flavoring elements (tobacco, caramel, vanilla) were either slightly unusual as individual components, or that the way they were mixed produced a somewhat modified end result. The juice isn't particularly sweet and definitely not nutty, but it’s still hard to pin down.
The distinction here isn’t night and day. It’s subtle, but sufficiently apparent that my brain had to shift to Custom designation rather than Classic.
That puts Are You 4 Real at a disadvantage, to my way of thinking. People who love the deeper, richer flavors of Custom RY4s probably won’t think that it’s great, but, on the other hand, those who love the brightness and melded flavor of Classic RY4s may not either, at least not if they’re attached to the particular overall flavor they’ve come to associate with RY4.
Sometimes getting a flavor that challenges our expectations produces a three-letter reaction (W, T, and another letter---ECF won't let me post them together). This reaction is softer, less negative. More of a W (What?)---not an expletive, but a simple question. My brain isn’t rejecting the flavor, but it’s having a hard time identifying what that flavor is. My reaction is one of being slightly puzzled rather than put off: “Maybe I know what this is, but I’m not sure.”
The solution for that is to vape it until you’re sure whether you like it or not. If the juice’s flavor can succeed as an acquired taste, then eventually you’ll like it. If not, then at some point you’ll stop vaping it.
After 20 minutes with Are You 4 Real?, I haven’t reached either conclusion. It’s still a mystery. Not good, not bad. Just different. In fairness, this is a hand-mixed, made-to-order juice, so 10 days may not be enough steeping time for the flavors to mature. I'll revisit the juice in two weeks to see if it's changed. If it changes, I'll let you know.
Going out on a limb, I might speculate that the caramel element could be unusual, but that’s entirely a wild guess. The synthetic tobacco, maybe? I really don’t know what shifts the flavor away from a typical Classic RY4. All I know for sure is that it’s not quite the same. It’s unusual.
My conclusion is that if you like an RY4 that’s a little different, Are You 4 Real? may be worth a try. We could call it an RY4 palate refresher, or maybe a brain teaser.
HopE-Liquids Are You 4 Real? grade: B-
Category Groups: Balanced/Blended, Distinctive/Atypical
Link to purchase: HopE-Liquids Are You 4 Real
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RY4 Frenchy is almost complete 
, I have sent out a bottle for thoughts..... RY4 Frenchy is my Janty DK clone I think I about got it 98% close. I have been testing at 3ml and I sent out 6ml so I had a touch more tobacco but we see what the thoughts will be. RY4 Frenchy will be ready after this last test and if anyone wants some let me know so I can order more bottles.
, I have sent out a bottle for thoughts..... RY4 Frenchy is my Janty DK clone I think I about got it 98% close. I have been testing at 3ml and I sent out 6ml so I had a touch more tobacco but we see what the thoughts will be. RY4 Frenchy will be ready after this last test and if anyone wants some let me know so I can order more bottles.
RY4 Frenchy is almost complete
Ah, the DIY RY4 Mad Mixologists strike again! I hope you nailed it, Passer. I will await the reactions with bated breath.
Having vaped seven Janty RY4s of different vintages, series, and designations---2012 RY4 DK-Series, 2011 RY4 Elixir-Series, 2012 Janty RY4-X Classic-Series, 2013 Janty RY4 Classic-Series, plus three other earlier versions from before Janty even had different Series (all courtesy of our colleague Kent C)---2010 bottled Janty RY4, 2009 Janty RY4 from carts, and 2009 Janty RY2---I now experience each one as different.
The breadth of the Janty RY4 profile has expanded for me---not wildly, but significantly. The family resemblance remains intact, but each version has its own characteristic flavor and impact.
Today I received Yaeliq's RY4 and Asian RY4. I haven't tried them yet, but going off of the initial smell I found something curious. The RY4 smells more like a classic RY4, while the Asian RY4 smells more like a custom RY4 (much heavier on the sweet scents). I thought it would have been the other way around. Of course taste could be another matter entirely. I'll drip some later and vape them in earnest after some steeping.
My very first DIY project was a 10% Double RY4, which I later adjusted lower to 8%. I was delighted to read here eventually that Bill's reports suggested a 6-9% mix, this helped to assure this newbie DIYer that I was in the right direction. Even more was the fact that DRY4 was on the top of Bill's custom list, particularly that I had just committed to a monster sized bottle, after having consumed the initial 8ml bottle I bought from Wizard Labs:
I had just made about 200ml of the juice, enough to run a few experiments with it over the next several weeks.
When I made the first batch, I immediately vaped it out of curiousity. While it was very vapable as a 'sweet' type of gourmet juice, I was very much looking forward to how it would taste like if and when it had properly steeped. I vaped it everyday any way, reloading a 2ml tank daily. If there were any notes on this thread or elsewhere on the forum about how much time it would take to steep this juice, I missed it. I just took the advise of some guys on the forum and bathing the bottles in a hot water thermos container for about 3 days (replacing the water every 6-12 hours), shaking them twice a day and removing the cap to let it breath and reload my tanks at the same time (I made 30ml bottles). After the 3 days of the hot water bath, the bottles went into a drawer where they still live now.
It was around the 12th day when I noticed a transformation in the taste. It's about this time that the Tobacco flavor came into the driver's seat of this juice. The transformation on this day was very very significant, so much so that I thought I picked up the wrong tank containing another brand of RY4 I was vaping. But no, it was my DIY DRY4 that had apparently gone through a radical chemical process literally overnight. Only the day before, this juice still vaped liked liquid sugar with a tad bit of tobacco in it. Now that taste is very much RY4, very much tobacco at the forefront, and the caramel behind.
I vape my DR4 with 60%VG, which produces tons of vapor, much much more than any analog would even come close to. I wonder if any of you guys have done taste experiments for this flavor on different VG levels, particularly below and above 50%. Does it even make a notable difference in taste?
I notice that Tribeca, really a fantastic juice, imo, and much of other Halo's juices can't be over 50% as they produce significantly less vapor than my 60% mix. I venture to guess that their VG content can be no more than 35-40%, and since Tribeca tastes so good, there must be a good reason why they keep VG levels below the 50% mark, especially that people love lots of vapor.
I had just made about 200ml of the juice, enough to run a few experiments with it over the next several weeks.
When I made the first batch, I immediately vaped it out of curiousity. While it was very vapable as a 'sweet' type of gourmet juice, I was very much looking forward to how it would taste like if and when it had properly steeped. I vaped it everyday any way, reloading a 2ml tank daily. If there were any notes on this thread or elsewhere on the forum about how much time it would take to steep this juice, I missed it. I just took the advise of some guys on the forum and bathing the bottles in a hot water thermos container for about 3 days (replacing the water every 6-12 hours), shaking them twice a day and removing the cap to let it breath and reload my tanks at the same time (I made 30ml bottles). After the 3 days of the hot water bath, the bottles went into a drawer where they still live now.
It was around the 12th day when I noticed a transformation in the taste. It's about this time that the Tobacco flavor came into the driver's seat of this juice. The transformation on this day was very very significant, so much so that I thought I picked up the wrong tank containing another brand of RY4 I was vaping. But no, it was my DIY DRY4 that had apparently gone through a radical chemical process literally overnight. Only the day before, this juice still vaped liked liquid sugar with a tad bit of tobacco in it. Now that taste is very much RY4, very much tobacco at the forefront, and the caramel behind.
I vape my DR4 with 60%VG, which produces tons of vapor, much much more than any analog would even come close to. I wonder if any of you guys have done taste experiments for this flavor on different VG levels, particularly below and above 50%. Does it even make a notable difference in taste?
I notice that Tribeca, really a fantastic juice, imo, and much of other Halo's juices can't be over 50% as they produce significantly less vapor than my 60% mix. I venture to guess that their VG content can be no more than 35-40%, and since Tribeca tastes so good, there must be a good reason why they keep VG levels below the 50% mark, especially that people love lots of vapor.
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As to creating a Tribeca clone using DRY4, the Acetyl Pyrazine is undoubtedly key, it's just really how much of it to put that I'm trying to home-in on. I find the AP is so strong that the slightest deviation by even just .25% makes a difference. The suggestions on the board are difficult to gauge because they are generally suggested in drops, the content of that can vary widely. My latest batch to fine tune is at .9%, still waiting for that one to steep.
Additionally, Tribeca has a somewhat distinct chocolatey bittersweet taste that hits at the back of the tongue at the tail end of inhale. God, I love that tail end taste! I have never experienced that in any RY4 I have tried, and besides the ever presence of AP, it's that tail-end taste that makes Tribeca really unique to the rest. I'm not surprised if Tribeca contains this due to Halo's obvious love for chocolatey liquids. It is only present in a well-steeped Tribeca and not detectable at all if understeeped. A DRY-4 + AP mix will not have this quality either, steeped or not, and I wonder what that exact "chocolate" or "cocoa" flavoring could be.
Additionally, Tribeca has a somewhat distinct chocolatey bittersweet taste that hits at the back of the tongue at the tail end of inhale. God, I love that tail end taste! I have never experienced that in any RY4 I have tried, and besides the ever presence of AP, it's that tail-end taste that makes Tribeca really unique to the rest. I'm not surprised if Tribeca contains this due to Halo's obvious love for chocolatey liquids. It is only present in a well-steeped Tribeca and not detectable at all if understeeped. A DRY-4 + AP mix will not have this quality either, steeped or not, and I wonder what that exact "chocolate" or "cocoa" flavoring could be.
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I, too, vape low pg juice and many I can't try because of high pg. From what I understand, Halo juices are something like 90%pg or more. They will not disclose their ratios (I asked), but although I tried their juice as some of my first juice when I started vaping and I really like several, I can not vape them because of the high pg.
Interesting about adding Acetyl Pyrizine to making a Tribeca replicate. AP's most common use in vaping is to add a "dough-like" consistency, as in breads, cakes, strudels, sticky buns, etc. I'm not disagreeing, just noting that it's an unusual application. I just added .8% Acetyl Pyrizine to 6mls of well-steeped DIY TFA RY4 Double at a 9% mix. 0.8% amounts to one drop of AP, which comes in a 5% dilution. Admittedly, my hybrid is fresh and not steeped, but it did seem to lean more in the direction of Tribeca than straight TFA Double.
As for the tail end bittersweet chocolate tone, I can't remember tasting that in Tribeca. Doesn't mean it's not there, of course, just that I've not picked up on it. Despite the fact that I'm vaping Tribeca right now as I write, I don't trust myself to judge because of the power of suggestion.
To see what would happen, I added one drop of TFA Bittersweet Chocolate Extra to the 6ml hybrid. Oh my. That one drop mucked up the flavor profile something fierce. Obviously, TFA Bittersweet Chocolate either isn't the right flavoring, or one drop was way too much and would require a more diluted application. I fear that my 6ml volunteer soldier just got his brains blown out. Oh well, I have lots more TFA RY4 Double. LOL.
Perhaps a very tiny bit of white chocolate flavoring would work better, since white chocolate is actually a twisty version of vanilla, and thus closer to a typical RY4 flavor profile. I don't know, though. I'm very suspicious of any type of chocolate in RY4.
Off-topic: In non-RY4 DIY news, I just whipped up a terrific tobacco hybrid blend, using 10% TFA Black Honey Tobacco, 7% Skydancer NET, and 2% Ramon Allones Celestial Cigar NET. Man, you talk about good! I don't have an all-day-vape. (For that matter, I don't even have a 10-minute-vape. LOL.) If I did, though, Black Honey Skydancer could be a contender.
Wow Bill, thanks for taking one for the team on that, I will be more than happy to send you a replacement bottle, as you can see I have plenty! I had some hopes with the Bittersweet Chocolate from TFA. In my inventory, the only flavoring I have that comes close is Double Chocolate (Dark) from TFA. I did mix 2.5% of it to a 5ml bottle of steeped 8% DRY4 + .9%AP yesterday, but haven't tried it just yet. After your post, now I'm afraid to, lol.
AP - the AP is, without a shadow of a doubt, a key component of Tribeca. The scent of AP on a fresh, unsteeped bottle is unmistakable and prominent, and so is the taste. After a good amount of steeping (about 2-3 weeks after bottle opening and occasionally allowing it to air out and mix), both the scent and taste of AP will blend into the background such as the bready/nutty effect is no longer so strong. I think the presence of AP is why some DIY vapers believe that Tribeca has some Graham Cracker in it... AP being a key component of Graham Cracker too.
Bittersweet Tail-end Taste - Tribeca was the very first juice I ever bought, the more I tried other Tobacco flavors, it was hard to find the matching the quality of Tribeca. Despite vaping it daily for several weeks, I had never noticed that bittersweet tail-end taste until I walked into a B&M store with a specific intent to line up 4, 5 or 6 other Halo Tobacco liquids and do a little vape-fest. I also knew that most probably the liquids in the store's trial tanks were already steeped. I chose Prime15, Torque56, Longhorn, Captain Jack and finally Tribeca. By contrasting to straight, dry tobaccos, this is when I first detected that Tribeca had somewhat of that "bittersweet chocolate," ever so slightly "toasted" caramel flavor at the end of a drag that, apart from the RY4 sweetness, distinguished this juice from the rest. The only other that comes close to it (in Halo's Tobacco lineup) would be Prime15, as that one does have a little bit of a dark-chocolatey/cocoa touch to it.
If RY4 characteristics are distinguished from other Tobaccos by the presence of Caramel and Vanilla, the presence of the AP and that bittersweet tail is what distinguishes Tribeca from other RY4's, imo.
AP - the AP is, without a shadow of a doubt, a key component of Tribeca. The scent of AP on a fresh, unsteeped bottle is unmistakable and prominent, and so is the taste. After a good amount of steeping (about 2-3 weeks after bottle opening and occasionally allowing it to air out and mix), both the scent and taste of AP will blend into the background such as the bready/nutty effect is no longer so strong. I think the presence of AP is why some DIY vapers believe that Tribeca has some Graham Cracker in it... AP being a key component of Graham Cracker too.
Bittersweet Tail-end Taste - Tribeca was the very first juice I ever bought, the more I tried other Tobacco flavors, it was hard to find the matching the quality of Tribeca. Despite vaping it daily for several weeks, I had never noticed that bittersweet tail-end taste until I walked into a B&M store with a specific intent to line up 4, 5 or 6 other Halo Tobacco liquids and do a little vape-fest. I also knew that most probably the liquids in the store's trial tanks were already steeped. I chose Prime15, Torque56, Longhorn, Captain Jack and finally Tribeca. By contrasting to straight, dry tobaccos, this is when I first detected that Tribeca had somewhat of that "bittersweet chocolate," ever so slightly "toasted" caramel flavor at the end of a drag that, apart from the RY4 sweetness, distinguished this juice from the rest. The only other that comes close to it (in Halo's Tobacco lineup) would be Prime15, as that one does have a little bit of a dark-chocolatey/cocoa touch to it.
If RY4 characteristics are distinguished from other Tobaccos by the presence of Caramel and Vanilla, the presence of the AP and that bittersweet tail is what distinguishes Tribeca from other RY4's, imo.
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90% PG, should be no wonder why they don't have thick vapor.
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No need for that. With 20mls remaining in my current 30ml bottle of RY4 Double flavoring, I have enough to make at least 150-200 mls more RY4 Double juice. And then it's only what---$7---to ante up for another bottle. Jeez, with two liters of retail RY4s and another liter of DIY RY4s (from pre-mixes or from scratch), I'll probably never need to buy any more RY4 Double.
Your posts alone are more than adequate compensation for any gonzo-experiments-gone-awry of mine. Anyway, experiments are fun even when they end up wonky. One of my better DIY juices was the unexpectedly tasty result of combining four failed experiments into a single bottle (Skydancer NET Blend V4), although most of my failures end up going down the drain eventually.
Speaking of Tribeca, it has been three months since passer got his bottle. It should be steeped enough to try now.
So passer, does it still taste like breakfast sausage?
So passer, does it still taste like breakfast sausage?
Here's some RY4 history courtesy of KentC (thank you sir!). I'm curious and excited to see how the old-school Janty RY4 compares to the Janty DK RY4 I have. Side-by-side testing shall commence shortly!
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