The right Reo batteries pays off...
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There may not be objective data; but me and anyone I've discussed it with who has vaped both sixteens and twenties agree; the 1600s kick like a mule through the mech voltage range, and the 2000s sag. (I usually give up on my 2000 at about 3.9 volts, and use the 1600s at least down to 3.8 before there is any discernible difference from 10 vapes off the charger)
You're absolutely right about the objective data part, I'm just relating my subjective observation. And I'd be VERY curious to hear what you have to say after you try the 1600's. I know we're all different in our perceptions and in what we enjoy. But I've seen the same observation over and over, I just decided to see for myself if there really was any difference. For me, at least, there's enough difference that my 2000's will be fine backups for power outages, but only after I've exhausted my 1600's.
On the same subject, I found this thread with a comparison chart between the AW IMR 1600 vs 2000 mAH.
And I go 16--we may vape differently.
Respectfully, show me the internal resistance measurements.
One associates internal resistance with how warm a battery gets (amperage draw) and how hard a battery kicks (which you, I gather, will be "measuring" soon)
You are right that there are no "charts for this data". I'm glad you're willing to try them.
That IS evidence of lower internal resistance in the 1600.
One associates internal resistance with how warm a battery gets (amperage draw) and how hard a battery kicks (which you, I gather, will be "measuring" soon)
You are right that there are no "charts for this data". I'm glad you're willing to try them.
I can do that... but I'll park a used 2000 and put time on a 1600 to make them comparable.
Respectfully, show me the internal resistance measurements.
I might have but I got rid of the one & only 2000 I bought for comparison. Before that all I ever used were 1600s from flashlights (2000s didn't exist back then) & will continue to use only 1600s.
Oh, well, if that kind of chart is what you meant, you can compare at varying amperage here . . . ..
Battery test-review 18650 comparator
Battery test-review 18650 comparator
Ok, sorry I about the 20 dollars thing. I meant to put in for 2 AW's I can get 4 Panies. I will try these Panies out and if I don't like them I might just use them in the silver bullet. The AW's I have in my mini 2.1 work great. I guess it will just be trial and error and see. I can always sell the Panies, I know they are well liked through out the PV community.
Thanks, pdib! That's all I asked for and it's convincing evidence. You can confirm or correct the numbers I gleaned from the charts, as well as my calculations.
After using 750 mAH from these batteries, battery voltages under load are as follows. Also shown is drop from 4.2V (unloaded voltage at usage times isn't given), and total load + battery resistance required to achieve that discharge rate was calculated from voltage / current. This represents what coil resistance + battery resistance would be for that voltage at that current.
2A discharge: Both at about 3.63V
(0.57V drop from 4.2V, virtually no difference)
Total Resistance (load + battery): 1.8Ω
3A discharge: 1600-3.60V 2000-3.59V
(1600-0.60V drop, 2000-0.61V drop = 0.01V difference)
Total Resistance (load + battery): 1600-1.2Ω 2000-1.2Ω
5A discharge: 1600-3.56V 2000-3.49V
(1600-0.64V drop, 2000-0.71V drop = 0.07V difference)
Total Resistance (load + battery): 1600-0.7Ω 2000-0.7Ω
7A discharge: 1600-3.52V 2000-3.40V
(1600-0.68V drop 2000-0.80V drop = 0.12V difference)
Total Resistance (load + battery): 1600-0.5Ω 2000-0.49Ω
The linked tool shows virtually no difference in power to coils from 1.2 - 1.8Ω at 750 mAH usage. With a 0.7Ω coil, the 1600 starts to pull away with almost a tenth of a volt less drop, and at 0.5Ωz it has a bit over a tenth of a volt less drop. Is that significant?
There are no "sags" throughout the discharge curves from 2A to 7A rates, rather the lines are virtually parallel until the 1600 nosedives, somewhere between 3.3 and 3.45 volts under load, significantly before the 2000.
As a final note, 3.0V (under load) with a 0.5Ω coil is 18 watts...3 more than a Provari's maximum.
Please correct me if I've misinterpreted the chart data or miscalculated.
After using 750 mAH from these batteries, battery voltages under load are as follows. Also shown is drop from 4.2V (unloaded voltage at usage times isn't given), and total load + battery resistance required to achieve that discharge rate was calculated from voltage / current. This represents what coil resistance + battery resistance would be for that voltage at that current.
2A discharge: Both at about 3.63V
(0.57V drop from 4.2V, virtually no difference)
Total Resistance (load + battery): 1.8Ω
3A discharge: 1600-3.60V 2000-3.59V
(1600-0.60V drop, 2000-0.61V drop = 0.01V difference)
Total Resistance (load + battery): 1600-1.2Ω 2000-1.2Ω
5A discharge: 1600-3.56V 2000-3.49V
(1600-0.64V drop, 2000-0.71V drop = 0.07V difference)
Total Resistance (load + battery): 1600-0.7Ω 2000-0.7Ω
7A discharge: 1600-3.52V 2000-3.40V
(1600-0.68V drop 2000-0.80V drop = 0.12V difference)
Total Resistance (load + battery): 1600-0.5Ω 2000-0.49Ω
The linked tool shows virtually no difference in power to coils from 1.2 - 1.8Ω at 750 mAH usage. With a 0.7Ω coil, the 1600 starts to pull away with almost a tenth of a volt less drop, and at 0.5Ωz it has a bit over a tenth of a volt less drop. Is that significant?
There are no "sags" throughout the discharge curves from 2A to 7A rates, rather the lines are virtually parallel until the 1600 nosedives, somewhere between 3.3 and 3.45 volts under load, significantly before the 2000.
As a final note, 3.0V (under load) with a 0.5Ω coil is 18 watts...3 more than a Provari's maximum.
Please correct me if I've misinterpreted the chart data or miscalculated.
Probably does not add to the discussion but my AW IMR 1600s will be 2 years old in three days. I have 3 in rotation and they are the only batteries I've used for the past two years with about 5 mls of juice each day. I've been charging them in a cheap Ultrafire wf-139 the whole time. They are still performing great.
Edit: I just remembered that for about 6 months I was using 18490s with a Kick.
Edit: I just remembered that for about 6 months I was using 18490s with a Kick.
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Add me to the camp that enjoys the REO + 1600 AW IMR combo much more than the AW IMR 2k's. I sense a noticeable difference even fresh off the charger.
The 2k's are good batteries... Just not "REO good"
The 2k's are good batteries... Just not "REO good"
I have a few AW IMR 18650, 1600, that are 2 1/6 years old. They are mixed in with others that have been bought during that time frame. I use them in rotation. Four go to work with me and are used in two Grands about 3 days a week. Those are changed daily so they are charged every other day. At home about 4 days a week I rotate through 6 more. Those get charged about once a week. I try to change the ones used for work and charged more often every week.
Through all of this I have not had one go bad. They all still charge fully and last the same as far as I can tell.
I have lots of batteries in other sizes of AW IMR also. They are the only batteries I will buy. I love that I can pick up a REO that has sat unused for a few days and depend on the battery working good.
good, then. As best as I can tell, this is an excellent example of "science" not reflecting reality. Another observation that I and others have made is that, tho the charts are helpful, they don't reflect reality. None of those tests are done with 5 second bursts discharging the battery. The difference in practice is substantial; impossible to miss, and easy to appreciate. Don't let the data occlude the obvious.
Until presented with evidence to the contrary, I'll just consider this debate as an emotional, faith-based "religious" issue, where 1600's are worshipped like highly compressed music cut into vinyl, and let it go at that. Friendships here mean more to me than being right. In fairness, I put some 1600s on order to see if I personally "feel" a difference.
Speaking of batteries, I have a minor issue with my mini and AW 14500's. Sometimes it won't fire. I slide open the door and push the battery all the way to the left so that it is touching the divider between the battery and the bottle. This will usually take care of the problem. Is this common with the mini and AW's? Like I said, it's a minor issue, but if anybody has any ideas why this is happening, let me know.
If your firing pin isn't misaligned, you might try just filing it and put a dab of noalox on it. My batteries don't move inside the mini at all.
You sure it is a Mini 14500? I ask because two people lately have used the 14500 in a 18490 Mini 2.0.
If it is a 14500 then I suggest you are mashing the button way to hard. That will put too much pressure on the battery and might make it slip. You can try a rubber band around the battery and see if that holds it more stable.
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