These people are going to kill themselves

[Bad Ninja]

Imagine a gun store where employees willingly build hot rounds for new customers who want more velocity out of their first gun... No way, its never going to happen.

Yet, there are tons of B&M's where teens with little to no skill are building sub ohm coils to other teens with little to no intelligence...And so it begins with the ambulance chasers... One lawsuit in a town, then 10 lawsuits in a city, then 100 lawsuits per state and so on until Congressman Ben and Senator Dover decide to really make a mess of things.

I don't think a B&M should be held responsible if a consumer incorrectly assembles a mechanical and fries their face, or burns down their house. Stuff happens, you cant protect imbeciles from themselves, but as a B&M store owner, the moment you assemble a device and sell it as so, its your head on the chopping block, imbecile customer or not.

Shenanigans!

THats just not true.
"TONS of B&Ms with TEENS wrapping sub ohm coils".

Really?
Last time I was in a B&M , they had a big sign "no minors".

They don't sell to teens much less hire them to wrap coils.
They would in fact be grown adults.
You are fear mongering and spreading misinformation.

This is exactly what in talking about
Do not buy into these shenanigans, instead grab a broom.

 

[TheReign]

Imagine a gun store where employees willingly build hot rounds for new customers who want more velocity out of their first gun... No way, its never going to happen.

Yet, there are tons of B&M's where teens with little to no skill are building sub ohm coils to other teens with little to no intelligence...And so it begins with the ambulance chasers... One lawsuit in a town, then 10 lawsuits in a city, then 100 lawsuits per state and so on until Congressman Ben and Senator Dover decide to really make a mess of things.

I don't think a B&M should be held responsible if a consumer incorrectly assembles a mechanical and fries their face, or burns down their house. Stuff happens, you cant protect imbeciles from themselves, but as a B&M store owner, the moment you assemble a device and sell it as so, its your head on the chopping block, imbecile customer or not.

Tell me not VPR, You know as well as I do get PLENTY LOLOS who would build subohm and blow themselves up. The B&M isn't responsible, It's the Poho dummies that do it without reading up or learning anything.

 

[TheReign]

Shenanigans!

THats just not true.
"TONS of B&Ms with TEENS wrapping sub ohm coils".

Really?
Last time I was in a B&M , they had a big sign "no minors".

They don't sell to teens much less hire them to wrap coils.
They would in fact be grown adults.
You are fear mongering and spreading misinformation.

This is exactly what in talking about
Do not buy into these shenanigans, instead grab a broom.

Relax bu. It's different in Hawaii, no need to get mad my brada. Regardless, it's not just the b&m it's outside the b&m. Im sure he meant teen as in 18 - 19 - 20. Not all of em are adults, Legally they are. But in reality they acting like teens. get some even older acting like kids.

 

[suspectK]

^I'll always be a kid.

-13

 

[Ed_C]

I give up. If some people can't recognize that waring a customer that there's safety issues with something, something that they may be completely unaware of, is not the same as taking responsibility for their actions, there's nothing else I can say.

 

[zoiDman]

Really?
Amazing.
I refuse to repeat myself again in this thread.
If you made it this far you can surely read.
What I am saying I have clearly already said.
...

I think you have made your Position on who bears the Responsibility in this case Very Clear.

No RBA comes with a .2 ohm coil new.
Most are not built or sporting a 1.0 or higher resistance coil.
You have to ask for it to be built sub ohm.
This places responsibility squarely on the buyer.

All I was Trying to Figure Out was do you have this same belief for Other Products and Retail B&M settings?

 

[HawaiiVPR]

Shenanigans!

THats just not true.
"TONS of B&Ms with TEENS wrapping sub ohm coils".

Really?
Last time I was in a B&M , they had a big sign "no minors".

They don't sell to teens much less hire them to wrap coils.
They would in fact be grown adults.
You are fear mongering and spreading misinformation.

This is exactly what in talking about
Do not buy into these shenanigans, instead grab a broom.

Here ya go, here are two "teens" working at a vape shop... 2 weeks experience and already building sub-ohm coils for customers. Be warned though, this vid will highly irritate you..

Basics of Rebuildables and Sub Ohm Vaping! | RDA's & Coil Winding for Beginners | IndoorSmokers - YouTube

 

[zoiDman]

Here ya go, here are two "teens" working at a vape shop... 2 weeks experience and already building sub-ohm coils for customers. Be warned though, this vid will highly irritate you..

Basics of Rebuildables and Sub Ohm Vaping! | RDA's & Coil Winding for Beginners | IndoorSmokers - YouTube

I think what BadNinja fails to Perceive is that what he sees in the B&M shops in His area May or May Not Be representative of what B&M Shops may be in Other Areas.

 

[A17kawboy]

I used to believe in "common sense". Not anymore. "Common sense" comes from experience. Usually a bad experience but with luck we live through the experience and proceed on with a little more knowledge. IMO these shops should be directing their clients to sources of information (like ECF) then the client can make their own decision. And build their own dam coils!

 

[Bad Ninja]

I think what BadNinja fails to Perceive is that what he sees in the B&M shops in His area May or May Not Be representative of what B&M Shops may be in Other Areas.

Will obviously ymmv when dealing with state law.
My bad, I would think that would be common knowledge, and wouldn't t need a disclaimer.


IMHO
A B&M owner must be insane to let a teenager work and place liability on their store.
You can't even hold a minor financially liable for intentional damage in most states.
Does his liability insurance provider know?
Most states won't allow it by law, due to nicotine and tobacco extracts.

These type shops are apparantly operating on the fringe of US law and I would run from any vape store employing minors to wrap coils.

 

[zoiDman]

Will obviously ymmv when dealing with state law.
My bad, I would think that would be common knowledge, and wouldn't t need a disclaimer.


IMHO
A B&M owner must be insane to let a teenager work and place liability on their store.
You can't even hold a minor financially liable for intentional damage in most states.
Does his liability insurance provider know?
Most states won't allow it by law, due to nicotine and tobacco extracts.

These type shops are apparantly operating on the fringe of US law and I would run from any vape store employing minors to wrap coils.

You might read up a little on the Concept of "Respondeat Superior”.

 

[Bad Ninja]

You might read up a little on the Concept of "Respondeat Superior”.

Did you read up first!
Respondeat Superior is one one reason Iwrote the post you just quoted.
Hiring a minor to wrap coils would pretty much guarantee the shop owner would be liable.
Only a mentally challenged shop owner would place themselves liable.

This is one of the rare situations where Respondeat Superior would apply.
However, Respondeat superior does not admonish liability in the event of negligence.

Again this has little to do with the OP.
Respondeat superior argues liability between shop owner and employee not contractor and paying client ordering cust work done to clients specifications.

 

[zoiDman]

Did you read up first!
Respondeat Superior is one one reason Iwrote the post you just quoted.
Hiring a minor to wrap coils would pretty much guarantee the shop owner would be liable.
Only a mentally challenged shop owner would place themselves liable.

...

I think what you are Failing to see is that in the Vast Majority of Situations, the Employer is going to Hold the Ultimate Liability regarding the Actions of His/Her Employees while in the Performance of the Job. Whether they are Minors or Not.

Not sure where "Contractors" came into this Discussion? Or even in what Context you are using the word "Contractors".

 

[Bad Ninja]

I think what you are Failing to see is that in the Vast Majority of Situations, the Employer is going to Hold the Ultimate Liability regarding the Actions of His/Her Employees while in the Performance of the Job. Whether they are Minors or Not.

Not sure where "Contractors" came into this Discussion? Or even in what Context you are using the word "Contractors".

You lost me.
This thread discusses the liability of the shop vs the customer.

The shop CAN onviously be liable for an employee, but it's not always true or applicable.
Having a minor child do electrical work for a paying customer in a vape shop is beyond stupid and asking for trouble.


In the context of the OP and my post that you quoted:
Client is the person asking for the custom sub ohm coil to be installed on their dripper
Contractor is the person getting paid to do the build.
These are legal terms that absolutely apply in this context.
You won't get far running through life like a bull in a china shop, expecting others to pay for your mess.

 

[zoiDman]

You lost me.
This thread discusses the liability of the shop vs the customer.

The shop CAN onviously be liable for an employee, but it's not always true or applicable.
Having a minor child do electrical work for a paying customer in a vape shop is beyond stupid and asking for trouble.


In the context of the OP and my post that you quoted:
Client is the person asking for the custom sub ohm coil to be installed on their dripper
Contractor is the person getting paid to do the build.
These are legal terms that absolutely apply in this context.
You won't get far running through life like a bull in a china shop, expecting others to pay for your mess.

Maybe the Confusion is coming from your Use of the term "Contractor".

There is a Legal/Liability Difference between a person who is Compensated for work done for a Company/Individual as "Contractor" verses an "Employee" of a Company/Individual.

Whereas it is Remotely Possible that the Person building a Coil for Customers at a B&M Shop is working in the Capacity of a Contractor, it would be Extremely Unlikely.

Just because you Build Something Doesn't make you a Contractor.

 

[Bad Ninja]

Maybe the Confusion is coming from your Use of the term "Contractor".

Just because you Build Something Doesn't make you a Contractor.

If ya get paid to build it, yes you are a contractor.
I used the word exactly as defined.
Especially accurate in a legal setting, as well as the context of my post.

Please google the vocabulary words that confuse you before correcting me.
It will save us both a lot of time

 

[zoiDman]

If ya get paid to build it, yes you are a contractor.
I used the word exactly as defined.
Especially accurate in a legal setting, as well as the context of my post.

Please google the vocabulary words that confuse you before correcting me.
It will save us both a lot of time

Whatever you Say BadNinja.

It's your World. I'm just Passing Thru It.

 

[Racehorse]

You lost me.

I think the point being made here, in essence, is that very few people support the concept of commerce without conscience.

For most, that is a simple concept to grasp. It's also what most people feel is ethically appealing.

Instead, we have spent pages upon pages splitting hairs.

 

[HawaiiVPR]

Well, wherever we strayed off to, I still stand firm that a vape store should never build coils for customers. Its like having a gun store giving every new customer a fully loaded firearm to take home.

Some people say its safer for a vape store to build an RDA for a new customer rather than that person going home and trying it themselves. I dunno, but I believe you have no business vaping sub ohm if you cant build, monitor and maintain it yourself, let alone understand what it is you are doing in the first place.

 

[Strangebrew]

I hit "Like" on this topic. Gives vaping a bad wrap to see an accident waiting to happen.